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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Difficulties with asking Ukrainian refugees to leave after 1+ year of hosting them

113 replies

uainuk · 24/06/2024 23:32

Hi all. I’m a mumsnet reader and I know how helpful and non-toxic this community is, so I decided to ask for a sanity check and advice on my situation. I’m Ukrainian myself, so it’s very difficult for me to be unbiased. And I don’t understand local mentality well enough yet. So your kind and weighted opinion will be very much appreciated. I also want to mention that not all Ukrainians are like the woman I describe in this post (or like me, of course). It’s just a one specific situation.

My boyfriend hosted a Ukrainian mum (50+) with a child (12+) more than a year ago, before we met. He had spare rooms and he’s a very nice and kind person, so it wasn’t a problem for him. He thought it will be a 6-month stay, but it already lasted much longer. In a couple of months after he hosted them we met and our relationship started developing. We decided to move in together a couple of months ago. Before I moved in he started having conversations with the woman he’s hosting about them moving on. She was looking for different excuses why she needs more time etc, but they finally agreed on the date. When the date was approaching she asked for more time and he let her stay longer. And now she’s running out of time again. And conversations become tougher.

She’s been here for more that 2 years living with different hosts, she still can’t speak English properly (because she’s not learning it, but chilling most of the time instead). She has 16 hours/week job and doesn’t want to work more hours on a low-paid job, because she believes she’s entitled to something better. She doesn’t want to rent privately, because she wants a council flat and she says she can’t afford private rent even though she gets Universal Credit and she can get housing benefits.

I’m also a Ukrainian and I ended up in the UK because of the war. I have a good job here and I never was on any kind of benefits, so I don’t know how the system works. But I used benefits calculator and I can see that she could afford renting privately. So I assume she just doesn’t want because she (probably) can’t save that much money if she rents privately compared to social housing. I worked my ass off for my entire life and keep doing that so I really can’t understand her.

My boyfriend wants them to move out, but he is not as direct and pushy as I am (he’s very English and I mean it in a very good way). I’m trying to be supportive, but I’m starting to freak out. The date is approaching and the situation becomes even more stressful for me and him. Even though we are trying to be a team, I think he feels more responsibility because he was hosting them before I moved in. And he’s trying to be nice to her which I believe she takes as a weakness. So the woman is trying to manipulate a lot and is saying how hard her life is and that she can’t move out because of ‘new reason every time’. And she’s trying to make him pay for her stuff, do jobs for her etc.

Am I being unreasonable? Am I being a bitch that wants a poor mum and a child to leave? I feel like I want to build my family and instead I’m having a constant stress on top of my work stress (I have a demanding and stressful job, which I love though and which is well-paid). I feel like he’s a bit too soft, kind and caring to a person that doesn’t deserve it. Do you have any advice on how my boyfriend and I could manage this situation more as a team and not ruin our relationship instead? Has anyone been in a similar situation with Ukrainians on homes for Ukraine scheme that don’t want to move out and how did you handle it?

OP posts:
ByCupidStunt · 24/06/2024 23:49

I think this is a common problem and it'll be interesting to see what responses you get.

Why do you want them to leave?

Mummy2024 · 24/06/2024 23:50

uainuk · 24/06/2024 23:32

Hi all. I’m a mumsnet reader and I know how helpful and non-toxic this community is, so I decided to ask for a sanity check and advice on my situation. I’m Ukrainian myself, so it’s very difficult for me to be unbiased. And I don’t understand local mentality well enough yet. So your kind and weighted opinion will be very much appreciated. I also want to mention that not all Ukrainians are like the woman I describe in this post (or like me, of course). It’s just a one specific situation.

