Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Fear and debate around governments disability payments proposed shake up.

121 replies

MistressoftheDarkSide · 26/04/2024 16:40

Thought I would start a thread to keep this topic relevant as the first thread started by another poster has filled up.

I think it is important to keep this subject in people's minds and explore the whole subject.

It is exceedingly complex and there are bigger picture issues at play that get overlooked I feel.

I think people with direct experience should be able to express themselves and be part of the debate.

Solidarity with those at the thin edge of the wedge.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
OP posts:
WiseKhakiGoose · 29/04/2024 19:51

"Pip, the benefit these reforms are coming for, was itself a reform of the disability living allowance. It is known for assessment criteria so harsh and nonsensical that, if anxiety isn’t one of your symptoms at the start of it, it generally is by the end." - spot on, she's right! I was pleased to read the article.

WiseKhakiGoose · 29/04/2024 20:11

"And they follow a speech in which the prime minister announced major changes to the welfare system earlier this month, saying “people with less severe mental health conditions should be expected to engage with the world of work”." - I can hear the air of superiority in Rishi Sunak words! He has no empathy towards people with mental health issues and thinks is all fake.

How can he say "expected to engage with the world of work"?! He has no idea what medium mental issues is, right? How medium mental health issues may become severe mental health issues in a matter of days.

I think he thinks medium mental health issues for which people receive benefits are similar to his feelings, when he becomes irritated that his coffee is 30 mins late or too cold.

Rishi Sunak is talking about mental health issues like Marie Antoinette once talked about hungry people: "Let them eat cake!".

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

IClaudine · 29/04/2024 20:34

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

The consultation is about PIP, which working people can claim.

TomeTome · 29/04/2024 21:07

The point of pip is to level the playing field and allow disabled people more independence. It doesn’t replace income, the benefit that is supposed to provide emergency income if you don’t earn enough or are unemployed without savings is Universal Credit.

LiterallyOnFire · 29/04/2024 21:13

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

I claim PIP despite earning quite well.

It pays for things that help me stay in the workforce despite disability.

Physio, hydro, a cleaner and a couple of other things.

PIP has never been designed or intended as an income replacement benefit. It's to help meet the extra costs that disability entails.

As a matter of fact you have to claim it before retirement age, and if you have an award payments then continue into retirement. (And yes I know not all disabled people can work but a lot of us can and do, despite significant impairments. Disability is a diverse umbrella.)

LiterallyOnFire · 29/04/2024 21:15

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

Oh and two of the major reasons for the growth in people sick and disabled are 1) Increased recognition of MH problems and 2) A failing NHS.

WiseKhakiGoose · 29/04/2024 21:20

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

  1. Do you think people on purpose get physical health issues or mental health issues to be out of work? What kind of person will be happy to live with this kind of money on purpose?

Standard allowanceYou’ll get one standard allowance for your household.
How much you’ll get
Monthly standard allowance
If you’re single and under 25
£311.68
If you’re single and 25 or over
£393.45
If you live with your partner and you’re both under 25
£489.23 (for you both)
If you live with your partner and either of you are 25 or over
£617.60 (for you both)

  1. Good point, I wish the government would have done it, instead they bully people who are unable to work because of their health issues.

  2. The government can do it, sick people will happily tell them. There's no need to bully sick people by cutting the benefits straight away and let them starve to death!

XenoBitch · 29/04/2024 21:30

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

1 - address why. I know someone who had to leave her job as she is still waiting for a cataract op, but ran through her sick pay, then half pay... now nothing. She has had to leave her job and go on UC. She is on PIP, and has had to give up her car so she can actually eat and pay bills now. Her world has become very small.

2 - no one would disagree on that, but people and their issues are complicated. There is no one size fits all therapy/treatment for anything. And people that are too poorly to work are being blamed for the nation's financial issues, when a lot of their problems are caused by financial issues.

3- an employer that will ignore years/decades long gaps on your CV, an employer that will take you on despite your DBS flagging things up, an employer who will be flexible enough to let you work the shifts and hours you feel able too without threat of going down the sickness disciplinary route. An employer that will give you reasonable adjustments to enable you to do your job.

