To think Jewish people are the scapegoats of humanity?

[FactsNotFictionOnly]

I have not posted on the CITME board as although the current conflict is relevant, that is not the main point of this thread.

I do not mean to cause any offence to Jewish people. In fact the opposite.

IF THIS POST IS DELETED BECAUSE IT OFFENDS NON JEWISH PEOPLE, THEN PLEASE RESPOND WITH WHY YOU FIND IT OFFENSIVE BEFORE REPORTING.

I am an atheist and think all religion should be consigned to history books so have no affiliation with any faith but I found the reaction to Oct 7th shocking with almost immediate protests against Israel (the victim) in favour of the ‘freedom fighters’ (the agressors). The denials that atrocities happened, the antisemitism, horrifying comments on SM which are still allowed to stand to this day.

Never before in my life (and I’m getting on a bit) have I seen that reaction of hatred to any country that has been the victim of any kind of terrorist attack or act of war anywhere in the world. Never before have I been aware of the kind of atrocities committed in Israel on such a large scale by a neighbouring country, filmed by the perpetrators, either.

I had heard comments made about ‘the Jews’ at various stages in my life, how they run the world, the banks, the media etc but never really thought much about it or believed it.

I noticed an absolutely blatant lie that popped up on SM yesterday with thousands of comments agreeing with the poster so I responded (never normally do) saying so with evidence and the abuse I got was unbelievable.

That made me do a bit more research on the persecution of Jewish people through history and I was pretty shocked that they were blamed for the death of Jesus, murdering Christian children as sacrifices to be baked into flatbreads, the Black Death, World War 1, 9/11, Covid. All totally false and a lot of the time because it was a way of debtors not paying money they owed to the Jewish people who were the world’s money lenders as it was prohibited in Christianity and Islam and Jewish people were prohibited from other work.

Each time they were blamed for something whole communities were burned to death or had to flee. They were banished from England in the 12th century as well as lots of other European countries. Now I understand why there is so much hatred from the UK and Europeans as these ‘legends’ persist.

Of course in the Middle East from 586 BC they were persecuted where they were killed, forced to convert to Christianity (or pretend to to stay alive) before Islam took over, treated as 2nd class citizens, subject to high taxes and strict rules, regular pogroms and were also forced to leave their homes in their hundreds of thousands.

This was all before a return to Israel was even a thing so there was no ‘Zionism’ then which is currently the excuse for the widespread hatred of Jewish people.

Even before this current conflict there seems to have been a deliberate misunderstanding of the situation in the Middle East with a lot of relevant history missed out out.

Such as the Ottoman Empire ruled the area directly before the Mandate of Palestine and they referred to it as Southern Syria. There were no Palestinians only Arabs. Why didn’t they ‘freedom fight’ the Ottomans for their own State as surely they were occupied under the Ottomans too if they believe the land is all theirs?

I have never seen references to Palestinians being ‘occupied’ by the British either. Weird as they believe the land is theirs and always was theirs - from the River to the Sea.

Why do a lot of people ignore the constant terrorist attacks as the reason why not only Israel, but Egypt too, had to blockade Gaza after a terrorist group with a known mandate to annihilate Israel and kill Jews was elected to govern it by it’s citizens?

Why are people not understanding that this war is not a ‘normal’ war with normal rules of engagement between two uniformed military forces where civilians are afforded protection by their government, military hardware, munitions and bases are placed outside of civilian areas and civilians including children are not involved in military action by firing rockets, RPGs, shootings, stabbings, throwing IEDs, holding hostages in their homes and taking part in barbaric murders, rapes, burning people including children alive and taking hostages?

It is absolutely horrific that civilians have been killed in such a high number or at all but a lot of the deaths can be explained as above and are all due to the war Hamas started.

Why are Hamas not being publicly pressured by Palestinian protestors to give themselves up?

The only (and tiny) Jewish State in the world is now even being persecuted for defending itself against massive neighbouring states who want to wipe it out.

Has there ever been such a forensic examination of any other war while in progress as in this one?

The propaganda and false information circulating before and during this conflict has made it all too clear to see how the Holocaust happened and it’s terrifying to see. I used to watch films on the subject and wonder how could so many people have stood by and let it happen. Now we can all see how.

How can a tiny race of 1% of the population who have achieved more than any other race alive today, be so hated.

Is it jealousy of their success or the hundreds of years of lies that have been brainwashed down generations?

AIBU?

https://www.historytoday.com/archive/why-were-jews-persecuted

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jews

*who have achieved more than any other race alive today; *the irony of how you speak is staggering OP.

Elaborate?

Very disingenuous to make comments like that without explaining what you mean.