My boyfriend hosted a Ukrainian mum (50+) with a child (12+) more than a year ago, before we met. He had spare rooms and he’s a very nice and kind person, so it wasn’t a problem for him. He thought it will be a 6-month stay, but it already lasted much longer. In a couple of months after he hosted them we met and our relationship started developing. We decided to move in together a couple of months ago. Before I moved in he started having conversations with the woman he’s hosting about them moving on. She was looking for different excuses why she needs more time etc, but they finally agreed on the date. When the date was approaching she asked for more time and he let her stay longer. And now she’s running out of time again. And conversations become tougher.

She’s been here for more that 2 years living with different hosts, she still can’t speak English properly (because she’s not learning it, but chilling most of the time instead). She has 16 hours/week job and doesn’t want to work more hours on a low-paid job, because she believes she’s entitled to something better. She doesn’t want to rent privately, because she wants a council flat and she says she can’t afford private rent even though she gets Universal Credit and she can get housing benefits.

I’m also a Ukrainian and I ended up in the UK because of the war. I have a good job here and I never was on any kind of benefits, so I don’t know how the system works. But I used benefits calculator and I can see that she could afford renting privately. So I assume she just doesn’t want because she (probably) can’t save that much money if she rents privately compared to social housing. I worked my ass off for my entire life and keep doing that so I really can’t understand her.

My boyfriend wants them to move out, but he is not as direct and pushy as I am (he’s very English and I mean it in a very good way). I’m trying to be supportive, but I’m starting to freak out. The date is approaching and the situation becomes even more stressful for me and him. Even though we are trying to be a team, I think he feels more responsibility because he was hosting them before I moved in. And he’s trying to be nice to her which I believe she takes as a weakness. So the woman is trying to manipulate a lot and is saying how hard her life is and that she can’t move out because of ‘new reason every time’. And she’s trying to make him pay for her stuff, do jobs for her etc.

Am I being unreasonable? Am I being a bitch that wants a poor mum and a child to leave? I feel like I want to build my family and instead I’m having a constant stress on top of my work stress (I have a demanding and stressful job, which I love though and which is well-paid). I feel like he’s a bit too soft, kind and caring to a person that doesn’t deserve it. Do you have any advice on how my boyfriend and I could manage this situation more as a team and not ruin our relationship instead? Has anyone been in a similar situation with Ukrainians on homes for Ukraine scheme that don’t want to move out and how did you handle it?

Tell him to throw her out.... not in a bad way, she will have to go to the council who will house her and she will get housed faster that way. Will still take years but she will get it faster than she will staying there. Explain that and say I'm sorry but the date is the date, not changing.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:07

ByCupidStunt · 24/06/2024 23:49

I think this is a common problem and it'll be interesting to see what responses you get.

Why do you want them to leave?

That's a very good question. When I think about it from a selfish perspective, because I want to live with my boyfriend together, not with random people in the house. When I think about it from a rational perspective, because I think people should use Homes for Ukraine scheme to get on their feet and not to have free accommodation forever. We all should take care of ourselves. All people can go through difficult times and we need support through those times. Ukrainians need it because there’s a war in our country and lots of us just can’t live there at the moment. But it should not become an excuse to having an easy life on someone else’s expense. And that’s how this situation looks to me. I might be wrong though, that’s why I’m asking people here.

OP posts:
trekking1 · 25/06/2024 00:11

To put it bluntly, your bf needs to stop being a doormat and telling them they need to leave. He should also let the council know.

There is no "how can we as a team" because it is his house and he should take care of it. If you go into this mode of thinking he is just too nice and you need to push him, you will create a dynamic between you two that is more like mother-son than a couple. I have seen this time and time again.

The council will place them somewhere, they will not be on the street. He just needs to grow a pair and get it done.

Fluffyhoglets · 25/06/2024 00:12

She's entitled to support from the council as a homeless person. He needs to be firm with her and who ever his contact is at the local authority dealing with the homes for Ukraine scheme, that she needs to leave on a certain day.
Do not let the council talk him into her staying longer.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:15

Mummy2024 · 24/06/2024 23:50

Tell him to throw her out.... not in a bad way, she will have to go to the council who will house her and she will get housed faster that way. Will still take years but she will get it faster than she will staying there. Explain that and say I'm sorry but the date is the date, not changing.

