Body positivity is out of control…

[YumYumY]

Inspired by another thread raising the topic of UPFs (by a fit 70 year old).

And I’m definitely people judging and shaming.

Lot of us eat shit food (availability of shit food definitely an issue) and seem to be proud of it.

Common MN army, lay into me.

I’ve done both, got used to eating crap as well as got more disciplined and got the crap out of my system (more than once and the change in diet was never a pleasurable experience).

But looking at the streets people just look so, yes fat, and unhealthy. And I’m calling already a size 12 fat here just to be clear (with some leeway for different bone structures)

When will we start admitting we are fat and it is a problem.

Nope - Several major studies and meta-analyses have found strong associations between BMI and all-cause mortality; most have described a U-shaped association with minimum mortality in the healthy weight (20–25 kg/m2) range;2, 3, 4, 5 a 2013 meta-analysis suggested that overweight might be protective6 but concerns were raised about whether the study had adequately accounted for age, reverse causality, and confounding by smoking.7

I think the upper end of the healthy weight range is seen as optimal. It’s be surprised if a bmi of 24-25 came in under a size 12 for most.

The average requirement of protein for the average woman is about 50 g/day.
The approximate calorie requirement is say 1500 calories more.
100 g dry rice = ~350 calories.

Cost of protein powder = £50 / 5 kg
Cost of rice = ~£30 / 20 kg
Cost of multivitamins = £20/360
Cost of essential oils = £20/360

Therefore you could get ALL your nutritional needs per week for (60p+50p 5p+5p) x 7 = £8.40.

It wouldn't be a fun way of doing it, but that's it. Buy a big 20 kg bran for fibre and you're set.

People aren't fat because they're poor. People aren't fat because they're rich. People are fat because of a poor diet. People choose that box of cereal, macaroni/cheese, chicken nuggets. They could choose brown rice, chicken and broccoli. No sympathy.

Twice in my life I have edged into having an eating disorder. I have spent a couple of years each time obsessively restricting food and exercising to a stupid extent. BMI wasn't something I was aware of the first time but the second time I fell into the underweight zone. Neither time did my dress size fall lower than a 12. It's just how my skeleton is formed; I'll never be a waif.

I'm now a size 14/16 and overweight according to BMI, but my diet is healthy and I weight train several times a week. I know which life I prefer.

Tell me you’re tone deaf without telling me that you’re tone deaf

This is a whole different thread and definitely saying size 12 is fat if I was a public figure is outright dangerous for anyone inclined to suffer with eating disorder.

If you agree that it is a dangerous statement then why post it on a public forum for 1000s of women to see?

Because I’m not a public figure with any level of authority where tens, hundreds of thousands, millions of people would see a headline claim that would then be hijacked by newspapers and taken out of context. I’ve elaborated further in my posts for every single of the thousands of women to see what point I’m making.

I am overweight and deeply ashamed by this, and I don't agree either with those ads showing obese women dancing around happily. Fat is not good. I've come to accept my flaw or vice and trying to work on it from this angle rather than feeling like a useless fat failure. Being overweight is awful, I can only speak for myself here, but it is absolutely mortifying, with any other vice its somewhat hidden away. No one sees a 'gambler' walking in the a restaurant or a 'shopping addict' in the Supermarket queue. But if you are fat you get to be fat 24/7 and everyone knows. So why am I fat and not doing something about it? Well I could write all day and still not get to the bottom of it. Its an incredibly complex thing and FWIW I feel I am doing something about it, every minute of every day I am battling a want to eat more. I am over 12 stone and feeling quite proud of it because inside me is a 20 stone person being overpowered constantly.

I have noted that in my life I have often make instinctive judgements about other vices that I cannot understand. But I now stop and check myself and understand that they are struggling with their things, as am I . We are no better than each other. I wish people who are slim could see an overweight person with that compassion and see that many of them are simply displaying their struggles to you. Examples of what I can't understand instinctively but am compassionate about:

Smokers - just quit! Its easy. I used to smoke but just stopped, why can't you.
People in debt/overspenders - plan your month, no impulse buys. Cut your cloth according to your income, its basic maths!
Gambling addicts - its so stupid and nonsensical, just stop doing it.
Tech /SM addicts - just turn it off. Its not hard, the button is right there.
People in unhappy relationships - just break up or leave. Be happy single.

These are just examples I'm sure I could find a million more. You see I don't do any of the above and there are a million other things I do very well every day in my life, thank you very much. So I am refusing to feel ashamed for this one thing I cannot get right but I will keep trying. But I am battling a massive industry designed to feed my addiction if you want to call it that, with no supports to help me and a world that is normalising my size. If we as a society want to reduce obesity we need to stop wasting time telling people about it and take very real action, like taxing or banning UPFs or supplementing healthy foods so the decision of what to eat is never one based on money, along with having funded supports for those trying to give up their vice. But we need to be supportive and compassionate along the way.

You literally said 'And I’m definitely people judging and shaming’ in your initial post.

My point is that if you want to encourage people to feel able to acknowledge that their weight may be unhealthy and make steps to change that, making them experience shame is not the way to do it.

