Torn on this. Autistic little lad in restaurant.

[EggsBenedick]

Hi all,

I firstly want to make clear that I am not wanting this to be a bunfight or an ableist type of thread. I'm genuinely interested to hear people's views on this, as the family in question have asked to put in a complaint to the restaurant along with them.

We were eating an all you can eat type place, mostly Indian / Bangladeshi cuisine. I've added this as this may be relevant from a culture perspective.

It's a nice place, not somewhere too posh but not your run of the mill everything you can eat for a tenna place. Was quite busy in there too.

Seated next to us was a family of 3, with a little lad about aged 8 or 9. After he came back with his plate of food he took his jumper and T shirt off. People were looking over but the parents didnt seem bothered by it.

A member of staff came over and asked the parents if the boy could put his top back on. The member of staff was pretty polite initially. The parents refused to ask the boy to put his top back on. The staff member then went to get another member of staff, who came over and said he just put his top back on during the meal or they would have to leave. The mum then said to the waiter 'if we put his top on he will just scream the place down and ruin everything for everyone'. And explained that the child is autistic.

The parents made no effort to put the top back on the boy.
The staff member said to the family that they would have to eat quickly and leave. By this point the mother was visibly upset and indirectly spoke to us saying 'I wish my son could just be accepted.'

The boy was completely topless in the middle of the restaurant with lots of other diners around.
They had a few mouthfuls and came over to our table and asked if we would leave a Google review complaining about their time at the restaurant and how they aren't inclusive or family friendly.

AIBU to be torn in this? I'm genuinely intrigued to hear people's opinions on this. I could see how difficult it was for the mum. But on one hand I think the parents should've at least tried to put the T shirt on the child as it's not appropriate for a child of that age to be topless in a restaurant. But, the child shouldn't be confined to their home to eat. I would be concerned about strangers / men looking at my semi - naked child most of all.

I don't think I am going to do a review as I can see it from the restaurants POV also. I said to the mum that I was sorry she had such a stressful time. She clearly needed support. The dad didn't say or do a lot which was most helpful!

What has being morbidly obese got to do with anything?

As someone who has 2 family members with autism just be eternally grateful you weren’t the mother.

It is really heartening to see so many positive and supportive comments, although I don’t actually agree with them on this one.

I have an autistic 9yo; a big part of my role as a parent is training him so that he is well equipped to be able to participate in society. It’s great that society is becoming more inclusive and we do ask for extra help with things like queuing and boarding flights etc, but I would in no way allow him to be undressed in a restaurant. Managing his autism can be very challenging and we make a lot of allowances for him, but he’s also old enough to know that there are settings in which behaviour matters. Most restaurants would fall into that category, especially if independent and not a chain. And if the owner of the restaurant requests certain attire then my child would be told that he needs to respect the owner’s wishes.

I would not make a complaint on behalf of the family in this instance. In fact, I am starting to wonder whether some parents of neurodivergent kids are doing them a massive disservice by not enforcing any boundaries or cultural norms.

100% this

With respect, you are taking generalised comments as personal attacks.

My comment was in response to numerous posters' views, not aimed at you personally.

I can empathise with your struggles and meant no offence.

well if you're being that facetious there's no "fundamental law of the universe" that says anyone has to wear any clothes at any time. Or that if the person on the table next to you has food looks nicer than yours you can't go and grab theirs. Or that you can't go and pour yourself a drink from behind the bar if the waiter is taking too long. Or that you can't give your boyfriend a quick hand job under the table. Or you can't piss into a bottle if there's a queue for the loo. Or that you still have to pay for your food if you didn't eat all of it.

I mean what does any of it matter, really. It's all just made up societal norms.

Nobody has said that the family can "never be able to take their child out to eat" unless they keep their top on. Just that if THIS particular restaurant insists that all customers must be fully clothed they can't eat there. There are clearly enough people on this thread who couldn't care less about how a small child is dressed that there will be sufficient places the child can eat out, where they would be fine with making that, or other reasonable accommodations.

It's not the same as an autistic child being denied a universal right like healthcare or education. A private restaurant can place its own restrictions on its clientele.

It was you that made the comment. No one else said anything about ear defenders or normality. You're the one that's trying to make it into an anti disability subject instead of being about restaurant dress codes. Not very nice.

ok i’ll put it simply

you said you’re concerned about the boy being a focus of a paedophile

and all i ask is… are you also concerned when you see children at the beach? sunny park? public swimming pool?

that is the sum total of my question

Not disciplining your child. This is on the parents. My DH is autistic, has severe ARFID, yet has still learned how to behave in restaurants.

