‘Mean girl’

[backinthebox]

I got called a mean girl today. DS was taking part in a team endurance event. He did not get to choose his teammates, the organisers did, and he was teamed up with another boy and 2 girls, we suspect because they wanted his good navigation and teamwork skills to balance out the refusal of the girls to learn or practice.

One of the girl’s mothers was convinced her DD would not finish. She repeatedly said in front of her daughter she did not expect her to finish. I said she would finish - it was a team event and there was no part even starting if you were expecting to bring your whole team down, it was not fair on the others.

They were making good progress and based on the speed they were keeping up we headed down to the finish line to cheer them in. They were only about 10 minutes from the finish line, but did not appear. Find Friends showed them not moving, just out of sight of the finish line, and they stayed there for about 40 minutes. Eventually they appeared over the brow of the hill, in a much bigger group than they had set off in, and sat down. All the members of this group were girls, except for DS and one other boy, and they did not sit down. The organisers and assembled parents were wondering what was going on. They stayed sat down for another 10 minutes, in sight of the finish line, with DS and the other boy standing some way apart from the.

Eventually they got up and crossed the finish. DS had said that they had been going fine until they had caught up with another team made up of all girls, and then they had slowed to the other team’s speed. When they had asked the girls in their team to keep walking, the other team had said they were bullying the girls and would be reported and disqualified. The boys were desperately keen to finish, so they backed off. The girls then started throwing food at them. They had sat down and refused to move in direct response to the pleas from the boys to keep moving - it was a power play move to show they could control whether they crossed the finish line or not.

The mother who thought her daughter wouldn’t finish was delighted with her DD’s performance, and was amazed she had finished at all. Happily telling anyone in earshot that just finishing was more than she had hoped for and that her DD normally refuses to finish any physical activity and has never walked more than a couple of miles before. I replied that perhaps it would do her good to get out and walk a bit more - if she was going to take part in team hiking events knowingly setting out to scupper the team is unfair to the other team members. For this, I was called a mean girl.

AIBU to think that 1. telling your child repeatedly that they are going to fail is probably setting them up to fail, and 2. you don’t put your child onto a team of enthusiastic participants if you know your child is likely to sabotage the other kids’ efforts, and 3. you don’t praise your child when you’ve stood and watched her actively sabotaging her team?

It made me really quite cross, and quite sad for DS and the other boy. I’ve told DS that sometimes you get stuck with team members that you just can’t motivate, and he did well to keep his enthusiasm to the end. I will be making sure he isn’t stuck with the known difficult members next year though.

Sounds like exactly the sort of thing that parents should keep out of tbh.

Isn't the point of these things to learn teamwork anyway? He learnt that he cant just expect other people to do things the way he wants, simply because he wants them to. The girls learnt they can do more than they're capable of, but also that they don't have to pushed around if they don't want to and that certain competitions can indeed be opted out of.

They'd spent 7 hrs together so im sure theres a backstory and the girls would have a different version of events anyway.

You're right, I had misunderstood that part.

You sound intense. I'm wondering if this has rubbed off on your son, and perhaps he and his friend crossed the line into bullying the girls, leading them to switch off and ultimately abandon their team mates. A team needs to work together not just have a bully and subordinates.

Have you talked to him about it, or just assumed the girls were at fault?

“You sound intense.” Yup, I am. I know this, it doesn’t bother me. It’s weird, isn’t it - just a couple of weeks ago one of the trending threads on MN was cheering Jasmin Paris (one of my heroes) on to sprint the final few metres of her race, but when it comes to wanting a bunch of girls to just walk the last few metres of a different race, it’s considered ‘intense,’ and not in a good way. I know you think they are just kids, but at this age they can still be on a pathway towards the person they will be when they grow up. My DD, at the same age DS and this girl are now, had her eyes firmly on competing for her country, which she has now achieved. You want intense? I look laid back compared to her. 🤣 It’s a peculiarly MN thing to be embarrassed about being good at something, or to want to do well. It reminds me of being at school, when the cool kids did not get good grades and there was something defective in their eyes with a child that did get good grades, or who had ambition. Far cooler to be a loser. 🙄

This was an event my DS wanted to do well in, and his team did not do as well as he had hoped. It could be because the team dynamic broke down (which could be any or all of the team member’s fault) or it could be because not everyone in the team was as interested as he was, or any number of other reasons. What I know is that he did not abandon his team, he did his best, and he accepted his finishing time with good grace.

