Why do people not like using holiday clubs?

[Youdirtylittlehamster]

Speaking to ex-MIL. She's off with me. I don't know why. Later she comes to the point, why have I booked the DC's into holiday clubs when she could have them for free.
I don't want to tell her that it's because she doesn't do anything with them. Sometimes when I've picked them up she's let them be on their tablets all day, they haven't eaten any proper meals (once, just Hariono and crisps) they haven't washed or got changed, they aren't learning anything.
The reason I don't want to tell her is because I don't think she feels that any of this is important.
We fundamentally don't see eye to eye about this topic. She feels school holidays are for doing whatever the children want, with no limits or demands of them. She never worked when her children are school so doesn't get why I have to work them, and why I don't just tell my boss that I'm taking every school holiday off as 'I have children so surely they must understand'.

I like holiday clubs. I like the variety of the things they do. I like that they come home with stories and make new friends. My DD has EBSA at times, and it is much better to keep the routine of getting up in the week, getting dressed, having that separation from me. They do things there that I'm not good at like sports and baking. They meet kids from other schools and walks of life. Yes it is expensive but can be spread over a few months or budgeted for. If you are on UC then you can claim it back.

The amount of mums on single parent FB groups who limit their careers by only looking for term time jobs. Surely if you choose a job which pays 30k rather than 18K pro rata but you have to work some school holidays then you still end up better off?
I wonder if part of it is how they were brought up. I always went to holiday clubs, as my mum worked, so I don't think badly of them. The way some of my friends talk it's like I'm sending them down the pit!

It’s funny.

People are always banging on about the importance of extra-curricular activities and so ort, yet someone says they send their child to do exactly that for whole days during the holidays and they are jumped upon!

Also, there is thread after thread on here about the evil of unlimited screen time, yet someone says they send their child to a club to avoid them being allowed to spend all day on a screen and it’s all “oh, just let them chill!”.

This place.

The vast majority of parents home with their children in the school holidays are not wealthy stay at home mums supported by a rich husband. You sound so defensive when there is no need to be. It’s perfectly fine for you to use holiday clubs if that works for your family. Why act like anyone who does things differently is somehow extremely privileged and not also just juggling things the best way for their family.

Even if your MIL doesn’t “get” holiday clubs, so what? They are your kids.

@UndecidedAboutEverything I wholeheartedly agree with all you say.

I spent most of my childhood and teens 'doing nothing at home'. Except, as I explained to my dc recently, whereas their 'doing nothing' involves gaming or scrolling, my 'doing nothing' included: drawing, reading, writing, endless loops around the block (tbf, dd and her mates do this), gaming. I think they should be allowed to do nothing while they can; at least until old enough to have a part time job. The slog of adulthood lasts a long time.

My kids have done the full whack of childcare. I used holiday clubs when my holidays didn't align, or when i needed to work uninterrupted or go on to work for revision sessions. Soon as the kids were old enough to stay home and do nothing, they chose that.

Edit: realised this makes it sound like I'm anti clubs. I'm not, but the op was reluctant to let them go to a gparent to do nothing. My dc have fond (and often bizarre) memories of days at their grandparents.

My mother is appalled by holiday clubs too - "farming out" my children. Though when my sister and I were primary age we used to have to stay upstairs in the holidays when she worked (podiatrist) in her surgery downstairs. When she did home visits we used to have to go with her and wait in the car. We did read a lot but got absolutely bored rigid. A couple of lazy days was great but after that we were counting down to go back to school. We would have loved holiday club!

My daughter is nearly 10 and one us is usually WFH (very convenient) so we could manage without holiday club these days - no family nearby. Yesterday she had a day at home as I had to fit in a dentist visit for her at lunchtime and she did an 11+ practice paper. Apart from that she watched a lot of TV and you tube, did some arts and crafts but by 2pm she was bored and craving company. (I have another child but he is 19 and doing uni assignments so not a playmate. ) She asked "can I go to club tomorrow?" And was delighted when I said I'd booked it. She had a chilled start to the day and I dropped her off at 9.30.

