To have expected my daughters to be flower girls

[Notmotherofflowergirls]

Just created an account for people to pile on to me and tell me I am an idiot. I don’t think I can tell my real friends.
I am inwardly cringing!
My brother is getting married in 3 months time to a woman with no nieces or nephews.
My mother and I naturally assumed that my two girls 4 and 6 would be the flower girls. There are no other kids in the family although stepdad has grandchildren.
My mother was feeling left out of all the planning. DB was uncommunicative about the plans and always referred us to SiL and when my mum asked to contribute she was batted away.
Finally Mum insisted that she would buy the flower girl dresses and finally brother agreed. So on Wednesday SiL posted an invoice for three flower girl dresses from a Shop in Dublin. She included a nice note saying that she mustn’t feel obliged to pay.
My mum asked who the third dress was for: it turns out all three are for her cousin’s girls.
Brother came round and said that they will be only kids at wedding.
My brother was asked point blank if he didn’t want his nieces there and all he could say was he would speak with SiL. He did look sheepish.
My dad died and while my mum has not remarried she has been with her partner for 9 years. His kids are not invited. My stepdad isn’t going and is angry that my mum has been made to feel so upset.
I feel as if I have been kicked in the guts. My mum keeps bursting into tears.
My DH says he’s ongoing either Have we overstepped? Would anyone else have made the same assumption?

I'm another who can't understand posters saying everything is the bride's fault.

My dc has recently got engaged. Both bride and groom have written out a list of who they really would like to invite. Then both bride and groom are talking to each other about how they can cut down the list to a number that they can actually afford.

It is the couple who decide if it is child free / with millions of children / with some children / who else makes the cut or not.

"they weren't asked to be flower girls. The mil was trying to push her own agenda wanting to be involved when it wasn't anything to do with her"

I think her son's wedding is something to do with her. Of course she wants to be involved - that's normal in families where parents love their kids. The only thing the OP's mum has done wrong, is to assume she had a close relationship to her son and that he gives a shit about his family!

Sometimes people are invited to certain occasions because it's diplomatic - it oils the wheels of family relations in years to come. Everyone in the mum and step dad's family has bought into the concept of being part of each other's wider family unit. In not inviting stepdad's children, he's sending a clear message that this family isn't important to him - he's not obliged to love them but a snub like this will affect relationships down the line. It would have been far more respectful and diplomatic to reciprocate and welcome them to his wedding. If he truly doesn't care, this will hurt his mum and step dad, who have invested in building a strong family unit.

If the wedding is in Ireland, maybe OP and her dh don't want to travel for a wedding that her dc aren't welcomed at. Maybe OP and her dh don't want to leave their dc behind in (I'm presuming) another country. Maybe childcare is hard to come by. I don't think I'd put myself out for a sibling who didn't value me enough to invite my children to his wedding.

It's not your wedding so YABVU to assume anything. It's not your mum's wedding so why on earth would she "insist" on buying flower girl dresses?

You can be angry with your brother for not being upfront with you, but I do feel a bit sorry for him being steamrolled by you and your mum.

Also childfree weddings are better IMO.

Whilst reasonable to limit flower girls and a very unfortunate mix-up, in your circumstances I would decline the wedding invite. Partly because of the non-invites to the adult (in all but name) step-children, and limiting children who can attend.

Agreed. If my DH’s sibling had children when I married of course they would have been in our wedding party.

I find it bizarre that the bride has picked her cousin’s daughters and not included the groom’s nieces.

No way should mum be paying for their dresses when her own grandchildren aren’t invited!!

I think you and mum were wrong to assume they would be flower girls, they not have had any or bride chosen a child she’s close ti.
Not inviting his nieces is odd. It’s not a childfree wedding if there’s 3 other little girls there.
I’d go but it will be awkward as you’ll get where’s dh and the girls questions. I’d say the girls weren’t invited so dh is with them at home but if I was in attendance I’d think it odd uncle hasn’t invited his only 2 nieces.
As for the other adults not invited I’d just assume brother isn’t that close to them.

YABU to have assumed your daughters would be asked to be FG & your mum was completely wrong to offer to pay for the dresses in an attempt to bully/guilt-trip your SiL into choosing them (which obviously backfired!).
YANBU to be bitterly disappointed that your daughters are not invited. That is terrible behaviour from the bride and groom, especially as other children will be there as part of the wedding party.
If your SD has been invited I'm struggling to understand why he's refusing to attend just because his adult children haven't been invited. Yes, he's been with your mum for 10 years but I'm assuming you & your brother didn't grow up with his kids? The decision not yo invite them is perfectly understandable if so.
Unfortunately the grooms mums are often not as involved in the planning, even if the brides mum is heavily involved.

