Realistic for SIL to rely on inheriting mother's London house

[Opalfleur2025]

SIL is 25 this year and told me she plans on "winging it' through life like her father. What her father did was that he got 100k out of the divorce settlement (despite not working through most of the marriage but he did buy a house jointly with MIL) and then moved to an Asian country where he has a new wife.

I think she is saying this because she knows that MIL would pass the whole house to her which I am fine with. She lives at home and earns a modest amount every month writing online i.e £1k per month. No plans to move out or increase earnings, and limited potential as she has no gcses

I am interested if this is realistic. I read that care can cost up to 65k per annum so assuming MIL goes into a care home for 3 years, that would only be around £210k? House is a 3 bed victorian terrace in zone 3 london so worth around £600k today so there should be plenty left for SIL? MIL's mum died of dementia and I suppose these things are hereditary.

I am a fan of Gary's economics and his view is that for poorer people who own homes (where they don't have other assets) all of the assets will be absorbed in retirement or end of life costs. MIL doesn't have a pension other than state pension and she is self employed (but her profession is under severe threat from AI and she is in her 60s). I know Gary's parents lived in London (owned a house that is pretty much identical to MIL's house) and so probably so did his grandparents? Yet according to him, there was absolutely no inheritance even if they did own their homes.

I also expect that many older people may sell their houses to pay for ancillary medical costs due to long nhs waiting lists.

DH and i own our home in London and we are making provision for our old age so inheritance not a concern for us.

Haven't read the whole thread but I do like Gary's ecconomics. I think it's reasonable to ponder these things.

It's hardly like you are breaking down the door asking for anyone fanical planning documents.

my mum cared for my dad at home right to the end (with some support from me). but if he hadn't had that support at home, he would have had to be in a care home for 7 years or so and a nursing home for 2, so I think you are underestimating the cost of care. also, the person needs to be willing and able to do the care. it is full on and someone who thinks they need to 'enjoy life everyday' probably is not going to be able to do it.

I think the only way she can guarantee that the money isn't spent on care is probably to put the house in daughter name before MIL gets sick. not sure of the legality of that though?

i think a big part of it is trying to make sense of the current situation..

Like if you listen to gary's economics (and he has a history of predicting this stuff), he says that for most young people of ordinary backgrounds, they would have no wealth and their wealth would be lost to the rich (and people like my MIL would lose their asset to care home fees and end of life costs etc). So ordinary people (which I count my SIL as given she has a modest income and no qualifications) should rally around him cos they would be on the front line.

But if she is going to inherit a house or at least quite a large part of that, i don't blame her if she is not going to go up in arms over the rapidly increasing societal inequality., Many people are selfish. my SIL would also not be the only person in this relatively fortunate situation. If she inherits the house, then she would probably be relatively unscathed come what may unless we cancel nhs or something drastic like that.

It just means that we may become even more divided and not just the rich against the poor. But the lucky poor vs the unlucky poor.

We're currently planning on care home costs for my DM coming in at around £2.5k per week, so a lot more than in your OP

It's just such a dumb thing to rely on, frankly.

My parents are both still alive, well in their 80s. My GPs lived until well into their 90s and I expect my parents to probably do the same. Neither has currently any serious health issues.

I'm around 60. Haven't inherited yet. My eldest sister sadly died at 57, without inheriting. Relying on 'I'm gonna get your house when you are gone' is just stupid. Your SIL might not outlive her mother!

Your SIL is likely to be pretty old if and when she ever gets anything. If you look at King Charles - he was 73 when he finally inherited from his mother. Frankly, your MIL might sell her house and go travelling. Or meet a younger man. She might need it for care home fees. Anything could happen.

yeah, it's frigging shit isn't it. I don't know what youngers are supposed to do anymore. not everyone can or should do highly qualified/well paid jobs. how are all the essential workers and creatives supposed to have secure accomodation

I have never heard of Gary. thanks for bringing him to my attention

It’s changed. The house will be taken into account, except in certain circumstances.

‘If the local council is arranging your care home, they'll do a means test to decide how much you should pay towards it, and they may take into account the value of your home. A means test is a financial assessment where the local council calculates how much you need to pay towards the cost of your care”

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/care/paying-for-care/paying-for-a-care-home/do-i-have-to-sell-my-home-to-pay-for-care/#:~:text=If%20the%20local%20council%20is,the%20cost%20of%20your%20care.

1 Many people do need care towards the end of their lives but their care needs are met/ masked by partners - many offspring have no idea. So as your MIL has no spouse that could be an issue. The relevant stats are how many people are in care over aged 85 and how many not in care are with partners. Amongst my peers pretty much everyone’s remaining parents needed care at some point -

2 There would be some small IHT to pay and also some probate court fees. Labour are also likely to reform IHT upwards I suspect certainly remove the main residence allowance so single person nil rate goes back to £360 in which case tax payable at 40% on 240,000. They objected vociferously to that main house allowance thing.

3 Funeral expenses

4 Maintenance of house costs

5 Your MIL is almost my age and I have no intention of dying soon. She might suddenly decide to have a toy boy or splurge on holidays.

My understanding was that there was no need to sell your property to pay for care. If all your money is tied up in a house then your care will be paid for once your savings (not including your home) go under a certain threshold. I know this is what happened with my mum (although admittedly I don't know the details).

This is correct for care in your own home.

You spend an awful lot of time thinking about your SIL's life.

Good for your relative, but a generation later the cost of trades in London is sky high, and construction materials have also rocketed disproportionately.

Condition can make a considerable difference. Especially if the MIL has neglected wiring, roof etc.

