To have expected my daughters to be flower girls

[Notmotherofflowergirls]

Just created an account for people to pile on to me and tell me I am an idiot. I don’t think I can tell my real friends.
I am inwardly cringing!
My brother is getting married in 3 months time to a woman with no nieces or nephews.
My mother and I naturally assumed that my two girls 4 and 6 would be the flower girls. There are no other kids in the family although stepdad has grandchildren.
My mother was feeling left out of all the planning. DB was uncommunicative about the plans and always referred us to SiL and when my mum asked to contribute she was batted away.
Finally Mum insisted that she would buy the flower girl dresses and finally brother agreed. So on Wednesday SiL posted an invoice for three flower girl dresses from a Shop in Dublin. She included a nice note saying that she mustn’t feel obliged to pay.
My mum asked who the third dress was for: it turns out all three are for her cousin’s girls.
Brother came round and said that they will be only kids at wedding.
My brother was asked point blank if he didn’t want his nieces there and all he could say was he would speak with SiL. He did look sheepish.
My dad died and while my mum has not remarried she has been with her partner for 9 years. His kids are not invited. My stepdad isn’t going and is angry that my mum has been made to feel so upset.
I feel as if I have been kicked in the guts. My mum keeps bursting into tears.
My DH says he’s ongoing either Have we overstepped? Would anyone else have made the same assumption?

Nothing you have said supports your assumption that she is at fault. And she has to be 'in charge' if he, like so many men CBA step up! In fact sending the receipt probably went something like this..
BIL : Mum wants to pay for the flower girl dresses.
SIL : Why?
BIL: I don't know, she's banging on about it so just send her the bill.
And so she did... with no foreknowledge of the expectation in the first place!

SIL would be wrong to exclude the groom's family. However, she is not wrong to avoid 'striving to include' them. That's his job, and his fault for not doing so! It is HIM that hasn't pushed to include his family. Not her.

Like I said. If they had limited numbers and he made the decision to exclude them in favour of others why blame the SIL. At this point we just don't know the full story.

Also given the dresses are from dublin i assume its an Irish wedding. this is a different proposition to an English one.

Its fairly normal / standard to assume theyd be flower girls - honestly it would be VERY unusual NOT to have the grooms nieces in the circs described.

ABirdsEyeView they weren't asked to be flower girls. The mil was trying to push her own agenda wanting to be involved when it wasn't anything to do with her. She's ended up with egg on her face because the bride had already picked her flower girls and said she didn't have to pay. They were never asked that's key information here.

I don’t think yabu at all, it is your brothers wedding too! And if she was a nice enough woman she would of included your side of the family too esp niece’s but instead she’s asked her 2nd cousins to be flower girls and not invited your girls at all tbh I would feel a bit pissed with that too!
when we got married we choose our date around my sil’s visit back to the uk (she lives in oz) just so that her dc could be flower girl and page boy as we knew how much they would of loved it. I wanted a good relationship with my in laws so until this day 10 years later we include them in a lot of stuff we do and have a great relationship because of it.

I honestly think that revenge absence (as being planned by step dad and DH) is petty and reflects more badly on the sulkers then on those who created the initial issue.

Taking the high road with dignity, robs others of the chance to feel justified in their decision.

Your mum can reply 'Sorry, miscommunication, I thought x and y would be flower girls. No worries - probably not appropriate for me to pay though. By the way how is the wedding present list coming on? Lots of love xxx'. then buy crap present

Yes you've massively overstepped and I'm baffled as to why you would have made such an assumption! If the bride hasn't asked your DDs to be flower girls, surely the assumption would be that they're not? Your mum, her partner, you and your DH are all being v unreasonable making such a fuss - it's your brother and sister in law to be who get to decide who's invited and who's in the wedding party. Are you all trying to ruin the day for everyone?

@GreatGateauxsby I have been to many English weddings- most weddings (whether small or large) have invited family children. It is very unusual to not invite neices and nephews if other children are invited

To be honest I’m shocked that your daughters aren’t invited to the wedding at all. I can see how given she has no nieces or nephews, you’d thought that your daughters would be flower girls too.

I like this.

Her kids aren’t even invited, of course she’s annoyed. Especially If the brides side has children coming.

Weddings should be equal but it's understandable that a new mum only wants her close family for at least a few days postpartum. I made my in-laws wait a week and mil threw a tantrum. Childbirth was very traumatic and I was badly injured. I just wanted dp and my parents.

You said we, not you, included your SIL.
Yet here you place the blame solely on the shoulders of the woman! Why?
If he doesn't care enough about his family to include them why should she?

