To think it’s very hard to live in the uk without inheritance or family money?

[Lifesucksthenyoudie]

Just that really. Social mobility seems almost impossible at the moment without a head start. I earn a decent salary (Dh doesn’t but that’s another post) but my standard of living is so much worse than my parents and my mother didn’t work until we were in secondary school and even then part time for peanuts. Nursery fees and mortgage alone wipe us out. I haven’t inherited any money (large family, no chance) and feel a bit stuck. Not after sympathy just interested to see if others feel a bit trapped. Why is our society geared up this way?

@taxguru
I agree with you but I don't think so many people understood the connection between rising house prices low interest rates and quantitative easing, all they saw was that their house was going up in value and they were dazzled by that.
Plus the people who make the rules benefit because they have money invested in property- they're not going to make rules that reduce their own wealth and power are they.
The sheer greed and self-interest of those in power also not so widely recognized back then?

We work in better paying jobs than my parents did but live in a less expensive house, have far less in savings, and will be unable to retire at the age of 55 like they did. They benefitted from inheritance, which we have not, but we did get help to buy a property and me and my husband both had our degrees funded which has arguably allowed us to get to where we are. The main difference I see though is in how we spend our money. Appreciate this won't be the same for everyone but we don't budget in the same way as they did- if we want something, we buy it. If the children want something, within reason, we will buy it. We eat out, have take aways, and spend on non essentials. If we lived like they did back in the 80's/90's we would likely have similar financial situations. I think it's really hard to compare as what is now considered to be a "basic" standard of living is so vastly different.

I agree, same with covid and furlough. Plenty of people happily gleeful at the amount of money they gained whilst sitting on their backsides, but then now whingeing about high inflation, high interest rates, low wages rises, etc., completely oblivious to the same consequences of quantitative easing that financed their few months of laziness. Were they oblivious enough not to realise there'd be costs of millions being idle?

@taxguru Yig’re obviously too young to remember when houses were going into negative equity in the early nineties. It was a horrible time. People lost loads of money and were stuck with houses that were worth look less than they purchased them for.

One couple I knew well had a negative equity of around ten thousand pounds on a small, one bedroom flat. That was a quarter of the price of the flat. They were stuck there for ages. Eventually, they were allowed to convert it to a loan, which they took with them on their next mortgage.

Nope not too young at all, I was of working age at that time and saw a lot of people with problems.

But if you read my post, I wasn't advocating a house price crash, I was advocating for a more balanced response, to actually prevent a crash, but to allow a period of price stagnation or modest falls. There's a balance to be had between crashing the housing market (as per 1990 etc), and holding it for a few years. What happened in 2008 was shed loads of cash pumped in, from quantitative easing, which allowed the housing bubble to continue growing which cost the country a decade of stagnation, except for the lucky Houseowners who continued to gain at the expense of everyone else.

A balance needs to be struck.

Same here - much better standard of living than both sets of parents.

“I do think that house prices should have been allowed to fall or at least stabilise in the 2008/9 crash.”

Although to be fair you did mention ‘fall’ in your first sentence, as well as stabilise.

Except you are doing exactly the same thing. DS2s flat is valued at pretty much the same as it was 4 years ago when he bought it. Home Counties commuter belt.

That was your parents mistake though, you didn’t need private education to go to uni and become a teacher. The money would have been better spent
as a boost for you buying a house.

You must be on a decent salary, top of upper pay scale plus leadership role would be at least £48k and you say your husband is well paid so at least the same again. So hard work did pay off, you have a much higher income than the average. Cleaners will earn more than lots of salaried roles per hour as they’re self employed so don’t get holiday or sick pay or employee pension contributions, you can’t compare the two.

@AllPrincessAnneshorses I did say it isn't always the case. Unfortunately (for him) your DS is the one bucking the trend here. Average house prices across the U.K. have risen from £230k to £281k from 2020 (when he bought 4 years ago) and now - about 20%. So mine and the other PP experience is pretty much representative of the average. Your son's is not.

There is no job for which you 'need' a private education.

We work in better paying jobs than my parents did but live in a less expensive house, have far less in savings, and will be unable to retire at the age of 55 like they did.

That kind of where we are - better educated in better paying jobs living in poorer or similar areas and with less saving and expect to work well past time our parents stopped. If we were decade or two older would have a much more lavish lifestyle with same jobs/qualifications which does make me look at our kids and worry how they'll fare.