Or if your partner or a dependent relative still live in the house.

She has never replaced the roof nor would she ever replace it I suspect.

Never rewired it either.

The kitchen is still the same as the one 27 years ago. So is the bathroom, you pull a cord to turn on the light.

She will never change it. I wonder how it would be priced 30 years from now... which is obviously only relevant if she goes into care. If she doesn't then it would be good if the house is valued as low as possible and SIL can continue living there though if the roof falls on her, not sure what would happen.

Which part of the country are you in? That sounds horrendously high.

well I wish her luck, she's going to need it.

MiL could live til her late 80s - 90s and end up in a care home and SiL will have nothing to support her. House will get sold for care fees. Easily £1500 a month now, what's it going to be in however many years time. She will have no claim on the house and the council won't care that she needs to move out and find her own place to rent.

This is assuming MiL doesn't sell up much sooner and move to Sicily to be with a toy boy. What not?! Sounds like she might like a bit of fun rather than sitting about with a greedy overgrown child.

Someone upthread mentioned Pension credit. If you qualify for the full new state pension doesn't it just push you over by a few pounds a week the threshold for pension credit so you miss out on a lot of benefits that would bring like council tax subsidy, TV licence, warm homes grant? A single person's income needs to be below £218.15 to qualify. New full state pension after the rise this year is £221.20.

In answer to your question regarding Gary's economics, yes he is correct. What is even more interesting is that it will be the generation of Maggie's first time buyers in the 1980s who will in fact be most impacted. Personally, what I find interesting is that by selling the council housing, she was meant to make those people into home owners and Tory voters. 40 years later - rather than passing on their assets, yes, they will mostly now have to spend it on private health, boosting their pensions and care fees. Ironically, for many of those people; arguably staying in those council houses would have worked out the same. But it has now become much worse for the country and their kids who will never again get an assured tenancy.

So while for 30 to 40 years the British lower middle classes dreamt of having acquired their castle, they had in fact borrowed it. And for many of them, their kids and grandkids will be much worse as a result. And in fact; the system is going back to how it was quite a while back i.e. that you need to own multiple assets to be truly ok in this system and to pass on things to one's descendants.

Care cap does not exist yet. Been pushed to touch twice now, chance it will be pushed out again.
and the £86k was set long before Covid- there’s a strong likelihood it’ll have to be higher at £100k or above given inflationary costs.

Care cap is also only for the care bit and not the hotel fees which make up a large part of the care home fees

This is exceptional…average is 800 days, 50% are 400 days…so there is along tail of small minority that are longer than 800 days

AND it’s still “ only” 15% of over 85s in care homes.

my dad lived on his own, he has lewy bodies dementia and is now at end of life care- he only went into home last year age 87 . Up until then he managed with carers.

Theres a lot of bleak catastophising that everyone ends up with dementia and in care homes. This is not true. Heart disease/stroke is still biggest killer in over 70s, followed by cancer. These account for pretty much half of deaths . Dementias are citied as contributors in 25%…but are comorbidities as people often die from other causes like pneumonia. 30% of deaths are “ others” ( none of above). 10% are COPD. and no, they don’t add to 100% because of comorbidities.

sorry to throw stats about- the issue is the dementia is a grotesque disease ( my poor dad is case in point it is horrendous including being sectioned etc) and it rightly scares the pants out of everyone that this will be our and our relatives ending and well frazzle away our savings on that care. In practice, the “ years in a care home” ( past that 800 days) is a small and tragic minority.

It's not realistic - and frankly, it is revolting to be viewing someone as a future cashcow upon their death, which may not be for another thirty or forty years in any case.

It is also none of your business. Your SIL's silly plan/lack of planning. Or your MIL's finances, or how she keeps her house or doesn't upkeep it.

She is in her sixties and working. Dementia is not particularly hereditary in the vast majority of cases - lifestyles and epigenetics are major factors - and you have already calculated her care home fees.

I am interested if this is realistic. I read that care can cost up to 65k per annum so assuming MIL goes into a care home for 3 years, that would only be around £210k?

Your SIL is young and silly, and made a passing comment perhaps, given the microscopic detail you seem to apply to other people's lives and choices.

Well she'll need luck on her side. My poor old mum had a catastrophic (paralysis) stroke at 73 and had to go into care, where she stayed for 10yrs before passing away. Ironically, her assets were nearly down to the £23k allowed when she died, but the care ate up the entire value of her estate (house, savings, pension payments the lot) over those 10yrs. Fortunately, I nor my brother were counting on it, and were expecting her to actually outlive us all :0(

SIL is 25 and single. Who knows what she'll be doing and where she'll be in 10 years?

For gods sake, shes 25 and foolish

why are you dwelling on this stuff? Live your life the way you want and think is right and let her get on with hers

This isn’t remotely unusual - you have one of the siblings staying home with an elderly mother. It usually does fall on one. Our entire care system relies on these voluntary angels.

Others have done the calculations - she’s likely to get £100k and that is still banking on an average stay at care home which no one can predict. It could be nothin. Or it could be around £200k. You’d still struggle to buy a flat anywhere near London for that tbh.

Im not sure if your concern comes from a form of envy but I would say that if she stays home and ends up caring for the mum, she will have more than earnt it. She will have likely put her own life on hold which is surprisingly easy to do when you have an older parent who you worry about - will they be lonely? What about health needs now or in future? The list is endless and increases over the years if they do decline which most do at least a bit.

I also did this at 25. My father was in his 70s. I bet her mum isn’t that worried, why would she be, she is probably liking status quo & may even be relying on this daughter too.