AIBU to hope that able bodied people will support disabled people against the tory attack on PIP?

[Blackcats7]

I have just been reading posts from many terrified disabled people on a facebook group I belong to.
People are afraid for their lives after the government's recent announcement to stop huge numbers of people with mental health issues qualifying for PIP anymore.
This attempt to scapegoat disabled people has a long history in the tory party and is popular with their traditional core but the attack on PIP is a new low.
Even those claiming PIP for other reasons think they will be the next target and that the tory aim is to pretty much eradicate any support for us with the half hearted usual disguise of "concentrating help on those who need it most" when they know they can't get away with saying what they actually are doing.
Disabled people have votes too (being housebound I thank goodness for postal votes) and I think this current tactic will have a big influence on how those votes are used but my question is how many able bodied people will take this attack on us into account when it comes to the election?
Should this nightmare come to pass there will be blood on government hands because I have no doubt people will die bearing in mind the targets are people with mental health problems and the tory propaganda that they are removing a right to benefit from those who feel a little bit depressed and anxious about life as most people will at some point or another is utter nonsense. Claiming PIP is extremely hard and requires a very high bar to succeed, especially for mental health. Popping to your gp for some anti depressants would not cut it.
So we need your support.
YABU we aren't that bothered or think the govenment is quite right to stop you scrounging bastards
YANBU this is disgusting ableism and we have your back

It's obvious that the whole system is designed to be cruel and punishing to dissuade people. It's all so unnecessary.

Labour has also announced changes. https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/labour-target-job-centres-pip-assessments-disabled-people-work-3035335#:~:text=PIP%20is%20a%20payment%20to,reduce%20the%20soaring%20benefits%20bill.

It's because disabled people are linked to benefits and working people resent people on benefits, there are a few people who play on disability to get out of work and that gives all benefit recipients a bad name.
I have CFS and although they can force me to look for work, if I'm not fit for work then I'm not going to be able to do the job.
Just getting to work if I manage that will leave me unable to do any work once there, I could need days to recover.
I think apart from the disabled suffering it's unfair on the workplaces who have to waste time interviewing people who are unable to do the job and then they will be unable to let them go through the disability act.
It doesn't help anyone but makes the abled feel better about going to work.

YNBU but actually both sides have it all wrong. The emphasis should be on targetting employers to make jobs and workplaces accessible to all. Most disable people want to work, they just can't find employers willing to accomodate some changes - so really its just enforcing the Disability Discrimination Act properly.

Also employers could stop offering us mindfulness and wellbeing apps, and stop putting so much pressure on us that we crumble. Good work is the answer, not more shitty work.

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/modernising-support-for-independent-living-the-health-and-disability-green-paper/modernising-support-for-independent-living-the-health-and-disability-green-paper

Consultation here

you should read the other threads here about PIP. so much hatred to those with disabilities who need support. I doubt it.

I bet it won't be getting any better under Labour too. I have a child who will never work. it's terrifying.

I can't vote either YABU or YANBU because the truth is somewhere in the middle.

Do I blindly support ALL people claiming PIP, as it is now? No.

Do I think ALL people claiming PIP are scroungers who need it immediately removed? No.

PIP is a shit show and the current system is unsustainable. It needs urgent review and some kind of means testing on top imo. Which yes, will see some removed from it.

There is so much ignorance at the moment within both political parties...

Like the assumption that people who get PIP are out of work or that mental illness can get 'cured' with a few counselling sessions.

I receive PIP (currently taking the DWP to tribunal stage as they reduced the amount at the last review although I attempted to take my life last year when I had a breakdown so my condition has not got any better) and I have always worked.

Receiving PIP helps me with travelling to work and staying in that employment. Without that support I would likely lose my job.

I have had severe mental health issues since childhood and meds and counselling might help manage it to some degree but it will never make them go away.

Governments need to do more to promote flexible and remote working if they want more disabled people to be able to work and make it harder for employers to discriminate against disabled applicants and employees.

Because I can tell you that I have encountered so many issues in the workplace because of my mental and physical long term health conditions, from discrimination to employers trying to ignore reasonable adjustments and so on.

Please don't make sweeping statements. It is not very helpful to divide the ranks. I work and I have absolutely no resentment towards disabled people on benefits. However, if they all start universally suggesting that I am evil benefits hater, then I might just change my mind. You see how this works?
I work with many people with fatigue, including helping them to gain and maintain employment. What I learned is that not only most of them do want to work, many are also able to with a supportive and flexible employer, WFH arrangements, Access to Work scheme etc. The issue is not a disability, the issue is the society not making enough adjustments to allow disabled people to function. I gave example of my friend's quadriplegic son on a similar thread just last week. He is bed bound and needs 24/7 care but he is in a full time employment with a lot of support from charities and flexible employer.
That's not to say that the government should force people into work, but it does mean that we need to have a think about what we need to do to improve accessibility for those who want to.

Why do people think it’s easy to get pip?. It bloody isn’t and the amount of hoops you have to jump through is absolutely ridiculous.