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 21:41

That cataract op point is ridiculous. My employer (private sector) gives me private health insurance to ensure things like this are addressed immediately and I am back at work. All employees ought to be treated just as promptly.

Alwayswrongmoment · 29/04/2024 21:59

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 20:21

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

  1. we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

  2. we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

1). We can’t afford to keep paying an ever increasing number of people not to work.

People aren't being 'paid not to work'. People suffering from illness or disability are given subsistence money, and also they are part of the 'we' because everyone, working or not, pays tax.

2) we need to work out what is making our population dramatically sicker and address that quickly.

The cost of living crisis and resulting increased poverty (and also the punitive benefits system) affects mental wellbeing and physical health.

Long and growing NHS secondary care wait lists, and increasing difficulties accessing a GP. What might initially be something fairly easily and quickly treatable becomes something more serious by the time it's seen by the right person.

The poor state of social care and other public services. People aren't getting timely or effective support.

Increased state pension age. People no longer in good health who would've been getting a pension but now have to claim sickness benefit. There's also a knock on effect on youth unemployment. More people retiring at an older age means less vacancies for younger people.

3) we need to ask the sick what needs to be put in place for them to work.

Sort out 1) and 2) and also look at the hiring practices of businesses. Many are unwilling to hire or keep on people with illnesses and disabilities. Many sick and disabled people need flexibility and adjustments in the workplace. The opposite is often the case (like policies around maximum days sick leave).

Another question however is, where are the jobs?
916,000 vacancies, but over 1 million job seekers. So there's not even enough jobs for everyone on job seekers, let alone people on sickness benefits.

XenoBitch · 29/04/2024 22:08

Monstersunderthesea · 29/04/2024 21:41

That cataract op point is ridiculous. My employer (private sector) gives me private health insurance to ensure things like this are addressed immediately and I am back at work. All employees ought to be treated just as promptly.

Yes, you are ok and have private healthcare, so everyone else is obviously the same. I might claim PIP for the amount of eyerolling I am doing.

My friend is now unemployed (and early 60s... wont get a job because age discrimination is a thing), has given up her car she had from PIP so she can claw back £300p to live.

Thevelvelletes · 29/04/2024 22:09

Here's hoping the Tories put in the same effort with tax evasion by big business.doubt it because that's their future employers.

JenniferBooth · 29/04/2024 23:33

@XenoBitch How long has she been waiting, Friend of mine has his op next week and his initial appointment was last August

JenniferBooth · 29/04/2024 23:34

And once more with feeling
PIP IS NOT AN OUT OF WORK BENEFIT

XenoBitch · 29/04/2024 23:36

JenniferBooth · 29/04/2024 23:33

@XenoBitch How long has she been waiting, Friend of mine has his op next week and his initial appointment was last August

She has been waiting since last summer. Has lost her job as a result.

Thevelvelletes · 29/04/2024 23:38

JenniferBooth · 29/04/2024 23:34

And once more with feeling
PIP IS NOT AN OUT OF WORK BENEFIT

Even if it was , going after the disabled is disgusting.these fuckers spend more on expenses.not all claimants are fraudsters.

JenniferBooth · 30/04/2024 00:11

XenoBitch · 29/04/2024 23:36

She has been waiting since last summer. Has lost her job as a result.

Same length of time as my friend but he is retired. The NHS waiting lists are a huge part of the problem

XenoBitch · 30/04/2024 00:15

JenniferBooth · 30/04/2024 00:11

Same length of time as my friend but he is retired. The NHS waiting lists are a huge part of the problem

Yes, absolutely! Pisses me off when people are blamed for not going back to work, when they are literally waiting for an operation so they can go back to work.

JenniferBooth · 30/04/2024 00:21

@XenoBitch The reps and activists speaking out for the NHS during Covid are strangely silent over NHS waiting lists whenever sickness/disability benefits are threatened with being cut. Even though the connection is obvious

New posts on this thread. Refresh page