I know I'm lucky to WFH and afford club (it's mainly covered by childcare vouchers which I'm also lucky I still get). Best of all she enjoys it. They have some structured activities but plenty of free play, park visits etc and she's made lots of friends from different schools. They all have a cooked dinner together at 4.30 all sitting down round a big table, it's really sweet! I do get annoyed at the "farming out" comments.

I wouldn’t be having my kids sit in PJs all day with screens as their entertainment either, whether that is at a grandparent’s house or while a parent is supposedly “WFH”. Kids need activities - drawing, playing, running - other than screens. If we can’t provide it directly, a club is much better than all day screens.

Not everyone can afford to budget for them. Most clubs near me would be in the region of £100- £150 for the week, i have 3 children, that's more than I can pay for every holiday although I do try and send them for a week in summer.
I think holiday clubs can be a good thing, especially for a particular interest and if you can afford them it's great, I do think kids need some down days in the holidays too- I know I certainly do when I'm off work.

Says who?

The school holidays are the only reason I’m still a teacher but it’s not about financial sense, it’s about wanting to spend time with my kids. I so look forward to the holidays when I don’t have to drag them out of bed and kick them out of the door and we can all just relax a bit.

I get that not everyone feels like this and that’s fine too, but I feel like it’s worth pointing out that “financial sense” isn’t necessarily the only motivation.

Out of interest, can anyone share their experiences of/strategies for removing devices during the long days of chilling/doing nothing? We’ve tried but our DS just whines and moans and wheedles to get the iPad or the Switch back. I’m not saying we give in, but he doesn’t really settle into being without it so it makes for a miserable experience for us all. He’s 7.

Obviously it’s fine if we have another activity to do together with him but that’s not what I am talking about, I am talking about this “leave them to chill and plan their own day” approach.

I generally find that holiday club balances out the screen-heavy “chill” days, same as a full day at school with no devices means it’s fine to go on his devices after school.

We mix it up, a few holiday clubs associated with their hobbies. A few days with GPs, a few days where they literally just watch tv or play in the garden while DH or I work from home and ignore them. Then some days we both take off for family time and holidays.

I don’t know anyone who doesn’t like holiday clubs from a parent perspective unless they have a ND child who they aren’t suitable for.

Even when I have days off in the holidays, my eldest often goes into holiday clubs because they are fun and she enjoys them. I do have another autistic child who prefers to quietly stay home and away from other people. I work from home so whether I am working or not, both can be accommodated.

They are typically around £50/55 per day if you book early enough and cover the whole day.

My DCs were at home during the holidays, but didn't just do nothing! Yes, some days were more relaxed - they needed it, but most days we went for a walk, to the park, trampoline park NT place etc. We also did arts and crafts, baking, board games. They spent ages doing lego, jigsaws, playing with other toys. hey had time to set up proper railway tracks, integrate them with their cars, playmobil, dolls etc and played for ages with role-play type games. They played in the garden - mud play, making dens, playing sports, bikes etc. They had friends over, and went to friends houses. We sometimes went to museums, the library, cinema etc. Time spent with grandparents. They sometimes watched TV or played with screens. But they were parented - and weren't allowed to do it all the time.

Being at home with your kids during the holidays doesn't mean that they aren't doing anything!

I sometimes wonder whether the fact that children spend so much time in nursery/school/wrap around/holiday clubs has resulted in parents being unwilling to parent their own children.

This is a real you do you kind of problem. Clubs obviously suit your DCs and you have no real alternative (Haribos, crisps and tablets are not a full time holiday solution). Spending time with a grandparent who lets them join in with baking, dog walking, gardening etc would be a different prospect. I think the ideal is for kids to have a bit of downtime in the holidays without the need for the usual mad race of school mornings, a bit of structure - days out, maybe a holiday club (sports, drama, arts whatever) for some of the time - but also some unstructured time where they learn how to entertain themselves without every day having to be fully timetabled. It's also - dare I say it - quite fun to spend time just hanging out with your kids, if you are fortunate enough to be able to do that, which is the reason why some women choose not to work in the school holidays if they have that option.

We run a holiday club the children who seem to get the most out of it are the ones who have a mix of a few days with us and a few days chilling out at home. The ones who are with us all week seem exhausted by end of the week and then go back to school without having had any down time just to hang out and do what they want. School holidays where I could have lie ins and read books and potter at home are among my best childhood memories.