Ditto with the comments from other posters about ‘inaccuracies’ without stating what they are.

Have I said the persecution of Jews has stopped? I don’t think I have.

I think Hamas is a very good example in fact that it hasn’t stopped and that some people do see Jews and Israel as the same and would happily execute people (children included) for being Jewish.

I have said that EU governments would likely step in a lot stronger right now had the holocaust not happened. Which is very different to saying that persecution has stopped thanks to the holocaust. And I strongly believe that.

The same way I believe a lot of people refuse to condemn the actions of Israel in fear of being perceived as or taking the risk to encourage an antisemite sentiment.

Because I strongly believe that most people with half a heart and conscience would condemn any government who takes actions that leads to the death, exodus and starvation of civilians including and especially of children irrelevant of the backstory.

There is no good reason not to condemn the actions of Israel right now. And it’s very different from wishing bad things upon Jewish people or tolerating the terrorist attack that happened to the Israeli population. Anyone who is impartial could understand that two wrongs don’t make a right and that Jewish past (and current) suffering doesn’t give them the right to cause similar suffering and devastation upon other folks who too have nothing to do with the conflict. The same way Jewish folks didn’t pick their faith and the struggle that unfortunately as come with it nor should be associated at large with the current Israeli government and their decisions/actions, people from Gaza didn’t pick to be born there and shouldn’t have to pay the price of a terrorist organization most didn’t even put in power.

I see that as soon as you speak out about what the Israeli government are doing to the Palestinians the comment gets deleted.
I guess freedom of speech is only when it fits the narrative.

Your posts were antisemitic.

hattie43

I've never understood the historical hatred of Jewish people , they don't go courting for violence with neighbours.”

Do you deny the illegal settlements?

I think it was probably your hate speech and personal attacks that got your comments deleted to be honest.

Nope. Loads of people manage to speak out against the Israeli government and not get deleted

Yup, including Zionist Jews! We do it all the time without turning to anti-Semitism. It's honestly not very difficult.

This makes my blood boil.

The persecution of the Palestinians is the work of the Israeli government. NOT the Jews. Not all Jews are Israeli.

I feel this strongly too. And right now I hate the conflation of Jews and Israel, and even Israel and Zionism.
I feel everyone should be made to read The Escape Artist, or any of the multiple stories on the horrors perpetrated against the Jews in WWll. Just as a starter…

I'm discussing my experiences as an Irish (non Jewish) person. Israel is often criticized but Jewish people are not

Thats your experience based on a few people who aren’t Jewish. Swap places with my family or a ton of other Jewish people in the UK for a few weeks, and youll be quickly disabused of what you and the people you talk to about this, think about us.

I can discuss prejudice against black people, Muslim people, or any other ethnic minority group. I wouldn’t do that though as it is for them to describe their experience, not for me. I have my opinions. These are very likely to be wrong though.

Thank you op for such a well informed and accurate post.

Antisemitism was increasing a lot BEFORE 7th October 2023 as the Times article I linked to shows.

But it exploded dramatically after 7th October 2023. And it's definitely not a figment of people's imaginations either.

There is also a very clear OVERLAP between Antisemitism and Anti-Zionism too. Despite the denials from some, they cannot be neatly separated from each other.

The Time article also talks about how Antisemitism is more able to reinvent itself in a way, say, racism cannot. That's why it keeps recurring and Jewish people have been used as a scapegoat. They were blamed simultaneously for capitalism and communism in the 20th Century, for example.

Even smart, intelligent people can have a prejudice that leads them right into Antisemitism. Some might want to tell themselves that's unlikely, but it does happen more often than you might think.

Jewish government

Women are the main scapegoats of the humanity.. always women

@StepUpSlowly my point was just that in the years immediately following the Holocaust, the persecution of Jewish people continued. It just moved slightly further to the east where it already existed for centuries and then just got worse until the vast majority of Jewish people felt they had no options but to leave. I was merely clarifying that the "shame" didn't stop anti-Semitism from continuing even in the latter part of the 1940s. That is all.

I tried reporting that comment but it's apparently not considered anti-Semitic enough to be deleted 🤷🏻‍♀️

The IDF recently tied a Palestinian man to a jeep. Absolute sickos. Stop hiding behind history.

Females, the world over are the scapegoat of humanity. As they are all over this conflict on both sides. A close second are gay people and 'immigrants'.

Just wondering what this has to do with anti-Semitism?

It's always very difficult for prejudiced people to avoid being Antisemitic, unfortunately.

I have jewish ancestry - I think it is true that Jewish people have always been persecuted and I think anti-semitism has increased. In the same, vein, I don't condone that actions of the Israel government.