Body positivity is out of control…

[YumYumY]

Inspired by another thread raising the topic of UPFs (by a fit 70 year old).

And I’m definitely people judging and shaming.

Lot of us eat shit food (availability of shit food definitely an issue) and seem to be proud of it.

Common MN army, lay into me.

I’ve done both, got used to eating crap as well as got more disciplined and got the crap out of my system (more than once and the change in diet was never a pleasurable experience).

But looking at the streets people just look so, yes fat, and unhealthy. And I’m calling already a size 12 fat here just to be clear (with some leeway for different bone structures)

When will we start admitting we are fat and it is a problem.

Clearly being overweight and unhealthy is making you very happy and not bitter at all.

I wouldn't comment on your situation if you hadn't written such a rude post. I don't really care.

But I AM fed up of posters trying to abuse anyone with a normal weight, eating healthy meal and having healthy portions and pretending they are either troll or just making things up. Only on MN is it normal to need an entire family pizza per person. With a side of garlic bread and more.

It's not body positivity, it's stupidity at that level.

Eh? Size 12 is fat?! Sorry but I don't agree at all and suspect you are very much in the minority with this opinion.

I don't actually know many people who could or want to have diner after a full afternoon tea.

Being precious because you are served mini sandwiches and bite size mini cakes in one go is one thing, needing another meal after a meal another entirely.

It's not under-eating not to have food for the rest of the day after afternoon tea!

What’s with all the judgey threads today! Are the Tory bots prepping for their manifestos 😂

I do notice it too when I see school pupils walking to the local high school. It used to be that a school had one fat kid, and everyone knew who that kid was, now it seems to be every other kid in the school. The standards of what is considered big have also changed. I was watching old Friends episodes where a running joke was teenage Monica was super super fat. But in flashback scenes by today’s standards, she’s barely even chubby.

But I don’t think it’s fair or correct to blame the parents or lass them off as lazy and greedy. It’s far too complex for that.

Theres so many reasons why people are bigger than they used to be and prevention could start in schools. My kids, out of the 32 hours a week or so they’re at school, have PE for 1 hour. An hour!! Then they waste hours and hours of time with, sorry mathematicians, a load of crap using a protractor that they will never ever need to know. IMO PE should be every school day and I have mentioned at feedback sessions it’s not good enough having just 1 hours a week. I get told that active play is encouraged at playtime but sorry it’s not the same as physically active sports guided by a professional.

Don't attach body positivity to what you're saying, they're not the same thing.

Agreed yet again with the point of expecting not to be actually shamed and bullied.

Being honest about weight different story.

And saying it again, the food in shops and what people know to cook is as we all know I believe the main problem.

Yabu for saying size 12 is fat. I am 5’9” and medium build when my BMI was 23 I was a 12-14. I have a huge arse even when I lose a lot of weight.

Now c'mon. Having always been a fit size 6-8 I am not being defensive. I think you are wrong to call out dress size. Everyone knows that dress size entirely depends on where you shop and what you are buying. Eg. somewhere like primark where the same person can have clothes in their basket ranging from a size 6 to 18. Putting a number on what can be considered fat and unhealthy is inevitably going to cause some very healthy people to feel like crap, or worse have darker thoughts. That's often how EDs start. I know for a fact I would rather be like @mitogoshi 's daughter than any skinny woman who couldn't do a press-up and would be out of breath after running 1 km! Just focus on yourself. How do you know if that fat person you see is actually a regular gym goer who just lost 4 stone, or if that size 12 has just recovered from an ED, or if that size 16 is on meds? You don't. And that healthy size 8 who eats vegan and bio but can't lift her shopping bags because her arms are going break.... not healthy either. There is a lot of shit food. It's fine if you have it occasionally. I'm not going to kick up a fuss if my kid has a piece of birthday cake, or some sweets after swimming. Better that than get some disordered idea about what are good foods and what are bad foods so that it controls your life. Concentrate on you. Being 'judging and shaming' is an ugly look.

Size 12 is not fat in western countries as people in general are taller.

I am 175cm. In size 12 I am on lower end of normal BMI. To fit in 10 I would need to be underweight. So from health perspective I am nowhere near unhealthy.

Because fast food and takeaways are of course cheap, so much cheaper than salads, potatoes, beans, pasta.
Bollocks.

We’re fat because we eat shit, lots and lots of shit.

This

define size 12...

Teen shops tend to size fairly small
The likes of Size 8 have VERY generous sizing.

Buy clothes on the continent and they are not generous at all.

Designer clothes are notoriously very small!