Id say this was plausible EXCEPT for...The fiance knows the score full well with her "mustnt feel obliged"

on Wednesday SiL posted an invoice for three flower girl dresses from a Shop in Dublin. She included a nice note saying that she mustn’t feel obliged to pay

Agree DB is a totally useless wet week.

Like i said when she has kids and wants to tap up ypur DM for free childcare with her lost of rulz and hang out with you i would have very little interest

Agree.

OP’s mum reminds me a bit like my mum. When I was getting married my mum assumed my sister would be a bridesmaid or MOH. I had no intention of even having bridesmaids and my MOH was going to be my best friend. My sister and I rarely got along and she constantly picked fights and ridiculed me and if she wasn’t family I wouldn’t have had her there in the first place, barely wanted my parents there with the way they act. My mum also was annoyed that my cousin who was a photographer didn’t offer to do the photos of our wedding. I not only didn’t plan on her doing so but was never going to ask her to begin with. I invited said cousin as a guest and if I’m going to be asking people for or to do things I would be doing it myself not through my mother.

It’s totally normal though for both sets of parents to contribute to a wedding though (not all parents of course, but it’s not at all unusual). I think a lot of times rather than just give a lump sum of money one a set of parents might say “we’ll pay for x,y &z.”
If she had said she would pay for eg the wedding cake (totally reasonable) would she be expecting to say exactly who was allowed to eat some cake?
She paid for the invitations, would she get to choose who got one?
I can totally see how it could be interpreted as just a contribution to wedding costs and gratefully received and used to pay for dresses for the bridesmaids the bride chose.
I can also totally see that the Mother of the Groom tried to force her hand by buying dresses for her grandchildren and it has backfired massively. She wanted to pay for the flower girl dresses for this wedding, and she has been sent the bill, so she should pay it.

Well yes, because she might have only just realised that there was an expectation!
It's different from her reaction if this was raised at the planning stages but if the dresses were already bought then it's all been organised already.

Also I doubt she's going to ask for childcare. At any rate on MN there's zero obligation for GP to do so.

YABVU to presume you children would be flower girls but not to expect them to be invited. Remember, it’s not your wedding and it’s normal
for bridesmaids etc to be from bride’s side.

To think this sort of thing is why people just elope.

Yes I said WE as it was my husbands day just as much as mine! So HIS family were included just as much as mine were too. Do agree with you though as I started rambling on and left that bit out but yes her brother is just as much at fault here and should speak up for his family, he sounds a bit weak to me and just leaving the bride to get on with it.

My mother and I naturally assumed that my two girls 4 and 6 would be the flower girls.

I would have outright asked much earlier rather than assume- but I'd be annoyed my kids closer in relation to couple weren't even invited to wedding.

I'd blame your brother but as PP said massive step back -show up smile - at least you and your DMum will have each other on the day even if your step Dad and DH aren't there so I'd try really hard to enjoy the day as guests.

I regret not eloping tbh. It was not worth the stress and angst and we had a small wedding.

Awful behaviour from your brother OP. He should have nipped this in the bud ages ago knowing that you assumed your DDs would be flower girls. And of course his only nieces should be invited to the wedding. Most weddings I've been to have been child free but always exceptions for the nieces and nephews of the bridal party even if they aren't flower girls or page boys they'd always be there dressed in their finery. It must be very hurtful to feel that your only brother thinks so little of your family

I'm assuming this is a pretty small wedding. Only invited relatives from the grooms side seem to be mother, SDad, sis and BIL. Even if you add on another 10 friends of the groom, that's quite a small group and if the brides side is roughly equal, that's a guest list of 40 or so.

Which sounds my ideal wedding.

However, it seems a bit overkill to have 3 flower girls for a wedding of that size, let alone another 2 on top.

Maybe it's numbers that are restricting the guest list, not specifically targeted step relatives or nieces.

But whichever way you look at it, it's incredibly thoughtless not to invite the step siblings and the nieces.

Your brother needs to either acknowledge he's agreed to the budget and the consequential number restrictions. Or he needs to stand up for his relatives and argue the case for them to be included in his special day.

OP and her mother have bizarrely overstepped by assuming the girls will be flower girls. But brother created this situation.

lol at how the bride is being held more responsible for ‘neglecting’ his family than he is. Family is her job, and it’s for her to put the effort in so he doesn’t have to then? He’s weak, whereas she’s a controlling harpy?

Or they’re having the wedding THEY BOTH want, but brother is being evasive because he doesn’t want to deal with the arseache from his side.