To be surprised and shocked that PIP is rewarded without official diagnosis?

[Borntrippy]

Thanks to all the recent threads on the DLA/PIP controversy I’m now aware that you don’t need an official diagnosis for conditions such as anxiety, ADHD etc to receive PIP. Although you apparently have to show other evidence in your claim is anyone else surprised by this information?

Do you know what, I think it should stand as proof of just how bloody awful some people are.

There are just so many threads already. This week alone.

Yes, dear. They're called the super rich.

Read something on Twitter yesterday advocating calling benefits by their rightful name :' additional social care payment'.

So many basically bitter, nasty people on MN now.

I receive PIP due to a lifelong physical disability and work. It's symptom focused not diagnosis focused. You need an awful lot of medical evidence. I am also subject to reassessment, even though my care and mobility needs have not changed since a child and my brain damage is not going to fix itself 😊

No, I know. It’s not complicated really. You need some evidence for the symptoms and the effects of them, along with the possible effects of any medication.

Some conditions take years to “diagnose”, but that doesn’t alter how disabling they can be.

PIP is all about the effects, not about working/not, or diagnosis.

There needs to be evidence of the effects.

Obviously, some conditions are diagnosed quickly.

I’m disabled myself (official diagnosis) and I’m torn on this subject. Part of me understands how hard it is to get a diagnosis. I was about 4 and I suddenly was in agony and couldn’t walk properly, the drs told my mum that it was all in my head. We got multiple different options and they all said the same thing. It was only that I finally got another opinion where I got told I had an incredibly rare chronic illness. If my mum didn’t fight and fight for me, I would have never got diagnosed - even though I was severely impacted. So I wonder how many people like this there are, who go to the gp and get told to lose weight or thrown antidepressants rather than getting to the root of the issue and diagnosing. So I understand pip without a diagnosis.

Another part of me knows of quite a few people who claim pip fraudulently for conditions that cannot be ‘proven’. And this is not speculation, these people openly brag about conning the system and contradict what they say to pip to get the benefits vs what they actually do. For example, a woman I know claims to pip that her anxiety is so bad that she doesn’t leave her home at all. This same woman is out at raves every weekend and is out all day and all night - completely contradictory of what she told pip.

It’s a hard one and the people who do it fraudulently for the financial benefit ruins it for the genuine people who actually need it - and puts a bad ‘name’ on people who don’t have a diagnosis and categorise them in one box.

But those claiming fraudulently for conditions that can't be proven need evidence in the first place.

Have you reported these people you claim have fraudulent claims?

Another part of me knows of quite a few people who claim pip fraudulently for conditions that cannot be ‘proven’. And this is not speculation, these people openly brag about conning the system and contradict what they say to pip to get the benefits vs what they actually do. For example, a woman I know claims to pip that her anxiety is so bad that she doesn’t leave her home at all. This same woman is out at raves every weekend and is out all day and all night - completely contradictory of what she told pip.

@orangeleopard Thats extremely unlikely considering the amount of medical evidence you have to provide to get it.

I'm gradually reaching the point where I think it should be possible to charge people who "know someone who knows someone who is gaming the system" with a criminal offence. Gobshitery would cover it.

Yep, I’m sure they would soon realise that actually they know no such person if it were!

People who claim fraudulently will have to provide evidence, and that can be done, if you're willing to see umpteen Drs about a made up condition...

And are still at risk of being caught for that fraud when it is reported to them that said person is seen doing things that contradict their claim. They then risk a/paying back the entire funding they've had and b/prison.

If someone is claiming they can't go out and is then repeatedly seen out, thats pretty cut and dried.

However some people will let on that they claim for one thing, but really they've claimed for something else... then this is why it may appear people get away with fraud.

I know tons of people who claim social anxiety but then do all manner of things I cannot do. I do not know if they get PIP for that or for something else, only DWP and they know that, and I also have no idea what they have to do to make those activities possible, what the context of their social anxiety is, how long it takes them to recover from an activity etc etc.

I can see why some people might tell others they have an invisible condition, because they don't want to reveal other conditions - I'd be much more willing to talk about anxiety than about being unable to wipe my own bum!

You can of course report suspected fraud to the DWP - but I agree with a PP there should be some checks and balances on that too, a system where by if it turns out your report IS malicous, you may face consequences!
Then of course the only reports made would be those with clear evidence that the reporter knows the persons claim details AND that they're contravening that claim. This would probably save DWP time and money in dealing with lots of spurious 'Widdlin's stood up out of her wheelchair in Tesco last Friday, she's clearly a faker' type reports.

It's amazing how many so called PIP scammers are bragging about being fraudsters?. Apparently that's what my boyfriend did when he was reported to the DWP also the fact he was seen in the shop next door to where I live on his own once. Luckily for him all my neighbours were interviewed and admitted my boyfriend was "insane", "a weirdo""talking to invisible people","scared of people" and "smelly and unwashed" and" should be in a mental hospital" . That was enough to determine his claim was likely to be legitimate and the fraud case was dropped. People claiming PIP only have to be affected "the majority of the time" so it completely possible to go out to a party, go shopping etc and still be entitled, same for working. PIP is not an unemployment or fitness to work benefit..My neighbour with MS works full time and gets PIP, she also goes partying every couple of weeks...so what!!!!She gets PIP because she cant walk certain distances and needs helping getting bathed..none of which affects her ability to attend a party whether in a wheelchair or stick.

Critics seem to be completely ignorant of what PIp is, what the criteria is, and what kind of benefit it is.

Take a long hard look at yourself op. Go and do something more worthwhile than starting threads feigning surprise and making stereotypical judgements about how deserving other people are of PIP payments.

My daughter has panic disorder and is in receipt of PIP. Her condition is complex and results in agoraphobia. If I tried to sit and explain the effects it has on her ability to work and function it would take me a while. It's variable too. So she can look like any 19 year old until she's sliding down a wall gasping for breath. She's faced many judgments exactly from people like you. Mean people with small minds and hearts.

Try to do something nice and non judgmental today op. It will be hard but try your best!