To have expected my daughters to be flower girls

[Notmotherofflowergirls]

Just created an account for people to pile on to me and tell me I am an idiot. I don’t think I can tell my real friends.
I am inwardly cringing!
My brother is getting married in 3 months time to a woman with no nieces or nephews.
My mother and I naturally assumed that my two girls 4 and 6 would be the flower girls. There are no other kids in the family although stepdad has grandchildren.
My mother was feeling left out of all the planning. DB was uncommunicative about the plans and always referred us to SiL and when my mum asked to contribute she was batted away.
Finally Mum insisted that she would buy the flower girl dresses and finally brother agreed. So on Wednesday SiL posted an invoice for three flower girl dresses from a Shop in Dublin. She included a nice note saying that she mustn’t feel obliged to pay.
My mum asked who the third dress was for: it turns out all three are for her cousin’s girls.
Brother came round and said that they will be only kids at wedding.
My brother was asked point blank if he didn’t want his nieces there and all he could say was he would speak with SiL. He did look sheepish.
My dad died and while my mum has not remarried she has been with her partner for 9 years. His kids are not invited. My stepdad isn’t going and is angry that my mum has been made to feel so upset.
I feel as if I have been kicked in the guts. My mum keeps bursting into tears.
My DH says he’s ongoing either Have we overstepped? Would anyone else have made the same assumption?

Meaning that you're absolutely unhinged over this years later and most of us don't come across this type of behaviour in our real lives.

Not inviting cousins' children is very normal and nowhere near in the same league as not inviting nieces and nephews.

@SuperwomansAMyth I think it's less that it's a childfree wedding, more that select children are invited, but other 'family' children aren't.
Add in the fact that nobody mentioned the necessary not being invited throughout the planning period- I think most couples who are having a childfree wedding mention this early on

I absolutely feel for you. My brother did exactly this. Invited no children, held it on a week day, 5 hours away. None of our close extended family were invited- most guests were friends. It was shit. I attended because he was my brother, I didn't make a fuss because he is my brother. But it was shit. His genius solution was we all came down paid a fortune for a hotel room and took it in turns to baby sit. Whilst my toddler and 10 year old spent the entire time in a hotel room. That didn't happen obviously. But it has changed my view of him. He certainly doesn't care about family the way I do- sadly I have distanced myself from him. He made this speech about the importance of family yet he was speaking to people who weren't. On the most important day of his life. It was horrible I'm glad I shielded my family from it.

You and your mum go. Please don't let your mum pay for the dresses. Explain to your brother that this isn't fair, use the money to pay for something more neutral like the cake. Go and do your duty, support your mum. I was so anxious during the build up but it was over so quickly. Ironically we had a friend getting married the very next day. Was a killer getting back and ready for round two, but the kids were invited and it was absolutely lovely and what a wedding should be about the bringing together of two families.

I actually wish my brother just eloped it would have been far less traumatic.

We had a good head start on kids too. And lived in different cities and had very different lives. I don't think we'd have had much relationship anyway.

Leaving a fully nursing newborn in another city hours away wasn't an option for us, so not much we could do there.

I would be devastated OP if my brother had done that to me. The only thing I fault you is assuming your girls were bridesmaids.

I wouldn’t expect my friends to invite my children but I would expect my brother because it’s not just a wedding. It’s a family wedding.

My brother and I are as close as you can be to someone living on a different continent. Yet, for his wedding he checked our U.K. school holidays as he knew we finished much later in the summer. They also had my youngest as ring bearer which I was really touched by as I had only met his wife to be once as we don’t live in the same country.

My brother had fuck all to do with the planning etc but he made sure we were included and appreciated that we were travelling and forgoing our holidays to be at his wedding.

For my own wedding, small affair, 25 guests, we had my new nephews, 6 and 9, share our table. No one had children and we were worried our friends would be put off by the boys being boys so we made sure they felt including. It was husband’s day too and I wanted him to have the people he loved around him.

Your brother is incredibly thick and/or insensitive.

I suspect that the only children invited might be the ones in the wedding party? I didn't think that was so unsual. I do agree that the lack of consistency and the brothers lack of communication are issues here.

We don't all have the luxury of babysitters we trust in cities we don't live in either, so taking the kids might not be a choice.

That's understandable. I don't blame couples for wanting a childfree wedding, but then they need to accept that some people will not be able to attend because of this.

While the ceremony might be only 45 minutes or so the reception generally goes on for hours. That's a looong day/evening for a young child (or a parent trying to keep them entertained).

Weddings seem to bring out the worst in some people! They're meant to be happy events bringing two families together!!

When I got married, I had my two sisters as bridesmaids, as well as my DH's sister. I wouldn't have had her by choice, but I wouldn't have left her out either. In the event, she demanded to be a bridesmaid which really pissed me off!! And brought one of her many boyfriends dressed inappropriately for a wedding and insisted he be in family photos, though he didn't last much longer!!