”Throw her out” sounds harsh even for me (and I’m not a softie by any means). But I agree with the rest. They will get temporary housing if they become ‘homeless’. That’s the main concern for my boyfriend, because we don’t know how bad it is and there’s a child there (teenager). But they would be prioritized for social housing and that’s what she wants. She says Ukrainians are prioritized for social housing (which I don’t think is fair if it’s true), but she’s been waiting for 9 months already and still didn’t get it. She’s very picky about the location and condition of social housing though. Apparently she wants something similar to where she lives now which will never happen.

OP posts:
QuestionableMouse · 25/06/2024 00:17

Mummy2024 · 24/06/2024 23:50

Tell him to throw her out.... not in a bad way, she will have to go to the council who will house her and she will get housed faster that way. Will still take years but she will get it faster than she will staying there. Explain that and say I'm sorry but the date is the date, not changing.

Please don't quote the entire long post. It's a pita to get past!

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:21

trekking1 · 25/06/2024 00:11

To put it bluntly, your bf needs to stop being a doormat and telling them they need to leave. He should also let the council know.

There is no "how can we as a team" because it is his house and he should take care of it. If you go into this mode of thinking he is just too nice and you need to push him, you will create a dynamic between you two that is more like mother-son than a couple. I have seen this time and time again.

The council will place them somewhere, they will not be on the street. He just needs to grow a pair and get it done.

Thank you for your comment. He let the council know, but he’s trying to end it on good terms and dealing with her is really difficult for him emotionally (I can understand him, she’s really very manipulative). I agree about the mother-son dynamic. That’s something that probably made me so worried today that I wrote this post. I feel like it’s going in a wrong direction between two of us.

OP posts:
uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:29

Fluffyhoglets · 25/06/2024 00:12

She's entitled to support from the council as a homeless person. He needs to be firm with her and who ever his contact is at the local authority dealing with the homes for Ukraine scheme, that she needs to leave on a certain day.
Do not let the council talk him into her staying longer.

Yes, thanks for your comment, I agree. Council is very supportive from what he says. It’s more about him being firm as you say. He’s doing his best, but it’s really difficult. Imaging having a woman and a child in your house for almost year and a half and now going through all this drama. I would be ok probably, but I understand his struggle. I respect it, but it’s a struggle for me as well.

OP posts:
greenpolarbear · 25/06/2024 00:30

What are you doing at the moment, privately renting? Will you be paying the same to live with your boyfriend? Will he be claiming money for you under the homes for Ukraine scheme? If not presumably it's going to be a hit to his income unless you're planning to make up the shortfall.

Ukrainians aren't prioritised for social housing.

I hosted a Ukrainian refugee for a year and kicking her out would never have crossed my mind.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:44

greenpolarbear · 25/06/2024 00:30

What are you doing at the moment, privately renting? Will you be paying the same to live with your boyfriend? Will he be claiming money for you under the homes for Ukraine scheme? If not presumably it's going to be a hit to his income unless you're planning to make up the shortfall.

Ukrainians aren't prioritised for social housing.

I hosted a Ukrainian refugee for a year and kicking her out would never have crossed my mind.

Edited

I’m privately renting, I’m not claiming any money from the UK government and I’m a net contributor. I pay for a couple of people on benefits at least from my taxes (and it’s ok). He will not be claiming any money for me and I will be contributing to the household as any other partner would do. Neither he or I are worried about the hit to our income. And that was never a reason to host a Ukrainian family for him.

Thank you for hosting a Ukrainian. How did it go for you?

OP posts:
Fluffyhoglets · 25/06/2024 00:45

They are eligible for support as homeless and as she has a child they will need to be housed while homeless. She will then get some priority for social housing but may also be found a private rent by the council - which she will have to accept if the council consider its affordable.