OP starts thread clearly knowing it is insensitive to parents of autistic children and will attract the usual ableist idiots. She writes that she doesn’t want it to cause a fight as if that’s supposed to make it ok. I don’t even believe it happened.

She then tells a poster to fuck off and calls them a cunt.

Then we’re all meant to feel sorry for her because she apparently has trauma in her past after drop feeding information.

Its just a different take on the usual goady autism type thread we see here at least weekly. 🙄

I'm just wondering what used to happen 50 years ago if someone was autistic. Or is it a recent phenomenon, or a change in terminology? (Genuine question)

I wouldn't have cared about him being topless, although it would have been a bit odd. I'd have considered it disrespectful to the restaurant, so as his mum I'd have done everything I could to avoid it. Clearly none of us has any idea how difficult this would be.

The absolute last thing I'd have done is ask fellow diners to gang up on the restaurant and attack their ratings. Weird.

I literally put the quotes in quotation marks.

If it's not ok for people to have to see a young boy with his top off, where does that stop? What about kids who wear ear defenders? What about my scars on my leg? What about my ND that means I like a hat on?

I agree. His mother put him in a position to be the on display there. Opened him up to being ridiculed. School friends or even just other customers. Many establishments have the no shirt no shoes no service sign. Safety wise if he spills something on himself and is injured restaurant is liable.

Yes the boy is autistic but unfortunately this is something that draws attention to him not in the best way. I'd work on him to learn to keep a shirt on. He is 8 then 10 then 12. I know how hard it is and how you want everyone to accept your child who is perfect just as he is but that is not reality.

I would not write a complaint.if anything I feel for the workers dragged into this mess when they were simply doing there job.

Restaurants generally have a “shirts on” policy for a reason. You’ll see signs on doors in beach towns. It’s “respectful to other patrons”.

Perhaps there is a scale going from “being entitled to adjustments” to “feeling entitled to break the rules” and it might be difficult to know where the line is as a protective mother who is used to seeing things through their child’s experiences?

drip

Do you get a kick out of being deliberately obtuse to someone who has explained that they have trauma due to being sexually assaulted at 6?

then starting this kind of thread on AIBU where you mention concern for the child being sexually exploited…. isn’t wise

yep. when people began disagreeing

The mum then said to the waiter 'if we put his top on he will just scream the place down and ruin everything for everyone'

Said in front of the boy thereby reinforcing in his mind how he will react 🙄.

I'm with the restaurant who presumably have standards they'd like to maintain.

I live in a seaside town where people go for UK holidays and there are signs everywhere in the summer for people to keep thier shoes on and shirts on, no bikinis etc.. because tourists will just leave the beach and wander into town half naked. So it will probably be the official policy of the restaurant, and not something the staff just decided on when they saw the child. They should have explained the reasoning behind the policy to the parents.

Autism is such a broad diagnosis that I can't really judge the parents either way without knowing more about the child as an individual.

I couldn't get worked up about an 8 yr old (especially one with additional needs) not wearing a shirt. I wouldn't give it a second thought. It's not like his genitals were on show ffs.

100% this!

@EggsBenedick, stop posting threads then saying "wow is me", you started the thread, you triggered yourself!

If it was a 13 year old girl or shared tables for eating and I was sitting next to him I'd be more concerned, but otherwise I don't see it's a problem.

It would be more irritating if the table next to mine ordered some really vile smelling fish or, as happened to me once, two young guys on a date had evidently both poured bottles of aftershave on themselves to the point I could taste it in my food.

I'd much rather a kid be happy by taking their top off than screaming the place down.

i agree.

exactly

and anyone who disagrees is cruelly triggering her 🙄

Hmmmm, I think this is one of those situations where we do not know the full story of the family with the ASD boy.
Maybe, they had worked hard with the boy that morning to get him to keep his top on, but it went wrong in the restaurant?
Maybe they hadn't bothered to do anything and let him do what he wanted?
Maybe taking his top off was a compromise, as he had agreed to keep his trousers on?

We just don't know. What I DO know, is that trying to persuade an ASD kid to do something they do not want to do is making for trouble. So maybe the family had all the best intentions, but it went wrong once they had sat down with their food and they had to do the best thing in the given circumstances.

Who knows?