To be AMAZED at this cms calculation?

[whatnowws]

Recently split from DS’s dad. He won’t communicate or see ds, so after several weeks I contacted cms. They are getting in touch with him but… the claim is for 730 a month?!? He earns almost 80k? How can this be right?

meanwhile, I’m earning 46k and paying 1,700 in nursery costs and all other costs for ds?

how on earth is that supposed to be fair?! This calculation is also assuming he continues not to see ds. If he wants him a night or more then costs reduce further… basically he can do what he wants and I’m expected to pick up the financial pieces no matter what.

It’s not speculation.

That is exactly why the system is as it is. The debt owed to the Secretary of State got so large something had to be done. Instead of doing something effective they decided to allow RPs on benefits to keep the maintenance that mostly wasn’t being paid

If women buggered off in the numbers that men do either men’s careers would be massively impacted or children would end up in care, the costs would be through the roof and either way changes would have to be made.

Yes…was £3384 per my calculator, but unable to edit.

While it’s still socially acceptable for men to walk away and while people still play the “well I get nothing so be grateful” nothing will ever change

And women and children will be the losers, as always.

It matters, if you know an inch about History and political History.
It matters a lot, because this is why some of these rights were created in law in the first place: because fathers left their children absolutely destitute and mothers had no rights or means of income.

It still matters because these rights are only for a small fraction of women worldwide, and by the looks of current global politics may well recede even in Europe if certain factions are voted in in large Numbers.

'And I don’t think any child should suffer hardship because their father is being a knob.'

Of course not but it is not the tax payer's responsibility to pay for other people's children in this situation where the father is a high earner. The law should have been changed decades ago to force a NRP to pay as they apparently do in Switzerland. It is appalling that any parent is just allowed to leave and not, at the very least, face a stiff financial penalty.

It's absolutely crap op and completely unfair. No wonder so many kids live in poverty when their dad doesn't contribute to the costs of their upbringing. I'm always amazed at some posters on MN who are horrified at child poverty and yet don't consider the resolving it means making men pay for the children they create.

Is it too much to hope that sorting CMS appears in one of the manifestos? I'll be raising it with any politician who knocks on my door.

Its so unfair! My ex (who me and my son fled due to DV) gets nothing yet! My ex partner is self employed and says he makes next to nothing( he has multiple holidays abroad each year/ a large house/ 3 x posh cars etc) its so unfair but me and my som manage with what I earn! The piece of mind for both of us NOT living with him is worth it!]

I think it’s a bit of a stretch to say this man isn’t contributing to his kids upbringing, in fact after nursery years he will be paying for it all and supporting the op as he will be still paying the same amount.

always someone takes it too far.

Jesus wept. I can’t believe what I’m reading here. No wonder so many men can’t be arsed if the bar is this low! Also: £1700/month for nursery is completely standard where I live (Scotland), and describing the OP as “stinking rich” is actually laughable - she’d struggle to make ends meet in most parts of the country IMO.

I can understand your anger and frustration op. But you need to channel your energies into getting the best outcome for yourself and your child rather than fighting a system you will not win. I went through all of this with my grandson, who lives with me. I spent too much time, energy and stress trying to right CMS.

My gs's father tried every trick in the book to pay nothing for the son he professed to love and care about. The reality was he earned £60,000 and claimed to earn £39,000 self employed. From bitter experience I knew unless I actually had his wage slip in my hand, I could not prove it to the CMS standard. I accepted the £177 pm and then he did not pay that for 12 months.

Each time CMS took enforcement action, he would make one payment which meant I was back to square one because he had "complied". They did take him to court for a Liability Order which meant he legally owed arrears. He had to pay the court costs. Because payment was made via CMS, he had to pay something like 20% on top. I think he might have owed them as much as he owed us.

They even looked at taking his car so he hid it at a relatives, they looked at taking out a charge over his house so he transferred it into his parents' names. This was over £177 per month.

Long story short, after years of issues it went to FIU, their fraud dept. Tbf, the caseworker did his best and his final shot was telling him that he did not accept his accountant's paperwork and asked him for 4 years wage slips. I wanted a lump sum settlement because I knew he would stop paying again. Surprise, surprise he paid up rather than hand over wage slips. I closed the case.

Don't be me op. You cannot polish the turd that is CMS. That said, without them my gs would have received nothing. Focus on getting what you can. I am not criticising you, just offering you my advice via bitter experience.

I don’t disagree, and neither do a lot of posters. It’s absolutely shit what men can get away with, they can cheat and leave their families and if their ex wife/partner is lucky they get a few quid thrown their way. It’s absolutely pathetic.