I receive pip for fibromyalgia, anxiety, depression, joint problems, ibs, possible endo and autism/adhd (under assessment). It seems people like me will be pushed in to work despite the fact I can’t stand or sit for too long, I’m a nervous wreck and constantly need the toilet. Employers will not make adjustments for the disabled, they’ll just figure I way around it. That goes for “vouchers” too.

I think your voting options are a little extreme.

Whilst I do support the rights of disabled people to access the things and funding they need, I think that it's misguided to think that labour will be any better on this issue. The government, wearing either a blue or red rosette does not want to pay money out.

I don't vote because both conservative and labour are poor options and I certainly did not vote the current government in. I think it is problematic that people see problems and think: it's the fault of the conservatives, I'll vote labour. I was tempted by this recently because I phoned the GP with a serious symptom that is on the NHS website as needing an urgent referral. I was asked the problem and told "no appointments" and to call back for the 8am bunfight for appointments the following week. Disgraceful - you phone up with a serious problem and they just refuse to make an appointment for you. And I considered voting labour, until I remembered why you cannot make a doctors appointment anymore. It's because when Tony Blair was in office, he brought in a policy/target where GPs had to see people quickly when there was a problem (possibly within 48 hrs or something). In order to meet this target, GPs stopped making appointments and instead introduced the 8am bunfight for that day's appointments. Then, they would see people that day - because no pre existing appointments were allowed to have been made. So the 8am bunfight and the refusal of my GP surgery to make me an appointment is of labour's making. I've paid privately and now know I need surgery.

Agreed. And the extreme language turns people off from engaging, it does not foster support as it’s intended.

No matter who comes to power, they will be reviewing the benefits system.

I will be voting Labour, but am under no illusions that they will find a magic money tree.

I don’t think that they are saying PIP will or should be removed from everyone currently receiving it but the current system is unsustainable and certainly needs an overhaul to make it fit for purpose.
Of course many people couldn’t manage without additional financial support either in work or out of it, but there are some, with help, who could perhaps manage better independently.
For some people currently not working it could help with depression and feelings of isolation to be back in the workplace , for me I feel so much better when I’m busy and occupied.
I know this isn’t the same for everyone but we cannot just sign people off indefinitely, it might cost more initially in support costs but surely the aim should be to get those that can to contribute to society?

I'm sure in the 1980s that larger companies had a (possibly government set) target % to hit for disabled employees, and that this was scrapped.
I recall when the firm I work for took on a chap in a wheelchair their HR celebrated as it took them above target.

I do think having a % target for larger firms would make the workplace more accessible for disabled persons.

I don't agree with those quotas. I want to get the job because of my experience, qualifications and not because I'm disabled and they have a quota to meet.

There are three or four threads running on this subject at the moment. Posters with debilitating physical and mental conditions beside themselves with fear at the possibility of being thrust into penury and other posters nitpicking their experiences and banging on about the unsustainable costs of supporting them.

Numbers of actual claims for PIP have gone down since the last benefits revision. Data has been found to corroborate that. The amount if money being spent has gone up because the costs of living and support (such as is available) have risen because of "the economy" which is focused solely on profiteering and funnelling those profits into the hands of the entitled few at the top of the capitalist pyramid scheme.

It's no coincidence that since Covid the biggest transfer of wealth from those at the bottom of the pyramid to those at the top in decades has occurred. The number of billionaires in the UK has tripled. Disaster capitalism is a thing and we currently have no end of global disasters affecting everything economic.

Weeding out the "lead swingers" and "grifters" from the small number of people who have managed to navigate the process of getting PIp, which is a non means tested benefit that helps people work around their challenges is a smoke and mirrors diversion aimed at dividing the populous and getting people at each others throats because a larger and larger number of people cannot manage financially and the job market is precarious at best especially at the lower end of the socio-economic scale.

Yes, I hope able bodied/minded people will see this debacle for what it is because it takes one moment, one unfortunate event, or a series to tip a person from the former group into needing support and services which are being decimated while MPs claim expenses for breakfasts that cost the same as some people's entire food budget for a family for a week.

I honestly think it is unlikely that the disabled as a whole will get much support, especially those with mental health conditions.

So many people who are in work are struggling at the moment financially and dealing with the emotional toil that takes, that there is limited sympathy available for others.

Could you please share the data that PIP claims have gone down? I agree that the money spent has gone up.

The Tories are running out of people to demonise. Their endless 'Stop The Boats' mantra isn't having the desired effect so they're casting around for other targets. They are despicable.
However, I don't expect them to be in power for long enough to take action and they know that. It's just grandstanding for votes.

It's on two other threads i think and I don't know how to find it or post it here. I shall appeal to the original poster if I can find them.

I shall help in supporting the cause by not voting Tory.

Not that I would ever have considered voting for them anyway.

In the consultation it mentions other countries use of diagnosis and there is no mention that previously DLA did this, maybe they should learn from / have kept it as it was.

Absolutely every word of this is so true and so well written, please t take time people to read this from @MistressoftheDarkSide .