to be cross my ds has measles because other parents didn't vaccinate their children

[snickersnack]

He's 11 months old, poor little thing . Fortunately he's going to be ok - he got off quite lightly, I think - but it was scary and he was really poorly for a day or so. Spent 10 hours in A&E yesterday while he had chest x-rays, blood tests, IV fluids etc. Now we're just waiting to see if his sister,who's 2, gets it - she's had one dose of MMR already so fingers crossed she's immune.

We live in an area where immunisation rates are among the lowest in the country. Now I have to go and tell all parents of the other babies he's met recently that their children might be at risk as well...

Obv don't say if don't want to. Was jsut curious because of the child who had toxo.

I'm in the West Country

Are all the children who have had teh single jabs counted when the Govt do the stats

AFAIK they don't so I don't think the percentage figures are true....

YANBU. I agree with what elkat says - I believe there's a social responsibility involved to protect the tinies and the children who have compromised immune systems and can't have immunisations.

It also strikes me that people who choose not to immunise their children are relying on those of us who do to protect their children from illness, and I mean some of the things like diphtheria which were rampant in the past and have now been pretty much eradicated due to immunisation. I wonder if they would be so happy to go back to a time when child mortality was so much higher because of the lack of mass immunisation?

YABU.its got nothing to do with you whether other parents have their children vaccinated or not.

my ds2 has hearing problems as a result of his MMR.

not sure they'd recognise singles, tbh, FAQ.

i'd never heard of them before i came here.

they have been using MMR for nearly 40 years - i got it myself at 13 months 36 years ago.

yet the increase in autism came far later than the introduction of the MMR to the CDC schedule of childhood immunizations.

but they were among the first to twig that the increase in autism may be due to the mercury in the DPT jabs - and pulled them off the market there llllooooonnnggg before the UK did. australia, too.

but Nanny - the MMR isn't usually offered until at least 13 months (think it's now later in our area because of the new Meningitis(?) one.

So those children are still going to be "at risk" of passing on measles, mumps or rubella until they reach the age when they are vaccinated (and then we presume that it actually works for them.......there's a reason the pre-school booster is offered, and even then some children still aren't immune!).

Just wondering if that child you mentioned is my daughter now.

My DD1 hasn't had MMR as she had two bad reactions to DTP and the doctor is afraid to jab her again. I am totally against mandatory vaccination for school/creche entry.

My ds didnt have his vaccinations because he had bad fits when he was three weeks old and the doctors couldnt gurantte that he wouldnt fit again if he had his MMR....

Yanbu - so sorry to hear of ds's illness. "Getting off lightly" but yet spending 10 hours in A&E yesterday. Ya definitely nbu, imo.

Where I live there are posters on every chemist doorway saying "measles is back" - do we want measles back for most of the population?

It is NOT a mild childhood illness like chickenpox, is it?

I asked the paediatrician about overall
immunisation rates for measles (from MMR and single vaccine measles) and she said she didn't think it was high enough for herd immunity in our area (SW London) and she's worried about an imminent epidemic. So I wasn't really wanting to start an MMR versus single vaccine argument - I couldn't care less what people choose to do as long as they opt for one or the other but a vaccinate or not vaccinate argument.

The MMR doesn't confer complete immunity - around 90% after the first dose, I believe. But that's enough to stop epidemics, as I understand it. SO you will get isolated cases, and unimmunised children may get infected as a result, but you won't get an epidemic.

I do agree with everyone who said that it's not just about making a decision on behalf of your child. I do think there is some kind of moral imperative to consider other children as well. Just as I didn't drive ridiculously fast to get him to the hospital when he was struggling to breathe yesterday in case I knocked down someone else..

And I'm still breastfeeding him...so that theory hasn't worked in our case.

And that is fair enough BC, not all children can have the MMR because of allergy, other conditions etc but if the rest of us had the jabs then their would be herd imunity and hopefully children like your DD would not be at risk.

Snickersnack, sorry your DS had to go through that and glad he is ok now.

Does anyone know the success rate of Vaccines for measles. I had a feeling it was very low anyway.

Greensleeves, I'm with you on the dog shit thing.

diptheria etc rates were already dropping before the introduction of vaccinations.

As someone who gives childhood immunisations the information we recieved last month stated that 70% of children have now opted not to recieve MMR. I think its such a shame to expose your child to the real threat that is measles rather than the unproven threat of autism. I think it will be years before statistics show the true result of not vaccinating but I do appreciate the fear some parents have.

No, the child I referred to is a boy

Awful about your dd though, I am sorry to hear that

Not wishing to derail the debate but I wasn't being facetious with my post about toxo, it really makes my blood boil. Particularly when some of the people being high-handed and obtuse about the reasons for some parents not taking up vaccines are quite happily smearing lethal dog shit all over the pavements my children walk to school on

FAQ

Agree that there is an element of choice, but also agree with nanny that the vaccine schedule should be followed in a timely manner and that nurseries should have this information, maybe as an admissions criteria, unless medical reasons etc. I'd feel more comfortable sending MY less that 13 month old to his nursery if I knew the older children he mixed with were vaccinated and therefore risks were reduced.

If people are incapable of keeping their children home when they have upset stomachs, what makes you think they keep them home when they have suspicious looking spots on their torsos?

ds1 hasn't had his MMR 'booster' either - but we did have his immunity tested and would have had a single measles booster done if he had turned out to be non-immune.

snickersnack - I'm very sorry your poor little lad is ill and hope he mends soon. I do tend, though, to consider that people who do not vaccinate (either blanket or selectively) have good reasons for their decision and have thought about it carefully.

I think there is an MNer whose ds caught rubella from a vaccinated child. The mumps component of my own ds1's MMR didn't work. Vaccination is not 100%.

Look at what has happened to the US vaccine schedule with mandatory vaccinations. Pharma companies lobby to get every new vaccine made mandatory so that they have a sure market. Gardasil the HPV vaccine is a good example of this. US kids get a scary number of vaccines in order to be able to enter school, is this really what we would like to see in the UK?

that's why they booster, though, berolina.

Greensleeves, I couldn't agree with you more on the dogshit point. It is filthy and disgusting and rates of people cleaning up after their dogs round our way are about the same as people vaccinating their kids against measles. Can I be cross now about the measles thing?

I didn't think you were GS

Obviously I feel the same as you.