To think that those private school parents banging on about their fees

[Thegreatergoodgerald]

Seriously have misjudged how little anyone else gives a stuff??? NHS, social care, state education, public transport, bloody potholes everywhere - that’s what matters to everyone I know.
Not whether or not VAT is added to a business.

YANBU - it’s hardly the end of the world if Clemmie or Charles end up going to a state school. We have bigger things to worry about in the U.K. right now

YABU - of course everyone cares private school parents might have to pay more

Do you genuinely believe that VAT will just be slapped on with no other consequence..?!

The schools will be able to reclaim the VAT on ALL their expenditure (which they are currently unable to do). So all those investments into estates and facilities can be reclaimed (hence the wealthiest benefit the most). All additional external activities and 'childcare' (the holiday/wraparound etc) will also be VAT exempt. Instead of having an all-in fee, they will be dividing it up so anything that is legally VAT exempt, is not charged for.

The amount raised is not going to match your prediction.

Yep, zero fucks given by me and a lot of people. It’s very tone deaf

Rich people will always pay for better education. If they no longer feel that private schools offer value for money, or if they become priced out of the market, they will buy houses in the catchment of the best state schools instead, which means those kids living further out in cheaper areas will lose out.

I have 2 in private school - our school have said to expect a 10% increase in fees (on top of the usual annual increase) as they will claim the rest back from recent capital builds and by reducing bursaries and scholarships.

We will manage until the end of primary then will most likely move house to be in catchment for the excellent comp in the next town.

The money this policy generates is not going to make any material difference to the standard of education provided in the state sector, but in some areas will mean larger class sizes, less access to bursaries and increased house prices.

@shockeditellyou the falling rolls are mainly impacting Primaries not Secondaries at the moment. As funding is lagged schools won’t benefit financially with additional pupils for at least a year, and for some schools that might be too late

Sadly she does.

Because even with their 5/6/7/8s, they are already more able to keep up with A level courses than the kids from local feeder secondaries who apart from the odd exception come in with their 3/4/5/6s and are immediatley put on the 'BTEC/apprentice/trades' track.

No 6th Form is going to be putting students with 3,4,5 GCSE grades on an A Level track (6 maybe). Many state schools ask for 7 or above in the GCSE to do that subject at A Level.

Sounds like you are the one banging on about it 🤔

"Won't somebody think of the cleaners!"

Costs £7000 a year to educate a child, state loses about £8k a year in vat on subsidising children in private schools. So if they come into the public system we’re up grand. If they stay, we’re up £8k. Let’s call it a tax on buying privilege. No problem sending kids to private school, do have a problem having to subsiding it.

I'm looking rn at going private for sixth form for DD and I totally agree, OP. I don't see why anyone else should care about this. I can either afford it or I can't, just as private school has always been, and whingeing about it is pretty inexcusable imo.

Where does. the £8k VAT figure come from @travellinglighter

I think your numbers and logic have gone slightly awry.

Current position:
Private school pupil costs the taxpayer £0. Taxpayer receives no VAT.
State school pupil costs the taxpayer £7,500 per year
Pricate school pupils are saving the taxpayer £7,500.

Position with VAT
Private school costs the taxpayer £0 and they get VAT of around £3,000 (20% on average fees of £15,000)
If that child moves from private to state, it then costs the taxpayer £7,500 per year. That far exceeds the VAT figure.

Where does your VAT figure of £8k come from? That VAT would be due on fees of £40k. The vast majority of school fees are no where near £40k per year.

I’m also struggling to understand the logic of how a child currently saving the taxpayer by attending private school can save the taxpayer money by switching to the state sector and expecting the taxpayer to foot the bill.

You are wrong. The state doesn't lose anything by a child going to private school. It saves 7-8K per year. No idea why you think the state loses money 🤔.

Education hasn't been taxed because prior to Brexit it was illegal to tax education.

Your numbers are a bit off here, it doesn’t really make sense

Well I don't give a stuff about most of those things on your list... anything related to schools isnt an issue i care about enough as I can't have children. The potholes in my area are always being fixed, conservative counil aswell so no complaints there. Public transport is fine in my area not sure what your gripe about that is.

As for social care I'd rather have option to choose when I want to die if I have certain illnesses rather than be forced to exist and as for nhs no party has the guts to do what it needs to because it's not sustainable anymore.

And also struggling to comprehend what the poster means by 'problem with subsidising it'. They subsidise NOTHING towards private education. Parents educating privately pay tax to allow their child to have a state place, do not use the place and then pay for the private fees out of their taxed income. The only people subsidising are the ones who are paying the fees

We will indeed have to disagree.

I just don't understand your logic at all. Food banks, the disabled etc are completely unrelated to charging VAT on private school fees. In fact a more cynical person could suggest that it this whole policy is just Labour virtue signaling and using the whole things as a distraction. If they care so deeply about inequality then why on earth would they focus on something so insignificant when there are bigger fish to fry? Where are there policies to tackle the things you mention? They just don't exist! Yet, they find time to ruminate over a policy that does absolutely nothing for equality and has huge risks attached to it. All to show they are a party of the people! Private schools are easy targets and it's just a further step towards popularism. Sentiment over substance!

How do you feel about it costing the country MORE than it will gain? Because it will.

I expect the plebs are very grateful.

Isn't the whole raison d'etre (reason for existence) of private school exclusivity? You can't subscribe to a system wholly based on exclusivity and then complain it's too exclusive.

So you've been priced out – too bad! That's part of the exclusivity.

could not have said this better

@Araminta1003 you are protected by the law in a lot of ways and can dispute the contents of an EHCP plan which determines what provision there is and how much it costs. The issue is that you have to go through the tribunal process to get there like we have as LAs will try to do the bare minimum until the judicial system tells them they have to.

The Tories have attempted to introduce safety valve, which is basically setting targets to issue fewer EHCPs, however if you do not provide a suitable education for the child's level of SEN, you are effectively breaking the law. Eventually they have to provide that education, its just most families have a battle to get to that stage. In the long run it means that money will be funneled away from mainstream schools not the other way around, so an influx of ex-private pupils have no impact on specialist schools and funding, it just means the state mainstream will be even more underfunded, unless when Labour get in and they increase it.

An EHCP is legally binding. You can have EHCPs for mainstream schools too, but the LA provides funding separately for those children with them, on top of the basic funding.

What a ridiculous response!

What about the bloody cleaners, bus drivers and caretakers? Do they not matter? Do you enjoy mocking those at risk of losing their jobs?

Also the point the poster was making was about how private schools (like other businesses) support employment and local economic growth. It's not just those directly employed by the school but their suppliers and contractors. It is foolish to ignore this and to not factor this into the equation.

That's my plan as well and my tax bill is absolutely HUGE so it's the UK that will lose out. I'm actively pursuing a move abroad.