It’s so complicated though, there’s so much to unpick. I don’t believe that the majority of seriously overweight and obese people are happy that way, it must feel rubbish to be unfit, out of breath, uncomfortable in their clothes and the heat. I know not all very overweight and obese people will have these problems (cue someone coming along and claiming to be a size 18 marathon runner) but for the majority it surely is the case. My SIL is very very overweight and she can’t stand for long, walk far (as in, a 1 mile is pushing it) and is always ill, it must be miserable. If it was as easy as “just eat less” I’m sure she’d lose weight.

Office jobs and culture definitely don’t help. I’m a civil servant with good flexibility but there’s such a culture of hardly leaving your desk (even when WFH - Teams which displays you as “away” when you’re inactive for 5 minutes has put paid to that) and only because I have a supportive partner who I share the school runs with and other childcare in place am I able to get out for exercise 2-3 mornings a week (early). I try and make a point of having a short walk every lunch time too but the majority of my colleagues don’t, there’s such an unhealthy martyr culture in most work places.

Between juggling work and children’s clubs too my DC end up eating way too much freezer food for my liking, and one being very picky also doesn’t help.

People are addicted to UPFs, so reliant are they on it they probably don't eat anything fresh. Maybe the lettuce on a burger, or the salad on a kebab?
I'd say there are so many fat people around they don't feel as out of place as they used to about 30 years back. Like in my primary school there was maybe one fat kid in each year, now it's most of them!
I think saying a size 12 is fat is a bit bizarre though. It could be on someone short with no muscle, but majority of people that size are a healthy weight. I certainly wouldn't look at that as fat, clothing size wise.

YANBU probably half or more of the kids at my child’s primary are visibly overweight with a handful very obese

I appreciate that bone structure will play part - hence the comment in my original post. My bone structure makes me quite small so size 12 is definitely overweight for me.

But it’s not about opinion. It’s about how many of the size 12 people do class as medically overweight - and therefore the weight impacting their health.

Idk about anyone else but I'm hungrier a lot sooner when I eat UPFs. I need bigger portions and snack a hell of a lot more. They might be 'cheaper' but it's a false economy when I have to eat so much more.

And yes, after a long period of mostly UPFs in my diet, it takes a while for the 'munchies' to go away when I switch to mostly non-UPF food. When I found out that UPFs literally rewire your brain to want more, similar to an addict, I was shocked but not surprised iyswim.

I'm an obstinate old cow, so it's not being evangelical to say I avoid most UPFs now - it's purely out of stubbornness

I've spent a lot of time recently looking at candid photography of ordinary working class women "in the streets" in the 1910s, 1920s and 1930s and what I noticed is that around a third of them could be classed as overweight. Not fat exactly, but what used to be called 'plump', 'solid' or 'statuesque'. Certainly size 12 (by today's standard of size 12).

So this current idea that everyone throughout history (apart from the very rich)was super skinny until last week, is rubbish. People have always come in different shapes and sizes.

However in the photos I was examining, the difference was shapewear. the women even the working class ones were dressed more formally and were wearing either shapewear or their clothes were structured in such a way as to give them a waist. Thus even the plumper ones had a 'figure'. This gives the illusion of slimness or at least trimness. These days we dress informally and less flatteringly to the figure.

Extreme obesity was almost unheard if in the UK until fairly recently but the 'stocky' have always been with us.

I have just returned from France (Bordeaux area) and it was notable how much slimmer the population in general was. Slimmer and in the case of women less tweaked. No mass of pneumatic lips or weird fillers and suspiciously smooth foreheads. Sure one of two, but completely not on the scale of any similar UK regional city.
Women had a range of natural faces and the population in general looked fitter.
Just an observation. In a country where people eat well.

Dress size is a bit of a red herring. 12 could or could not be overweight. I'm 181cm. I was a 14 when I was a healthy BMI (currently on another diet, size 16). People can need a size 12 to fit big boobs / broader shoulders etc but otherwise be perfectly healthy at that dress size.

However, I do agree we've all got used to a heavier weight being considered ok, and although I don't think dress size is a good measure, I don't think anyone can argue about the fact that as a population we are heavier and less healthy than we were 20-30 years ago.

I'm not sure people are proud of it though?

I am fat and it is a problem. It isn't what we eat though it's the amount. I started intermittent fasting and it's quite effective

You’re not talking about body positivity at all here.

Well done on thinking everyone has the same access to healthy ingredients and also consistently has the time to shop, prepare and cook it all.

Also congratulations on your genetic profile, which is a big part of all this.

I love that you used the phrase jumped the shark in the right context! And you’re right calling a size 12 fat is laughable

Right?!
Wind them up and watch them go...