There isn’t really a solution, beyond CMS and your ex paying fairly. Unfortunately there is no system to make him pay 50% of the trainers DS needs or 50% of the school trip he wants to go on or whatever.

£730 is more than I’ve heard most get via CMS. My friend gets £270 per month for 3 kids as her ex has the kids 2 nights a week and dumps the kids on his new girlfriend and he refuses 50% of anything, and is petty to the penny if he buys the kids anything. It’s revolting. My friend just stopped fighting, he was enjoying the torture he was putting her through. She knows that one day the kids will see all she has done and will do for them, compared to their shit dad.

It’s not the solution you want but have a check and a recheck of anything you may be entitled to to prop you up financially. Do I think it’s fair that that is the only way you can get support with the costs? No. But if you’re entitled, claim it! Child benefit, tax free childcare, single occupancy council tax, and possibly universal credit - they can often support with childcare costs too.

Good luck OP.

I was making a more general wider point @Sunnyandsilly Yes this bloke is contributing something - but not 50% and that's crap.

But many many men pay little or nothing and that's a scandal that we allow this in this country. I have no skin in the game but I see many friends being shafted by useless lazy men and I am genuinely shocked that we don't resolve it. Other countries manage to.

It’s not a stretch atm - it’s outright accurate.

The sum being debated is a CMS calculation and they’re getting in touch with him. He’s currently walked away from the OP and hasn’t been in touch to ask after his child or pay anything.

I hope for your sake he's happy to pay that and not change his job to fiddle the system and you end up with nothing.
Like many on here my ex went self employed, doesn't see his kids and I receive £26 a month contribution for two children.
He lives mortgage free, works as and when he feels like it and holidays most of the year.
CMS works against the resident parent, how this is able to happen in this day and age is beyond me.

@Imogenie

again..i am not entitled to any support with childcare outside of tax free provision.

and even if I was…. It’s absurd you’d rather taxpayers money to be paying for our son’s nursery rather than his own dad.

That's a bit insulting. I don't think I am delusional. I know a few divorced men that share custody 50:50 and others that can't, pay their fair share of nursery. The issue here is everyone is saying how fucked the system is and men just can do as they please, but the OP has not said he is a dead beat dad or that she had tried the appropriate channels. Not because this is the story of some women, means she shouldn't even try. Pretty defeatist attitude if everyone just does that.

I would try court, lawyers, my local MP if I get to a point where the law is benefiting the non contact parent, but I tell you what I wouldn't do: let a bunch of people in an internet forum tell me that's the way it is because the system is rubbish...

Sorry to hear about your divorce, what an unfortunate situation. Have you been in contact with your local MP with regards of these nonsensical laws?

I’ve brought this up with every MP I’ve had for the last 17 years. None have been interested. One even charmingly asked why I’d want someone not interested to be around my child more, totally missing the point of the children and I being subject to a contact order that their father could freely ignore.

Even spoke to my MSP when we lived in Scotland for a while.

It’s not a popular enough issue for them to give a shit. Until more people pester them about it nothing will change.

Have you used the entitledto website to find out that you’re definitely not eligible for support?

you should also get a council tax reduction by 25% if you haven’t already done this

It is depressing that any woman could possibly think the state should pay for our child rather than his own dad. What a country 🤦‍♀️

No one is saying that, but if your ex is uninterested in parenting and is paying only the CMS and you’ve been financially hit by this, why wouldn’t you take any help available? If the choice is between being broke because your ex won’t pay more, and there’s no real way to compel him to, or you claim every penny you’re entitled to and keep pushing for him to step up.

Your pride will only get you so far, claim what you’re entitled to even if it doesn’t come from him. Ultimately you lose out if you decide that the principle of where any additional income comes from matters more than having financial support - even if it’s from the state.

@OrangeSlices998 not sure how many times I have to say it… I am not entitled to any support. I have a home and savings.

I’m surprised by that, a council tax reduction if nothing else, child benefit & tax free childcare surely too?

But fine, however that’s not your point though is it, whenever folk have suggested looking at what financial support you’re entitled to your response has been ‘wow people want the state to pay rather then the dad’ - which isn’t what they’re saying! You can be as angry as you like, other people on this thread are too and they receive nothing from their children’s parent - you’re not alone for feeling utterly frustrated. I’m just baffled why you think people saying ‘maybe see what financial aid you can get’ translates to ‘dads shouldn’t support their kids, just get benefits instead!’

Sorry just trying to help. But FWIW put the figures you state into the entitled to calculator and got that you can get this. That’s with mortgage and the CMA payment included. If you can get help why wouldn’t you? You’re obviously in difficult circumstances at the moment