To feel broken by 12 year old DD and to ask for help

[Edenspirits73]

Year 7, 12 year old DD is pushing every boundary and I am struggling to manage it all. It feels relentless and she won’t listen to anything we say. On Friday we had a call from the school to say she had been in pastoral talking about self harming which was like a bolt from the blue- I didn’t handle it very well as I got really upset when she got home as it felt like i don’t know my child anymore.

She started her periods right at the start of year 7 and it’s felt like since then it’s been an out of control battle as she is desperate to push every boundary. She started bunking lessons quite early on, is quite wild in school and doesn’t take it seriously. She wants to do stuff after school every day that feels too grown up (we live in a small city) and it’s all about being out and about. She’s only interested in her phone, wants to be in her room on her own constantly, Won’t do school work, won’t do any activity that she used to do. She talks about wanting to vape, wanting to try weed. She’s 12 FFS.

We grounded her and took her phone after she got into trouble in school for a weekend and that made no difference- she just doesn’t care. She speaks to me like I am an idiot and just doesn’t respect any boundaries. She feels out of control and it’s come from nowhere. She doesn’t care about school at all.

i just don’t know what to do - I feel broken and a failure. My 16 year old DS is just coming to the end of GCSEs and it’s put a strain on him too. He’s been the total
opposite. We are going on a family trip in a few weeks on Europe to celebrate the end of exams and I am dreading it as DD is just so horrible to us all. My DH is at the end of his rope too.

I am trying to get her a counsellor for the
self harm - that has come out of the blue also and she has said we aren’t allowed to talk to her about it. I am scared to do anything - we are just trying to understand what is happening to my lovely child.

She told me yesterday that one of her friends parents doesn’t believe in punishment and that we are awful parents for grounding her but we were just trying to put some boundaries in place. I have been trying to have rules around phone use but she kicks off about that too- my rule is no phones in bedrooms after 9pm- I just want her to have a break and have proper rest.

I feel broken - she knows she is loved- we tell her all the time that we are here for her no matter what etc. Nothing seems to make a difference.

It’s affecting my mental health - I am so worried all the time and I am not enjoying life as I am in a constant state of anxiety about what will happen next. It’s making me ill. I feel like crying all the time. I know it sounds ridiculous but I sometimes feel bullied by DD.

Aibu to ask for some advice - I feel lost. I have emailed a counsellor for DD so hoping that will help.

Self harm is very common amongs ND.

As is ND girls struggling in Y7. ( bitter experience)

Id be looking at ADHD and possible PDA.

I agree with @Zanatdy …goodbye phone. It won’t be easy but it needs to go.

Came on to suggest PMDD and see that it has already been posted. I had PMDD from my teens, so 50 years ago when I’m sure it had never even been thought of! I was an awful teenager and absolutely would not accept the same behaviour from my DD. Track her cycles and note there are cycles within cycles, every third month mine were particularly bad. Read and understand all that PMDD involves: lack of confidence, anger, rage, confusion, dark thoughts, brain fog to mention just few. Keep your boundaries strong, look at her Screen Time, this is how I manage my DCs phone usage. Good luck.

You need third party involvement in this. A psychologist specialising in adolescent mental health and family therapy is the route you need to go down.

Sorry to hear that, sounds like a very difficult situation. One word of caution though, please ensure any counsellor or therapist you refer your daughter to does not, under any circumstances, discuss gender identity with her. Your daughter is vulnerable to those who would have her believe the lie that she's perhaps born in the wrong body, and the tragedy of the Tavistock clinic is littered with troubled young girls like her. It's probably not much comfort but her issues will likely resolve in time - but it won't be easy. Best of luck.

First port of call would be a discussion with your GP- both for you and your child.

dont hold out out for much support from CAMHS - BUT if she is at risk of self harm and both GP and school confirm this she will get accelerated support.

the school should also have a child psychologist which should be the fastest and most immediate route. If you can afford then do consider private counselling based off recommendations.

one thing to consider- wild shot- my dtr really struggled with the transition to ss but she expressed thru anxiety and depression. Eventually at age 15 and 4 years of pain she was diagnosed with autism - she could cope / mask at primary but not at ss. We did experience meltdowns when she came home.

Currently she attends school p/t and she has weekly contact with a staff member- but she has also been fully out of school when needed. Maybe discuss with school and your daughter what she can cope with? Unfortunately the uk education system is a straight jacket which doesn’t meet the needs of all children.

@Edenspirits73 My daughter started like this and is still a nightmare at 25
Sorry that was not helpful. You just have to deal with stuff as it happens, hopefully you have a hubs who can get on board for support

Sounds like you need your own version of super nanny to come and give you advice. I have no idea if there are advisors like that out there but maybe research that route?

