Am I About to loose my driving licence for speeding offences

[cockeyedoptimist]

Please help as I’m in a panic and can’t speak to anyone official until tomorrow .
I’ve just had a letter informing me of my fourth speeding offence . They are all for doing 22-24 mph in a 20 zone near my house
im so upset and feel so stupid . I drove up and down this road 6 days a week ( so 12 trips )
About a year ago I got 3 speeding tickets in 3 weeks when they installed a camera . I’ve been so careful since then , creeping up the road every day while staring at my Speedo to ensure I stay within the limit . But today I have a letter to say I was doing 23 a week ago
please be gentle as I know I’ve been reckless
and I know how safe 20 mph zones are .

Is there any chance I won’t loose my licence , or is it automatic . A quick google doesn’t look good . I’m so so upset with myself

@LakieLady

Everyone has an anecdote or a friend's, cousin's police dog who tells them things. The 20 zones aren't speed limits in the same sense as on other roads, they are zones, within which you cannot exceed 20mph. Signage is at the entrance and exit of these zones.

kangandco.co.uk/2023/10/13/caught-speeding-in-a-20mph-zone/#:~:text=Drivers%20caught%20significantly%20exceeding%20the,increase%20beyond%20the%20standard%20three.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-62134399.amp

Whether or not you will lose your license is to some degree irrelevant.

What is obvious is that if you don't change your behaviour you almost certainly will at some point in the future.

Suggestions to avoid this :

i) Put a note or sticker somewhere where you can see it every time you go out. This maybe in the car, or on the back of the front door. It should remind you to check your speed and beware of the speed limits.

ii) Set the car alarm to go off when you exceed a certain speed. This could be a bit annoying.

iii) Get a sat nav that warns you where the speed cameras are.

@GasPanic

Agreed. OP says it's her fault 'because she knows where the cameras are'. No, it's her fault because she habitually speeds. If your mindset is that you only drive safely to avoid being caught, you shouldn't be driving. Same goes to all posters who are whining about not being able to drive according to the law and still pay attention to the road. If that's the case, don't drive.

A 30 mph speed limit generally applies to all roads with street lights (excluding motorways) unless a sign shows otherwise. So authorities don't need to put up repeater signs in lit 30 mph areas.

If the speed limit is anything other than 30 mph there need to be repeater signs and there are rules about the distances between them. And that includes 20 mph roads.

But... where it's a 20 mph "zone" across an area rather than just one street, the Department for Transport has updated the guidance to say councils can use traffic calming measures and paint on the road instead of just using repeater signs.

"20mph zones require traffic calming measures such as speed humps or chicanes or at least one calming feature and repeater speed limit signing and/or roundel road markings at regular intervals, so that no point within a zone is more than 50m from such a feature, sign or marking. In addition, the beginning and end of a zone is indicated by a terminal sign. Zones usually cover several roads".

So the traffic officer is absolutely right about the signs (and I'm sure is clued up about the situation in your town) but a 20 mph limit might still be enforceable in court without repeated signs if a zone has the "right" combination of traffic calming and signs to warn drivers. But it seems a bit unfair for councils to be able to rely on road paint (which does fade) when drivers are used to looking for speed limit signs...

Almost every phone that isn't an iphone uses Android. The USA is almost the only country in the world where Android isn't the most used phone OS

You only get points if you are over the limit, you have been over the limit on four occasions in the last year therefore you deserve to loose your license. You know the speed limit, it applies to you so stick to it.

Oooh you had 'likes'. How lovely for you. Must have made your sad little day so bright. You were silly enough to post, others know better and don't.

I didn't report you but I would have; every little SPaG jibe I see.

This is an urban myth.

On my speed awareness course there was woman one mile over the speed limit.

OP, I would wait and see. I know it's not comfortable and, if you are in Wales, they are cracking down on 20mph at the moment. NIP letters must be received within 14 days of the alleged offence.

Try not to panic. Easy to say, difficult to do, but it doesn't help.

OP, you need to speak with Andrew Thompson http://www.counsel.direct/ he’s an expert in this field. Give him all the facts and let him advise you, he will have seen this before. If there’s any chance of keeping your license, he’s it. He’s got a fantastic track record.

Hi OP. It doesn’t say to send your licence because at this stage the police just want to know who was driving. If this fine takes you over 12 points the case will go to court as a totter ie a driver who has totted up lots of points

Similar happened to me last summer. I have been driving for over 30 years with only one speeding offence 2 years ago where I did a speed awareness course.

I then got caught by a change in the speed limit in my own village. I hadn’t realised a particular stretch going out of the village had changed from a 40 to a 30. It didn’t have new 30 signs up just a small sign saying that the speed limit had changed and I didn’t notice it. No excuse for that.

I was caught by a van doing 35 three times in the space of a week. I knew the bloody thing was there too but thought I was ok because I was doing 35 in a 40 zone.

DH thinks it’s hilarious since I am routinely teased for being a very cautious driver. He might change his tune if I get caught again in the next three years and get a ban..

but yes it is automatic ban at 12 points unless there are mitigating circumstances

I think you can go to a magistrates court and plead your case - I remember something like that when I got a speeding ticket. As your original offences were very close together. presumably you had committed all offences before any letters came through? If there was a recent change to 20mph you may not have realised you were speeding and they may take that into account, or they may take into account that you had not had a chance to be informed of and rectify your behaviour before you got any letters.

And your speeds are very close to the speed limit, - so they may take that into account.

As PP said, you do need to get some technology or something you help you stay under the limit. Even if you get let off, you still have three years (or is it 5?) with no offences to avoid losing your licence.

That speed awareness course must have been shit!

Thanks for that. No it wasn’t and I’m generally a careful driver but as I say the limit changed without notice and I was caught three times within a week on the same bit of road.

Oh come on! Its easy to make a mistake if the speed limit on a familiar road suddenly changes. Loads of people were caught out like this near us. Council must have made a fortune!

i didn’t even realise until the letters came through since it was all so close together

Lots of people were caught on our road when they reduced the limit from 40 to 30mph. Because it was already sandwiched between two 30mph sections they just took the 40 signs down and didn't put anything new up. It's much harder to spot the absence of signs than new ones going up.

I did a speed awareness course myself about a year ago (I was caught by a camera doing 24 on a 20 limit, bang to rights, it was a long empty stretch of road and my speed crept up without my realising).

But one thing I remember specifically from the course was being taught never to assume you know the limit just because it’s a familiar road!

This is exactly what happened with me.

I have little sympathy, but you can opt to go to court, and a magistrate can look into circumstances, and three, as it was installed and disabled and only just over the speed limit, may get you off with a big fine. I know a magistrate that left people on 11 points quite a lot, you may get lucky, but I think the potential fine is higher. I suspect you'd only lose the license for a couple of months.

Not wishing to be unkind, but a ban would seem to be the best solution in your circumstances. Fines, speed-awareness course, and presumably an increase in insurance because of the points on your license have done nothing to prevent you exceeding the speed limits.

The only other way to make you modify your behaviour would be an accident when you injure another road user.

Seriously if you cannot drive within the speed limit to this extreme extent on so many occasions you should not be on the road.

Speeding is so emotive it's never worth getting into a debate about. What is worth talking about is how its possible to not know if you have penalty points on your licence. Absolutely staggering to me, not least because you are required to declare any points whenever the insurance is renewed. With six points and more I can't believe that the insurance costs haven't gone through the roof. And yes, you do (or at least did when I had to do it) have to send your licence back. How do you not know?

This is at the police force's discretion
Many people think it is some kind of law. It is not. it is only a guidance