Another lunch ruined by other peoples’ children

[Bakeoffskateoff]

Am I being unreasonable to get really pissed off with other people being unable or unwillling to teach their children to sit quietly in cafes and restaurants. Went out for lunch today to our usual weekend cafe. Two lots of families with kids aged five to eight who were noisy, whiny, annoying, sat on tables, crying. I had to hurry my lunch down to get out of there as soon as possible. I’m sick of parents who think little Freddie is so cute for making loud tractor noises, causing other diners to turn around. No one else appreciates your child quite like you do.

If you can’t teach your child manners please don’t take them out where there are other people.

My friend has three young children. They walk the legs off them, beach, park, woods. They're happy to sit down for a drink and something to eat.

I'm going to upset mumsnetters now but as a grandma netflix, Disney on my phone have helped a lot. Turned down really low whilst waiting for the food is very peaceful.

YANBU- children of those ages should be able to behave appropriately in a cafe/restaurant.

My son is 10 now and has been able to behave appropriately in these situations for years.
We stayed in a hotel in Austria last summer when he was 9. We ate in the (very nice) hotel restaurant each evening with absolute no issues, as did every other family, even those with younger children.

A lot of the time, it is just that the parents don't want to be bothered.

That's why I love having a weekday off.

I wouldn't go to a cafe full of little kids.
There are plenty of more adult places to spend your weekend.
The one that bugs me is loads of little kids in pubs. For me a pub is primarily an adult space for consuming alcohol. When I was a kid we would have to sit silently with a coke if dragged in on a walk with my dad. The kids now in pubs act like they are practically getting drunk by osmosis! Haha.

I used to feel just like you, getting really angry at feeling my enjoyment was ruined by selfish parents who are too lazy to discipline their kids and teach them manners in the public environment.

I don't anymore. I've accepted that newer parents' principles have changed. They raise their kids differently. Their normality is not what it used to be for us as parents.

So I always make a point to go where young children are unlikely to be. I don't go on holidays during school breaks. I only booked Airbnb abroad in non tourist areas. I go out for dinner in more 'posh' places, much less often.

The only place I struggle with is the private gym changing areas especially showers. I crave quietness after a hard work out under a rewarding hot shower. parents forcing their kids to shower there because it's easier than at home with their kids screaming and scratching because they don't want to shower there does test all my buttons so again, I now only shower there at times kids are very unlikely to be there.

Ultimately adopting the popular thought of 'if you don't like it, go somewhere else'. At least I'm relaxed doing so.

Turned down really low whilst waiting for the food is very peaceful
Very often, sound that is turned down but loud enough for the child to hear to their satisfaction is loud enough for others to be disturbed especially with adrenaline rushing things like Disney films.

I don't understand why kids can't just used cheap earphones for these circumstances.

"What seemed to me like effort, taking advice, long hours spent, sleepless nights, long discussions with partner, thoughtful boundary-drawing, psychological investigation, discussion with barely-verbal children, unstinting praise of effort in the face of failure, ... and all the rest ... was very likely as nothing compared with your unstinting efforts to get your graceless and ungrateful children to behave themselves."

Yes I still have to work very hard caring for my 17 year old and no doubt there are still some people out there who think I could 'cure' his repetitive sounds if I was a better parent.

If you were in a particularly nice place you are not being unreasonable. If you were in a normal cafe etc YABU. Children are people too. Agree totally about it being important to teach manners but it isn't as easy as people suggest, it does depend on the child as well as the parenting. A family member has two kids, one 5 and one 6yo. The 6yo has flawless manners and will sit quietly at the dinner table, always has since around 2. We thought it was his parents' iron fist. The 5yo however absolutely will not sit, will mess about, will scream etc and has always been like thar. They've parented in the same way, been strict, enforced boundaries etc. But 1st child is a quiet, easy child and 2nd is full of energy and can't be contained. I don't think it's fair to blame the parents for that if you're just in a normal cafe and doing everything possible to manage them.

Did it appear I was targeting parents like you for censure? I hope not. But if it did, I'm sorry.

Your poor child.

When abroad, you never see kids mucking about in restaurants etc as eating is a social thing, unlike here its grab n go. Hardly any grab n go type places such as Greggs etc abroad.

If you do witness bad behaviour in these places, hear the English - afraid its the Brits.

Not really. I didn’t put them in situations that would stress them and cause them to act distressed. They also disliked the noise of other people’s screaming kids.

Thank you. I did do a pretty good job if I say so myself. We'd see less 'unruly' children if their parents actually bothered their backsides to curb their bad behaviour.

Any child can act up, and that's fine, so long as the parent at least attempts to distract or whatever. It's the ones that don't, or made a half-hearted "ah don't do that son" while son carries right on, that get on my wick.

Fair enough- I don’t with mine either.

I thought you meant you wouldn’t let them do things they could manage and enjoy because non disabled people don’t like to see them.

Mine hates screaming too, and stays in his chair, but he does have verbal ticks (it’s an odd noise I can’t describe!)- I will never make him miss out on things because other people don’t like that.

Oh no! I didn't mean that- so much can get misunderstood typing . Mine have asd and loathe noisy places. They get completely overwhelmed. They are pretty well all adults now though

That is such a load of nonsense, I don't know where to begin!!

@Runnerinthenight my children are grown. I'm just open to children being seen as well as heard.

A group of three 6 or 7 year olds fighting under the table in the pub we were eating in the other week whilst the parents just sat and chatted was really not on. In one instance of particularly ear curling screaming I just happened to make eye contact with one parent and could only grimace. The children were quickly called out from under the table and asked to sit down, but with no subsequent interaction with the parents it soon went pear-shaped again. You do have to put some effort in when eating out with children Once they’ve finished their food and they’re ignored, what else is there to do apart from fight under the table?

Agreed.
More and more children are feral today.

I'm reading all this with a wry little smile. I'm the mum of 4 adults and 4 young grandchildren, and ten years ago I would have been nodding sagely and lecturing others about how easy it was to teach my children to behave properly at the table and not annoy the other diners. Mine were great at that.

However, I now have my autistic granddaughter who is 10, and we are doing our best to integrate her into our family things.

What should I do? Keep her at home so she doesn't get to offend the sensibilities of others? Because let me tell you, its hard when a two year old kicks off and you get a side eye, but you should SEE the disgust when it's an older child.

Of course we manage our expectations and take her outside but my daughter and son in law have to manage this all the time and its not easy with some judgemental twats in the vicinity.

Yes of course there are lazy parents; yes of course they should bring up their children to have good manners, but it might be worth remembering that not every situation is bad parenting.

Jeez they were talking about going on holiday this summer, I dread to think how that's going to go.

A lot of people do think disabled people should stay away from ‘normal’ people- I’ve been told so on 3 separate threads in the last 2 days (not to mention many more in the past).

Isn't that shit though?

Or is it here more than in real life.?

Whatever it is, it's fucking depressing

@FredaFandango A good number of people will understand those difficulties, but equally if your granddaughter was fighting with other kids under a table in a pub whilst the adults in the group ignored them, I’m sure you would see that is not good form. I have no doubt your granddaughter would not find herself in this situation.

That is completely different to what other people have complained about. If you read my post again I said of course there are lazy parents who should be paying attention .

There are a lot of others in here who have complained about talking loudly screaming etc.

I've brought four well mannered children up but am also getting a lesson at over 60 that you can't always know what's going on.

Anyhow I best not post on this one any more as I'm too emotional at the black looks we get and really it's maybe not relevant to the general discussion.

As you were everyone

Sounds like you need to go to more adult orientated places. There are tons of them.