Do you have a Mental Health team at school?
My DD suffers with anxiety and has talked of self harm, which triggered extra help and counselling through school, it has really helped her and was pretty much immediate compared to the waiting list for Camhs of around 2 years.
It does sound like she has something that's troubling her, we found big changes in DD as she navigated periods, complicated friendship issues and a new school.
Keep all lines of communication as open as you can. Dd often talks to me in the car as its less confrontational. Or often in the dark at bedtime. Reassure her that she can tell you anything.
While I steered away from a phone limit as I personally didn't believe it would have helped us, I did plan regular small treats (cafe/shopping/cinema) so she was less reliant on her phone. I tried to make sure she had several clubs or activities outside of her school friendship groups. Sometimes it's difficult when all their friends are in one place.

DD is 13 and things are so much more settled than they were a couple of years ago.

I absolutely feel your pain. I also have a 12 year old son who is struggling with the transition to secondary school. If it helps most of my friends with children of the same age are struggling with there kids too for a variety of reasons.
Secondary is a whole new world it seems. What is her friendship group like? Is she being bullied? Not that it excuses the behaviour, but my Son had been so so moody and lashing out verbally, turned out he is being bullied and was struggling. I would take away her phone everytime she I rude to you, take away her TV if she has one and turn of Internet if need be. I think the trick is to get to the root of the problem, easier said than done I know..

I don’t know about your DD but my DD’s phone turns her into a monster. We have to limit her access to it every day. She’s only allowed on it 20mins at a time without doing a different activity, it’s not allowed in her room unless for a specific purpose that she asks about and we have found that this has improved her mood swings hugely, she recognises it herself too and will set her own alarms for access.

Do you know what behaviour is like in the school generally?

I'd suspect the friend without boundaries may be having a lot of influence and she may not be the only one. Has she got new friends she didn't have in primary?

I'm not saying move her now, but I'd start investigating different schools. She may need to be moved away from influences where she is and have a fresh start. This can be your back up plan if things don't change.

Before resorting to that though I would:

• keep putting in consequences
• communicate with school and make it clear that you want her behaviour to change and that you'd like some support around self harm
• keep communicating with her and let her know you love her, give her opportunities to tell you if there is something upsetting her, and keep talking about the long term consequences of following that path of behaviour.
• get her a hobby/sport to keep her busy and hopefully build positive friendships outside school.

I feel your pain OP. I have DDs 14 and nearly 16. It all sounds terribly normal though … sorry it just does! Teenagers are notoriously annoying, challenging and know everything. I was reading this yesterday https://www.tusla.ie/uploads/content/Teenagers_Wellbeing_d3.pdf we live in Ireland. It’s quite insightful. I’m a single parent and attending my third parenting course … this is when our DCs need us the most! Your DD is still the kind, sweet girl she always was … the only thing we can do is educate ourselves and ride out the storm.

I found this really helpful too sent to me by my daughters therapist.

This is exactly the same experience we had. DD behaviour (whilst not as wild as OP) was really difficult and still is challenging for all those reasons. She’s also developed OCD which we were a bit dismissive of at first not understanding the extent of it and then it became debilitating and she started self harming. We didn’t see any of this at first, just the bad behaviour but then she crashed and hasn’t been to school since the end of last year. I’d wage there are all sorts going on underneath that isn’t immediately obvious.

OP, it sounds very, very hard.

I do want to encourage you to try to see your DD as someone who is struggling very badly with something that is happening to her.

It feels a little from your posts that this has become your trauma (you losing your wonderful child/ feeling bullied/dreading holiday, the trauma of feeling you don't know your child etc), and that you are seeing her as the cause..... all of this is totally understandable, and is indeed happening to you- but bringing that as the lens to how you manage your daughter won't help her. Those things aren't her issue, they are yours. She is going through something really tough that is happening to her, and she is suffering, and needs her parents as compassionate coaches and boundary setters (ie in full calm, adult mode, not traumatised, fearful mode). This is hugely difficult to do, (especially in light of your PMDD - I'm dealing with similar and struggle to be ok at the best of times, without managing a teen on top), but if you can do it, I think it could help.

Your DD actually strikes me as trying to work her way through this and at least sometimes, do the right thing. She is expressing to you her temptations (weed etc). That is actually very open and mature... she wants to talk and have guidance would be my guess. She is raising with you how you are with her and what she would like - again trying to have a conversation and yes there will be a conversation to be had about which boundaries are right and which not at her age). She told the school she is wanting to self harm, rather than do it. That is a clear cry for help. These to me aren't rebellions they are an expression that she is having thoughts that scare her... that make her feel that she doesn't know or like herself anymore- that she has no idea what to do. I would meet these with some serious love and kudos for the courage to be open. If these are being met instead with panic or reproach from you those tell her she's on her own, that yes, it is scary, and that how she is handling it - despite trying to communicate, is all wrong. Your reaction and disappointment in her is another thing she has to manage on top of whatever trauma and confusion about her shift to puberty is also causing. She probably senses that you mourn the 'little girl' who was so so lovely, but she can't choose to become that again, so what is she meant to think? That she is bad, she is now someone who causes you pain, who has become someone who will never be as liked as before. It's great she knows she is loved, but does she know you are excited for her growing up, her flourishing ability to think critically (including criticising your parenting!), her totally on-schedule valiant push for self determination, her courageous openness in telling you that she is having new desires to experience life, or to reach out to adults when she is struggling?