Personally I don't think it does children good to be constantly micromanage by adults, I do believe they need some time to be bored and find their own interests. Unfortunately now both parents are expected to and need to work it is much harder for children to get that down time.

In your case I'd have probably mixed the clubs your child most enjoyed with some time with your MIL to just hang out.

I sometimes wonder whether the fact that children spend so much time in nursery/school/wrap around/holiday clubs has resulted in parents being unwilling to parent their own children.

Pre the prevalence of childcare, children were left to their own devices in a way that would be really shocking in modern standards. Before my tenth birthday I’d nearly drowned, nearly been run over, had encounters with Funny Men (as they were then known) and the rubbish thing was the blame was always put on the child. I know there are downsides to todays more proactive approach not least that it’s exhausting for the parent but it really isn’t some modern invention.

How do you manage when the holiday club finishes at (say) 3/ 3.30, which is normal where I am, and your work is until 5? Does your work fit with being able to leave and pick up every single day you have to use the service? And is the plan for your child to come back to hang out at work with you for the last hour or so? Doesn't go down well.

This (and cost, and the ok until age 11 but not so much suitable beyond) has been the big dissuader for me. School, you can arrange for an after school club with much more certainty. For my DD, it was that 2 weeks of mostly full-on sport was very miserable for her. The clubs were good but she had ear problems that also made a large, echoey gym - or swimming - a mostly unhelpful place to be. A forest school ended up being the better choice.

They need a rest and so e down time in school holidays.That is their purpose.surely they could go to their grandma's one day a week.

Wow! That's so expensive. My DSD is booked into a few days at a local council holiday club. It's £11 a day and she gets 10% discount because she's a member of the sports centre. She's going with her school friend.

It must vary around the country but holiday clubs are quite typically 8-6 here. They do include a variety of sports including tennis, fencing, swimming, football, rugby, table tennis etc. However, they also do things like dance, circus tricks, and quieter things. They are always really popular with parents and the children that go.

@TimeandMotion something I do which has worked well is to have a basic chart, so alternate days (or whatever suits you) for example.

The children know which days are screen days and it only takes a short time to 'train' them in this idea, provided you don't back down or change your mind.

Also, when they are younger, the fact that there is a chart means that they aren't arguing or whining at you, you simply say, let's look at the chart, oh it's not a day for screens today.

It may sound simplistic but something about having them look at the chart rather than debate with you really works.

I think crucially too, it is better to have complete screen free days because as soon as they get that tablet in their hands... 😂

My dc always found holiday clubs boring and lame.

• They’re expensive. Or they are round these parts, £35 a day and if you have 2 kids that’s £350 a week. They’re also run by what appear to be 12 year olds.
• Not all kids like them. My kids hate pretty much all of them and would rather be at home, sometimes they come out having been really bored.
• The hours very rarely allow for working parents - the £35 one here can be extended from 8-6 for an extra £5 per 30 minutes but the core hours are 9-3. Not helpful to many!
• UC claimants have to put their kids on Ofsted registered clubs in order to be able to claim 85% childcare costs back, but personally I find very few of these clubs are Ofsted registered because they simply don’t operate enough hours to warrant a registration

As an aside OP you need to learnt any grandparents are not parents and when you get free childcare it’s completely selfish and entitled to expect the person to behave exactly as you do. I look after my nieces and nephews on my days off and in return my siblings/siblings in law look after mine - if any of them told me I had to do learning or education with them if laugh loudly on their face and tell they they can get fecked.

She feels school holidays are for doing whatever the children want, with no limits or demands of them

I agree with her. She sounds like a fun grandma and I can guarantee your kids would absolutely rather spend their day with fun grandma than do some random holiday club. It reads like you’re keeping them from someone in their life who brings them fun and joy because of your own personal gripes about her. She won’t be around one day and you’ve deprived them on time with a key person in their life because she isn’t a carbon copy of you. Not cool, OP. Really shitty parenting in fact.

Just in case people aren't aware, if you fulfil certain criteria (think it's mainly if you're free school meals) there are free holiday club places.

Look up HAF (holidays and food) no idea if this is just in 'deprived areas' though)