I don't think anybody's disapproved of ambition or achievement here. You're very eager to brand the less ambitious or lower achievers as 'losers', and you may reasonably expect disapproval for that.

I still don't understand why the hell you dismiss the non-walking girl's completion of a very long hike as some sort of failure; it looks like a real achievement for her! We're clearly never going to learn what was behind the protest. They wouldn't have done that if they were just not interested; presumably they could have dropped out in that case. It's certain the team dynamic broke down and you don't seem bothered about how it happened.

Still, enjoy your superiority and I'm sure DS will get a happier result next time.

It’s a peculiarly MN thing to be embarrassed about being good at something, or to want to do well

OP you’re labouring under the misapprehension that people are getting at you for wanting your son to win or do well.

They aren’t.

They’re getting at you because you won’t accept that not every child and parent has the same motivation as you do for competing in that event.

Do you have nothing to say about your son being accused of bullying? I’d be deeply worried if that was my son even if he excelled at sports!

OP, you’re not making this any better for yourself with your responses 🙄

The initial AIBU was about you being called a mean girl. Your comment to the other mother about her child was indeed mean. That mother’s self-restraint in only calling you a mean girl was admirable tbh.

I think whats happened to your son OP is actually a tough lesson in what happens when you’re a shit team mate. You don’t win. The boys were clearly behaving terribly towards the girls for them all to decide to essentially boycott the race.

The boys thought speed alone would win them this race - when actually they’d have finished the race much quicker had they been more supportive, understanding and patient of their team mates. As a sportswoman and the mother of a sport woman I’m surprised you haven’t learnt that by now

I still don't understand why the hell you dismiss the non-walking girl's completion of a very long hike as some sort of failure; it looks like a real achievement for her!

Good point.

I thought the event with it being a kids one would have been a 2 hour job. But 7-9 hours is incredible for any 12yo to finish - and rather than saying “well done to your DD” OP decided to make a bitchy passive aggressive comment.

The other mum was far nicer than I’d have been

So they were making very good time, over 7-9 hours, but slowed down and ultimately stopped within sight of the finish line.

There must be a reason and I doubt it's laziness or lack of motivation, not after 7-9 hours of making good time.

Have you asked ds what prompted them all to do this?

Have you asked ds what prompted them all to do this?

From the OP the girls stopped because the boys were bullying them. It’s not clear if the stopping was in protest of the bullying or because they were upset.

You must realise that there are few 12 year olds who are on a pathway to become Jasmin Paris and most people tend not to interact with them on that basis. If you’re happy with your own intensity levels and your son’s good grace then what is it you’re annoyed about? Is it that you don’t want to be called a mean girl? Maybe in that case you should channel your competitiveness into practising your people skills, because they’re a lot (a LOT) more important than your sporting ability in pretty much every scenario you’ll encounter - including sport-based ones - and it sounds like you and your kids are getting some pretty poor outcomes from your behaviours as it stands.

I would have been annoyed on ds behalf as well

having said that it will keep happening to him in group work for gcse and A levels and uni believe it or not, so maybe a learning opportunity for him now that its all over

incredibly frustrating

i got a good chuckle out of this OP. You are missing the point somewhat.

presumably jasmin paris runs because she wants to, not because some jumped up teenage boy is telling her to.

You seem like one of those proud parents who thinks their kids can do no wrong. Most people don't care about this stuff as much as your family do, that's life. You're not wrong for having your own priorities but you are, at best, naive and, at worst, entitled, for expecting everyone to share them in order to keep your son happy.

if this becomes a repeat issue for him maybe he should consider solo sports instead of team ones.