There's a difference between "fall" and "crash"

Life and expectations were simpler and easier then before technology! A house was a practical home, not a show home, not everyone could had CH, could afford a car, home phone or a video machine (renting one was the norm). Mums didn't work as much, looking after kids and doing everything else took more time, especially without having the luxury of a car. So yes times were just as hard, more so in many ways. Now the basic commodities aren't just food, clothes etc, the need for a mobile phone, wifi, subscriptions have added to costs for basic living. That's why both parents tend to need to work, plus wanting luxury items like hot tubs, game consoles which weren't an option then. X

This.

We sacrificed a lot in our early days to make sure we stayed out of debt.

Me and dp haven't received inheritance or have family money. Both our parents had/still do low paid jobs.

Neither of us went to uni, but have both managed our careers quite well. Not on massive incomes but above for our area. We have 2 dc have a mortgage, pension pots and manage to have treats and holidays.

If we lived down south I doubt we'd be doing as well as we were.

We're 67/68, and still have fit healthy ageing parents in their late 80s/early 90s. While I am very unlikely to inherit anything from my father who had a second family, I should inherit half of my mum's two up two down apart from the income drawdown she has taken out, to buy hearing aids and replacement glasses. We (her daughters) insisted that she bought in the early 1990s. It will pass me by (I/we don't need any more) and I will do a deed of variation to our DC. It will I hope set them up for the future they want, but I doubt it will include a riverside apartment overlooking a pretty part of the Thames in central London.

Well, you don't NEED private education to do pretty much anything.

Or do you think that anyone who didn't get privately educated can't get to uni ...

The parents would have had no idea what career their child was going to go on to though, so how was it ‘their mistake’?
My children are privately educated, but not because I think it will ‘buy’ them a particular career or salary level. They’re privately educated so that they don’t have to go to our local comp with its reputation for bullying and poor behaviour. If they become teachers, or retail workers, or cleaners, or anything else, I won’t see that as a waste of money.

No inheritance or family money here. It was tight for a few years when we had nursery fees on top of mortgage but we benefited from low interest rate through all that time. I feel like everyone else has more and spends more and I'm not, but maybe it just seems that way.

Yes, I think it's likely much harder now (esp for younger people) than during the low interest rate era or before than when social mobility was a bit easier.

Average trade salary is £10k higher than average graduate salary nowadays and tradespeople own properties three years earlier on average (although that's likely partly because they start working younger).

Thanks so much for the lovely words, I needed to hear that this week. 🙂I'm sorry to hear you're in the same situation too.

At the time I was too exhausted/drained by it all to appeal the PIP decision. Which is exactly what they want, I'm sure. I am thinking about giving it another go and applying again but afraid of being rejected again as my last experience with them was pretty soul-destroying. It shouldn't have to be like this.

I agree with both sides. I am in my late 40s and started with nothing, bought in the late 90s with ex only to then lose most profits by 2001 when we sold because of market crash AND endowment. Property had gone from £40k to £80k and I walked away with £2k when we split but I wanted out so didn't care, we were too young to understand the crash etc. Bought again with partner who is now my husband, but that was not for another 9 years. Tried desperately in 2004 to buy but it was too hard, we simply couldn't afford anything much we liked, just 1 bed flats centrally or 2 bed in the end of nowhere. By 09 we had more of a deposit AND looked further away, bought much better with garden and a council home 3 bed terrace, 15 min drive from very busy town. In that 2004 to 09 period we never ate out, just paid basic bills and barely a holiday, it was hellish. Then moving in entailed sheets instead of curtains. It was all off our own backs, and we felt it, with then another 2 years of backbreaking and expensive work on the place which was a dump to start with. Followed by baby and no cash for a good 4 years.

These days it'll be even harder for young ones to buy, I do worry about our son and what it will be like for him. I think alot of older people are blinded by their own situation being ok, and that it's just something young people have to go through 'like they did'. It really has changed, and yes there are some subscriptions and lattes, but even going without doesn't get you to 9 x salary.

Watch Garys Economics on youtube to truly understand how things are only going to get worse for our kids.

I disagree, i grew up probably in your parents era, we did not have cars , holidays abroad maybe a caravan in Wales once every 2 years, fitted carpets did not eat out, didnt have mobile phones nails /eyelashes done, go to hairdressers did not expect a certain standard of living we just survived day to day and worked hard to eke out the money.
I did not go to uni but i worked hard, now live in own home paid for, nice car, i still do not have a good mobile its pay as you go costs me £7.50 per month, but i get unlimited free calls txts get Facebook and all other things i need, do not have my nails done or have my hair dyed at a hairdressers, i rarely go out to eat, i never buy coffee out, but i feel i have an ok standard of living.
My daughter has a much better standard of living than me.