Mummy2024 · 25/06/2024 00:52

greenpolarbear · 25/06/2024 00:30

What are you doing at the moment, privately renting? Will you be paying the same to live with your boyfriend? Will he be claiming money for you under the homes for Ukraine scheme? If not presumably it's going to be a hit to his income unless you're planning to make up the shortfall.

Ukrainians aren't prioritised for social housing.

I hosted a Ukrainian refugee for a year and kicking her out would never have crossed my mind.

Edited

A year.... so she didn't over stay her welcome then.... A year is more than enough to find a job and a home of your own. It's already been 18 months and she still wants to stay.... council lists are 10 years long. Ukrainians are not prioritised no but homeless people are....

greenpolarbear · 25/06/2024 00:52

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:44

I’m privately renting, I’m not claiming any money from the UK government and I’m a net contributor. I pay for a couple of people on benefits at least from my taxes (and it’s ok). He will not be claiming any money for me and I will be contributing to the household as any other partner would do. Neither he or I are worried about the hit to our income. And that was never a reason to host a Ukrainian family for him.

Thank you for hosting a Ukrainian. How did it go for you?

Edited

It went really well, she is similar to you maybe. Learned English very quickly, even started helping Polish people learn English at the community centre, got a full time job where she got up at 4am every day to work shifts. Did lots to help us out around the house even though we didn't ask her for anything.

But emotionally, very challenging. Trying to plan things to take her mind off things (eg Ukrainian orchestral concerts in our city), seeing her happy for fleeting moments and then seeing her feeling guilty about feeling happy for a second. It was complex.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 00:52

Fluffyhoglets · 25/06/2024 00:45

They are eligible for support as homeless and as she has a child they will need to be housed while homeless. She will then get some priority for social housing but may also be found a private rent by the council - which she will have to accept if the council consider its affordable.

Thank you. Do you know by any chance how good/bad this housing for homeless with children is? I believe it’s a serious concern in our case. And she could use that to stay in my boyfriend’s house. I don’t expect it to be nice, but is it really dodgy?

OP posts:
popcornalto · 25/06/2024 00:53

You are dealing with a difficult person. If you kick her out, she might well make your life hell.

Can your boyfriend end the lease on his property and tell her landlord is taking back the property, so you all have to leave.

and he and you look for a new place.

Mummy2024 · 25/06/2024 00:56

popcornalto · 25/06/2024 00:53

You are dealing with a difficult person. If you kick her out, she might well make your life hell.

Can your boyfriend end the lease on his property and tell her landlord is taking back the property, so you all have to leave.

and he and you look for a new place.

I think that's abit of a stretch, make their lives hell. She at the moment is looking for the easiest option doesn't mean she's a bad person either. She's probably worried about not being able to survive financially if some help could be found to put these fears to rest that would help I think.

RawBloomers · 25/06/2024 01:01

I don’t think you and your boyfriend should be managing this. It’s your boy friend’s issue and he should be deciding what to do. Your and your boyfriend’s ideas of what the housing scheme should be used for and what that means in practice may be different and since it’s your boy friend that’s hosting, it’s his values that should prevail.

You want this woman to move out so you can live with your boyfriend without her around. that’s a bit of a biased position to be deciding whether she’s pulling her weight or not. I would tend to see things like you do, and would even go so far as to say that being too easy on someone in that sort of situation is not good for them - they’ll do far better well for themselves if they get on with learning English/getting a full time job even on minimum wage/etc. But your boy friend doesn’t have to have the same values, and it seems he doesn’t. Just because your his girlfriend doesn’t mean he should act like you would.