I know you think they are just kids, but at this age they can still be on a pathway towards the person they will be when they grow up.

Absolutely agree. Sounds like your son
may be on the pathway to becoming someone who wants to win at all costs, even if it means bullying teammates to do so.

You keep ignoring the bullying accusation, even though it seems by far the most plausible explanation of why they decided to sit down, and is indeed the explanation given by your own son.

Have you even asked him what he was doing that they regarded as bullying? Or are you one of those people whose child is never in the wrong?

Whatever about the lack of enthusiasm - if someone threw food at my children I'd be making an official complaint. If there's anyone to complain to! You are not the mean girl in this.

My god I feel sorry for the OP. It's a race. It should be competitive, it is innately competitive, and declaring someone an effective bully because of what is a natural instinct is absurd. What the son has possibly learned is actually a negative, which is that some aspects of female culture are so communal that he should disregard them. A perverse result if you believe that girls should be empowered or capable themselves.

A team race. It’s not only speed, or the boys could finish alone.

DS got frustrated with less capable friends on DoE. I pointed out that supporting them was part of the task.

Civilisation flourishes if we support our weakest members. Otherwise it’s pretty dog eat dog.

I’m team collaboration.

Well yes; support your team members. It's very easy for the sexes to split and boys just to steam ahead. That didn't happen here, so I reckon the boy will probably get the "girls are lame in teams" message.

declaring someone an effective bully because of what is a natural instinct is absurd

None of us have any idea what the OP’s son actually did. Of course just asking your teammates if they are able to go faster is ok, but for all we know he might have been shouting in the girls’ faces to hurry up, or physically pushing them. Which would be bullying.

If it's the kind of club/event where teams of mixed ability are put together, then the participants like your son are going to have to manage their expectations and be prepared to keep pace with their slower teammates, rather than expecting them to struggle to maintain their own pace and potentially not finish.

The girls food-throwing and sit down protest is really bad, but idk if the boys behaviour was 💯 great either, depending on the manner in which they tried to chivvy the girls on.

The girls then started throwing food at them.

Brilliant 😆 thanks OP, your post is the funniest thing I've read yet today!

I also think “bullying” is an allegation that it often dished out too easily and I usually take it with a pinch of salt. (And I am not denying that genuine bullying does happen).

I did ask him what exactly caused the girls to threaten to report him as a bully. He went red and quite sheepish, and I thought, ‘here it comes’ because I am actually aware that my children are not perfect. He said the girls had sat down at a checkpoint with the other team, and had not wanted to get up because they had started chatting with them and wanted to carry on chatting. He had rolled his eyes and muttered ‘bloody hell’ and they said he had used bad language and would report him for that, and he had replied ‘look, let’s just keep walking.’ The girls said ‘you can’t make us’ and the other team threw food at him then. He got upset by this, and shouted at them to stop. And they went ‘oooooooh’ and laughed and completely ignored him and the other boy. He had not said anything more to them after this point, just waited for them to decide when to make a move, because he was upset that he might not get a finish if the team did not finish together, but he felt rather powerless to influence the behaviour of what was now a group of 7 girls so he didn’t bother as he didn’t really know what to say. His quietness made him even more of a target for the girls, as they perceived an easy victim who wasn’t going to answer back. So do I thing he was guilty of bullying behaviour? Certainly not from what I have seen or heard.

I think what he has learnt is that sometimes you just get lumbered with difficult teammates. There is plenty of ‘your son needs to learn to work in a team’ being thrown around, but far fewer people thinking that perhaps there were others in the team who also need to learn to be in a team too. The girl had never intended to finish, and my DS had been asked to cajole her into completing the task, by her own mother. If completing this event in any way at all is considered to be a success for this girl, then imo my DS has completed his task.

I’m probably projecting because my DD is being bullied and school and her bully’s parents don’t give a fuck, but people like the OP are exactly the kind of parent who’s little diddums is so sporty and eager to win that they think they can never be horrible to anyone even when it states them in the face