I'm sorry if none of this is useful. I obviously don't know anything beyond what you have posted, so I hope it helps a little.

Is there a sport she enjoys? I know that sounds like a nerdy answer but I’ve been there with one of mine and having a healthy thing to be into with something to aspire to, a little bit of competition etc can bring out the best in them. Especially if the coaches are good.

Anything from netball to kick boxing. It just helps them express themselves and grow.

You need to get her to a doctor. A gynecologist would be best. Don't delay. PMDD can be brutal in young teens.

I agree with this.

Hello there mum . Mum of 3 girls now in there 20's . All we want is a lovely family life . Boom in come the hormones and other issues . One of mine went off the rails despite us trying to live a perfect family life . Confiscating phone or keeping her in didn't work . She kept bad company and only one of the other parents involved cared . It was a hard road . CAMHS let me down as so many kids in same boat . You know as a mum you can't put your head on the pillow at night until you know your kids are ok . Also hope you get support for yourself as it can affect you mentally . Trying to juggle demanding job , trying to maintain calm in house and support all of your kids . She thinks she does have a menstrual disorder that effects her moods etc . Thankfully she does let me in now .But she is not a sharer like me . Fortunately she speaks to her sisters every day and they are close and support each other. I have to respect this as she is an adult now . Also she is such an amazing girl who has so much empathy for others in her job . Lots more support available now . But only if your daughter is prepared to communicate with them . Hopefully this will happen . Stay strong mum , you are not alone xx

Oh OP - I really sympathise. I do think transition to secondary can be such a culture shock -and combined with hormones etc can affect girls in so many different ways.

I am lucky that my DD didn't react in the same way - but she did have major issues those first few months at secondary. She was confident and happy at primary, but when they moved up things changed quite fast. She had a small friendship group who had known each other for ever, plus a bestie. But by about the October they had all decided my DD was immature (she doesn't do make up or trout pout selfies, and yes - maybe is quite happily young for her age and enjoying that) - so she had a horrible few months where her whole world was turned upside down and she suddenly had to experience having no friends/having people be mean to her. Nothing she had ever come across before. She came home in tears some times and I felt heartbroken for her.

Luckily she made new and better friends (fortunately just before lockdown) and has been Ok ever since - but it was a real culture shock.

I've no experience of what your DD is going through, but I do think it can be a really hard time. Getting a counsellor will help, I'm sure. Try not to blame yourself - you sound a great Mum and it's just a stressful time for teenage girls. They do need to build resilience, but how you/we do that I just don't know. Good luck!

PMDD

You need support and advice to deal with this. It's incredibly difficult.

Parenting mental health on Facebook has some great stuff, and they also have a course called partnering not parenting. It's very young to have to start, but best to get in now. It sounds like hormone related which I think was the same with my dds

I could have written this 3 years ago. It’s puberty and secondary school - my then 12 year old daughter was seen by CAMHS psychologist (still sees her) and I was advised not to let her spend time on her own where she could be self harming. My daughter also talked about suicide and I was told I had to keep her physically close at all times. My daughter told me what she had been using to cut herself and I had to confiscate it and check in that she hadn’t harmed herself every day.

Use the phone call from school as a turning point and sit your daughter down and explain how worried you are about her, how much you want to help her and that you love her and hate that this is how she feels (I’m sure you have but actually make these statements together and deliberately if that makes sense)

If she has scars, or wounds, then make sure she is treated. It’s out in the open now so you must talk about it with her and monitor it. My daughter stopped self harming almost immediately, but did start again very briefly as a one off a year later, so it’s important to maintain everything. Remove her phone, she really doesn’t need it. Let her choose something you and she can watch together (I remember we watched The Good Place) maybe? Choose a board game, go out a walk, take her out 1:1 to dinner? Something that gives her your undivided attention - these things worked practically to get my daughter out of the absolute mental hell she was in.

I completely empathise and if you want to pm me I’m more than happy - it was a very scary time but with the right support you and she can get back to a positive relationship. My daughter has just finished her exams, is looking to go to uni, and no, it’s not perfect, but the difference is night and day. We’ve also just started family counselling but it’s taken this long for the referral to come through.

Another one to back up the person who suggested Sport.

This. Limit the phone internet and tv

Encourage sport team sports. Fitness.
Netball. Football. Camping. Anything

Consider switching schools. Private? Smaller?