It you just wanted to pointlessly gnash your teeth and wring your hands about how fat we’re all getting and piss of a bunch of strangers on the internet - you totally nailed it!

Excessive eating is also an eating disorder ie disordered eating, what I believe other posts are discussing (aside from the unnecessary size 12 comment which I think has now become a far bigger issue than the point of the post) is that there is a group of people promoting excessive eating and mukbankging etc as normal. They are so young, they will not be experiencing health issues until they hit their 30’s and 40’s when they suddenly realise how hard life is going to be for them. I see them promoting a low level of ‘movement’ which they believe is exercise but essentially there are harmful behaviours being promoted in this movement

I was kind of following some body pos stuff on social media trying to get into it but I am glad I’m out of it

what I saw was pretty much:

campaigning for more brands to make plus sized clothing

‘what I eat in a day as a Xxx fat person’

‘here is me in gymwear doing some joyful movements’

‘here is me in something unflattering or virtually naked breaking stereotypes and smashing down barriers of fat hatred’

excessive eating challenges and clearly disordered eating of diets purely consisting of junk food on camera (is this fetish)

complaining about healthcare

FYI I don’t want to see anyone semi naked on my social media at any size tbh

A size 12 is fat!! What a ridiculous thing to say. My dd has battled anorexia for 5 years and is now the size 12 we always dreamed of. She is in no way fat and we’re so proud of her. I’m a 14 , I don’t eat shit food and I’m not fat either. We’re both healthy and that is all I care about. Is it a wonder eating disorder levels are so high when young girls are faced with such a ridiculous view of health and weight.

A size 12 is fat?! Really? I'm a size 16,and admittedly a bit podgy,but if I was a size 12,I'd definitely consider myself slim. As would most other people,I hope!

I think that most people with weight to lose feel enough shame without ither people adding to it. To quote myself as an example, I have already lost 2 stone, but I know I have a way to go. at first I only ever exercised in the privacy of my own home, but now that I have lost some weight I will go for a run first thing on a morn8ng, so that people are not subjected to me hauling my blubber round the streets. I work from home and I don't go out to socialise anywhere where I would have to dress up. I certainly would never eat in front of other people, because nobody wants to watch a fat person eat.
Once I have lost another stone my reward will be allowing myself to exercise where other people might see me, and getting some proper exercise wear rather than a baggy t shirt. Once I have lost a second stone I will allow myself to go swimming, and to go out on an evening.
This is the level of shame that a lot of heavier people feel. I I am using the self loathing as a way to push myself to lose weight, so I guess I am an advert for shame being a good thing, as it is working.

The size 12 debate needs context. I am 5’5 and I am a size 12 and only just on the range of a healthy BMI. If I was shorter then yes I would be technically overweight
if I was taller I would have an even lower BMI and be a size smaller

You sound like a bundle of laughs OP 🙄

As I said above I posted because of the thread I mentioned incl reason.

So yes, initial impulse for posting was exactly that. To gnash my teeth into those who refuse to see a wider point being made and instead focusing on the person and context that person has given.

Obviously my post attracted set of very different people and I evolved the original attention grabbing post.

I’ve been a size 12 since I was 14 and I am very petite and a normal bmi. And im
almost 40. Seriously, cop on . Also I must add that I think bigger women (size 18+) age better than skinny rakes. Get off your high horse.

Since when is a size 12 fat?

Since the teeny tinies took over Mumsnet!

I said above I was out for blood with my impulsive post and they didn’t arrive. A few seem to have turned up now. I’m still up for a scuffle just to indulge myself because I can. Caveat - I’m now being lighthearted in case it’s not obvious.

Aesthetic beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. Once upon a time in Hollywood (not the movie) everyone was bone and skin, probably the same amount of muscle as fat - not healthy. I believe it is now changed somewhat and whilst people in Hollywood are still very thin there seem to be a little bit more muscle.

Back in the day way before us voluptuous was beautiful as it meant people had enough means to not be skin and bone.

However, the question is how many of the average looking people we got used to seeing can run up the stairs without getting out of breath. Size 12 me or really at this stage in the thread I should be saying average looking me despite doing regular HIIT would still be breathing that bit faster when running up those stairs. Somewhat lighter me and fitting the average from my country of origin I can clearly feel the difference when running up those stairs.

For many people they become that bit heavier later in life having spent their younger years being able to run up those stairs. But more and more people / kids don’t have a chance…

According to Vinted it is "large" and a size 14 is "XL"

And, I’m going to indulge myself that little bit more.

Someone mentioned weight gain in pregnancy. That has also been normalised. Of course we get bigger and gain weight in pregnancy, but there really isn’t need to suddenly start eating for two adult people. In fact it is bad for both, us and the unborn baby to suddenly start eating way in excess of the food intake prior to pregnancy.

Your comment about PE really resonated and reminded me of a day I recently spent in Helsinki.

The thing that really struck me when there, was the amount of schools they had! - it seemed that every corner I turned, there was another school - but that during a 6 hour period that I was there, every time I walked past a school, the kids were all outside, playing games, running around etc. I was chatting to a shop owner and made a comment about this and she said 'we take our education seriously and our kids take it seriously too. It's something to enjoy and being outside is the most important element of it'. So very unlike here!!