Although I wasn't a fan of children at the time, I did want children to be part of my wedding. I had no nieces or nephews, so I had a cousin's DD as flowergirl (she was in a bad mood throughout but it was funny!) and a close friend's son as page boy. I also had friends' children at the evening do (none of my closest family or friends had children then although I would absolutely have invited them if they had!)

I think it's crap when there are two young girls who are much more closely related to the B&G and have been excluded for second cousins!! And that is as someone who did have a second cousin as flowergirl, but wouldn't have if there had been a closer family member!

@SuperwomansAMyth not unusual to only have children in the wedding party at a wedding, but it is unusual to exclude relatives as close as the groom's nieces. I have no issue with the bride choosing who she wants in the wedding party (family or not) but it would be obvious to most that excluding such close children when others ARE included would be very hurtful

I wouldn't expect to stay the whole time for such a long reception. Just for the main parts you really need to stay for, which tend to be early on.

In our case, we did offer to travel, just come to the ceremony with the baby, and not come to anything else. It seemed like the best way to be there for them while honouring their wishes to not have children in general. All that travel for a half hour ceremony in an attempt to compromise we thought was pretty generous of us. It wasn't cheap and we didn't have much spare cash. We then got slated for making a fuss. I thought it was one phone call where we tried to not just say no but try to find a way to come to the wedding for them. Next family wedding where the situation was the same we learned our lesson and just straight RSVP'd 'no'.

I then got a call from MIL telling me how upset the bride was and couldn't we just leave the baby. She was told 'no' too.

Agreed. Our flower girls and page boys were my husband’s three nieces, our daughter, his nephew and my cousin. I don’t understand why you wouldn’t get both sides of the family involved if there’s an opportunity to.

Bullshit! Weddings are about bringing families together, not about the B&G being selfish as fuck!

By nieces and nephews I was referring to this thread.

Excluding cousins' children based on age (or closeness or any other relevant factors) is not a big deal.

I'm surprised at all the comments saying it's unreasonable that the girls in the OP aren't invited at all. I thought MN was usually very supportive of childfree weddings.

Obviously MN varies wildly from thread to thread sometimes but I think it's generally seen as fine not to invite children of friends and extended family (like cousins ) but that nieces and nephews should be invited where possible.

Of course it is hurtful. My ILs excluded our children from their aunt's weddings. I found this interesting to navigate as it just isn't the culture in my own family.

We were married before them and had a child at our wedding. At the time they were the only friend of the family that had a child. I never thought to exclude them. My DD had all the family children at her wedding.

Probably the part that broke the camel's back as far as our relationship was the message that it didn't matter if we were at the sibling's weddings if we couldn't leave the children. That is a strong message to send.

I then got a call from MIL telling me how upset the bride was and couldn't we just leave the baby. She was told 'no' too

I think it's a big ask to expect people to travel a long distance to your wedding and it's unreasonable to be upset if they can't attend.

As for the "just leave the baby" comment....I think people forget what it's like to have very young children!

Sorry but if I only had one sibling, I’d probably expect the same as it’s what I would do, have my nieces or nephews in my wedding. I’m gobsmacked that your children are not even invited! SIL is not bothered about offending her in laws one bit..

everybody says oh it’s their wedding let them do as they please which is absolutely true but there’s got to be a bit of compromise in some parts surely?

Your brother is either an absolute wimp who won’t stand up for himself or his family or he genuinely doesn’t care a jot about you all or his relationships with you.

Stop making the wedding abour Op and her family when it is about brother and his fiance.

Your brother and his fiancé are fools. Family is for life. The worst thing they can do is cause this level of hurt at the start of their marriage. The major factor here is communication, which needs to be kind, informative and timely. It’s natural for his mother to be excited. You haven’t painted the picture of a domineering woman trying to tell them what to do. They have been unnecessarily secretive. The other factor is the clear preferential treatment if the bride’s family. If she wants her cousin’s kids as flower girls over yours then she should simply communicate that. However, yours should also be invited. Their uncle is getting married and there are other children at the wedding! Similarly, his whole family - including step siblings - should be invited if her cousins are invited. It’s very unbalanced. In all honesty, I think your mother should say that there has been a misunderstanding and she won’t pay for the dresses of children she has never met. The bride’s family should pay. I also think you should sit your brother down and tell him how much hurt he is causing.

@SuperwomansAMyth I'm sorry you were treated that way by your in laws. Wedding invitations do send strong messages about relationships, whether intentional or not

I think exclusion of family children is fairly unusual (at least amongst the people I know) so I understand why the OP was somewhat blindsided

Whattttt??? They are paying for it! They can invite who they want. At my wedding we invited many friends over “family” & had zero kids. The entitlement is wild, organise a family meal if you want to do that, no expect someone to fork out thousands on their wedding day to please everyone else

I agree Op doesn't sound fond of Sil. She called her woman with no nieces and nephews.

Yeah but the OP saying they are all intents and purposes step siblings is incredibly strange, and may not be how the brother feels. And despite the invites to the weddings, not how the mum's partners children feel either.
I don't know anyone who considers their mum's partner - who became a partner after the children were already adults - as a step dad, let alone the also adult kids as step siblings.