I disagree, it's all on her brother for being a grade A wet wipe.

Can understand choice of flower girls but v odd for your kids not to be invited at all or the step siblings. Is it a very small wedding?

I can see why being family that you thought your DD's would have been flower girls but it's not a given that the bride wants her fiancé's side of the family as part of the bridal party.

I do however think that there should have been a conversation between the BTO and your DM regarding exactly who the bridesmaids were going to be, after all the Bride knew at the time of offering that your DC weren't going to be part of the bridal party so to except her offer was a bit cheeky.

It’s very unreasonable that the only kids going are the bride’s cousins children, who happen to be the flowergirls. As nieces, yours should be higher up the pecking order even if not actual flower girls.

Your brother is as much to fault here - he should have put down his foot. I suspect he faces a lifetime of the wife deciding how things are and him meekly accepting it.

I agree with your DH that he stays home to mind the girls and I hope they have a wonderful time doing some other treat.

Why in the name of holy fuck has the brother not invited his young nieces? Unless massive back story that's spiteful. And please persuade your mum not to pay for three dresses for bridesmaids she has no connection with whatsoever!

OP I think you’ve massively overstepped.

I presume you and your mum have pissed off your brother’s wife to be by assuming you could dictate who her flower girls would be.

My mother in law phoned and asked me several times if her daughter (DH’s sister could be bridesmaid). It really pissed me off-it wasn’t their choice. They could dictate who was in key roles at their own weddings!

I think yabu to have assumed your daughters would be flower girls.

I think your brother and sil are even more unreasonable to not have invited your daughters. Especially as there are other children going.

It was wrong to assume your DDs would be flower girls and if the bride and groom want a child free wedding, so be it. That said, it is bad form not to invite your mother’s partner’s adult children when they have been a part of the groom’s life for over 10 years.

Not going to your own brother's wedding because he and his wife to be have decided to arrange things differently from the way you might have, is somewhat extreme.

God I hate weddings!! I think the bigger issues are not inviting step siblings, or nieces (assuming the chosen flower girls are also children), and not giving mother of the groom a role to play. Very poor show on SIL’s part. Does she have precedence for being selfish or a trouble maker? Honestly though, this probably isn’t an unusual scenario; the groom rarely has a vision for their wedding in the same way the bride does, so if a family is going to feel pushed out it’s typically the groom’s. Accept he doesn’t care all that much about the day and is stuck between a rock and a hard place trying to please SIL. Also accept that this might just be the start of losing your brother bit by bit. Christmas plans will look similar, with your family always featuring as lower priority. Hey ho, you can always hope for a swift divorce!

This, wonder if op and the dm are used to making all the family decisions and are just annoyed that the sil is following in this vein? As in the dB is used to falling in line and is either fed up and wants his wedding to be about his wedding and not his neices being flowergirls?

Why is she getting the blame here? Based on what you think their respective roles are? For all we know she’s respecting his wishes as to the role his family plays.

Why is she more responsible for including HIS family than he is?

Wishing divorce on them too? FFS. Yes, fingers crossed you can get this grown man back under control, OP.

But have they? 0p said they've been in her mother's life, doesn't mean they've been in his.

Bit its a choice the OP and her rather dramatic mum ate making to proactively estrange themselves from the brother/new bride. I mean sure! If that is what they want to do. But don’t whine about how much you love dear bro or how much you wanted to be family to the bride. The wedding show is all that mattered.

Why on earth did you assume that your dds would be flowergirls? Bride’s choice, surely? Your mum should not have paid for the flower girl dresses given the bride clearly knew she thought it would be for your dds. Your brother needs a bollocking for not communicating properly.

I would be upset if your brother was my son. Not necessarily because he didn't have his nieces as flower girls, as I do agree, that's the brides decision, but because he's been 'uncommunicative' throughout, fobbing his family off to his partner to deal with, being too much of a wet lettuce to be clear with you about the arrangements and manage your expectations. As a result his mother and sister are upset and his wife to be has ended up looking like she's in the wrong, for allowing your mum to buy dresses your girls won't be wearing. This is so typical of a certain type of man who sits around gazing into space leaving everything to women to deal with. I hope you don't think badly of your SiL over this, because I'll bet she's going to be doing the heavy lifting in their house, and I feel sorry for her.

My gran made similar assumptions a couple of times and it caused lifelong ructions between my mum & aunt.
First was assuming that they would be godparents to each others children. It didn't happen. They fell out massively.
Second was gran assuming that my cousin would be bridesmaid when I got married. I hadn't seen her for years and barely knew her. It never occurred to me to ask her.
The whole lot of them fell out with me over it.
Whatever happens, I hope you're all able to work through it. It's not nice knowing that you have a cousin / wider family out there who you don't see because of family ructions.