So you can give him the information on what’s available to her from other sources or what would happen if he does “throw her out”. It’s also reasonable to give him an ultimatum, if this is a line in the sand for you, for what you’re prepared to do in terms of your relationship if he isn’t prepared to commit to living with you on terms that are acceptable to you. But it really isn’t your place to make this decision or push him into it. It’s his house and if he would rather house this woman and her child for longer rather than force her into doing stuff she doesn’t want to, you really should respect that and let him come to the end of his patience in his own time.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 01:08

greenpolarbear · 25/06/2024 00:52

It went really well, she is similar to you maybe. Learned English very quickly, even started helping Polish people learn English at the community centre, got a full time job where she got up at 4am every day to work shifts. Did lots to help us out around the house even though we didn't ask her for anything.

But emotionally, very challenging. Trying to plan things to take her mind off things (eg Ukrainian orchestral concerts in our city), seeing her happy for fleeting moments and then seeing her feeling guilty about feeling happy for a second. It was complex.

Edited

Thank you for sharing this. It makes me very proud of my fellow Ukrainians. I know I’m in a very privileged position, I’ve been working for UK/US companies long before the war started. I’m very happy for those of us who can and want to adapt fast and work hard. And I’m very grateful to people who help them.

I can definitely relate to what you are describing as ‘take her mind off things’. It’s very nice of you and it’s very helpful. I remember myself just drowning in news from home. I used every free moment from work to read them and I was falling asleep and waking up with the phone in my hand. And I very much understand guilt for being (even trying to be) happy. What you did is an amazing gesture of support, care and generosity. I know people who do that are not doing it to hear this. But I believe it’s important to say how valuable it is. I don’t know where I would be without the support of my colleagues and friends from around the world.

At the same time, I can easily imagine how challenging it was for you. It’s like it’s not your pain and yours at the same time.

OP posts:
GreenTeaLikesMe · 25/06/2024 01:14

Use "can't/unable to/time is finished" language.

"I've been talking to the local government department that is responsible for Ukrainian refugees' affairs, and the time limit for your staying here will come to an end soon."
"We're unable to host after XXX"
"I'd love to help you more, but we cannot help any more after XXX."

Just make it sound like a fait accompli that the Powers That Be have effectively decided.

uainuk · 25/06/2024 01:16

popcornalto · 25/06/2024 00:53

You are dealing with a difficult person. If you kick her out, she might well make your life hell.

Can your boyfriend end the lease on his property and tell her landlord is taking back the property, so you all have to leave.

and he and you look for a new place.

That would be great, but we live in the house he owns. My friends were joking that he should say he’s selling the house, but it doesn’t happen quick in the UK and we really love the house :(

OP posts:
uainuk · 25/06/2024 01:25

Mummy2024 · 25/06/2024 00:56

I think that's abit of a stretch, make their lives hell. She at the moment is looking for the easiest option doesn't mean she's a bad person either. She's probably worried about not being able to survive financially if some help could be found to put these fears to rest that would help I think.

That’s a good point, thank you. She is a very difficult person that is trying to find the best option for her even if that’s on other people’s expense, which doesn’t make her a bad person, I agree. I believe she’s rather a bit cynical opportunist. On the other hand, when my boyfriend offered her to help with the rent for the first year (50%) if she rents privately, she refused. It was almost half a year ago when they first had conversation about them moving out. She said she wants a council flat and she doesn’t want to rent privately. Because his help will last only for a year and the council flat will be cheap forever.

OP posts:
IdisagreeMrHochhauser · 25/06/2024 01:28

There are various Facebook groups for hosting Ukrainian refugees. I see people posting in my local one asking if anyone is willing to take on people who need to leave their current hosts. Would that be an option to try to find a new place that way?

Mmhmmn · 25/06/2024 01:34

If you find it easier to be more direct it might help for you to just be there more and keep having conversations with her about what you have done in terms of work. It’s difficult to claim you can’t do something if someone who has been in a previously similar situation has already done it (or probate renting, work hours etc).

Mmhmmn · 25/06/2024 01:38

He needs to be very careful about the help he offers. Offering to cover half a private rent for a year?! - just as well she refused!

What a difficult situation. But you can be too generous, as he is finding out…

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