To wonder how much longer it will be before all teachers quit?

[FunionsRFun]

Been called a bitch and screamed at today. Kids are making no progress because 90% of the leason is dedicated to bad behaviour.
My detentions have been taken off the system to make behaviour look better.
Why would anyone do this job?

I left teaching about ten years ago. It took me four years to double my old salary. I thought I'd miss the holidays but it turns out I didn't need them when I wasn't so exhausted. I'm sad for the sector that it is the way it is, worried for our children but it was the best choice for me personally.

I teach in a grammar school, and even there (where some SEN would historically have made it difficult or impossible for a child to pass the 11+, or cope with being in a grammar school even if they did pass), we have sharply increasing numbers of students with SEN.

Don't get me wrong - it is great if bright students with SEN can access schools like this, if they can cope with them. But why the very sharp increase? In particular we have loads of kids coming from primary waiting for ASD diagnoses, especially in the current Y7.

I qualified in 96 (primary). No-one got a permanent job from graduating. You got maybe a yr temp contract and you had to prove yourself before permanent was offered up.
I do see some adverts for permanent subject teachers at comp but whether that would be offered to a new graduate I'm not sure.

I qualified in 95. I got a permanent job

This is an interesting read and indicates the gap between what parents think and what teachers see (not just about toilet training)

www.theguardian.com/education/2024/feb/28/one-in-four-school-starters-in-england-and-wales-not-toilet-trained-say-teachers?CMP=ShareiOSAppOther

I teach Reception. I changed careers four years ago so I walked in with my eyes open. Despite working in a lovely school (albeit in a very deprived part of London) with a fantastic and supportive leadership team, the reality is shocking.

I have 25 children in my class, with one TA for support.
Two have profound special needs and are non-verbal. One will roam the classroom and wail, the other will sometimes amuse himself.
Three have (as yet undiagnosed but likely) ADHD and cannot sit still or focus for more than two minutes at a time.
Two are not toilet trained and frequently wet themselves.
Three have little to no English, even this late in the year, so can't understand instructions or focus in lessons (two of them have non-literate parents, so communication is challenging)
One is homeless and, though very bright, is struggling emotionally.
Four have severe emotional problems due to their circumstances.
Three have (again, so far undiagnosed but very evident) ASD.
Two are showing clear signs of ODD (which means they point blank refuse to listen or co-operate).
The remaining 5 are a dream.

There is no funding for additional support for these kids and a years-long wait for diagnosis/help.

Yesterday I was punched, kicked, scratched and spat at. I raised this with each parent and the response was lukewarm at best (I'm sure they experience the same) or met with denial ('he's not like that at home').

You are welcome to visit at any time @peakygold and recommend control strategies for this very interesting crowd.

I'm looking to leave. It breaks my heart but the system is broken. Future generations will look back (if any of them can actually read and write) and be horrified that we let our children down so shamefully.

With regard to increased numbers of children with SEN I can think of a few reasons:

In the past (1970s/80s there were more special schools and many children with Learning or Physical Disabilities which we now see in Mainstream e.g. Downs, Cerebral Palsy, sight or hearing impairment were not integrated. Of course, this can be a good thing, but extra funding is required (and was promised when the Special Schools started closing).

More diagnoses are being made - you didn't hear of anyone being diagnosed with dyslexia or ADHD in the 70s. Mild ASD would have gone undiagnosed. Obviously, it's better that these issues are diagnosed but there needs to be extra funding to cater for these children's needs.

More premature babies are surviving which is clearly a good thing but until the 80s premature babies with immature lungs were less likely to live. I think the surfactant that is now used was only introduced in 1980. I'm not medically very knowledgeable but my friend's daughter benefitted from this in 1980. Not all these babies will have learning disabilities but some do - my friend's daughter didn't but I know of some that have. Nowadays very tiny prem babies live and, as a parent, I would be very grateful for this but not all are without problems.

the gap between what parents think and what teachers see

I think this gap is being perpetuated by what parents are told and led to believe by schools. School websites and letters always highlight all the support that children get and how well the school is functioning.

We are encouraged to collude with this facade in order that Ofsted don't fail the school. It seems like a shaky line is being walked between honesty and reality by the school leadership themselves.

Absolutely agree with all of this. The population has also grown rapidly, which the number of schools (certainly not special schools) hasn’t.

If you can find money to kill people, you can find money to help people.

Because people are much more aware of ASD in bright children and in girls.

You might be suprised, there are now shortages across most subjects.

The reason they're not getting jobs now though is there are no vacancies. Nothing to do with the fact they've just graduated. They're guaranteed a job for their first year but once their probation is up there aren't the jobs out there for anyone regardless of how much experience they have

Yes, Dd is 17. I remember wondering about her when she was little. But she was sociable, chatty and happy.

But even then ASD was thought of as a male disease that affected only a few females.

The barriers have really come down for girls massively in the last 10
yrars or so.

I also think education was much more laid back in the past, so less severe cases flew under the radar. But schools are so horrible and stressful now that they refuse to go.

I also think education was much more laid back in the past, so less severe cases flew under the radar. But schools are so horrible and stressful now that they refuse to go.

This is a massive issue. The government wants all children to go to school every day, even if they are ill/sad/bereaved/angry etc etc and once they are there, they are on a fast-moving production line of working harder, doing more, getting results-there is no time or space (or staff) to deal with any issues and no gaps in the classroom or curriculum for anything other than ‘working harder’. If the pace was slower, less external pressure, more staff, more external providers to refer to for support, those children would probably be a damn sight happier about spending time there.

But no, our government just want to blame parents/schools for poor attendance and double the fines for anyone not toe-ing the line. They spectacularly miss the point, time after time.

Oh, and wanting schools to teach British values, yet themselves only modelling values such as lying, cheating, fraud, obfuscation and threats of violence, as anyone who listened to Gillian Keegan’s speech last week about punching Ofsted inspectors would see! If she doesn’t like what Ofsted do-bloody do something about it-she’s the Education Secretary, ffs.

The kids aren’t happy, the staff are stressed, the schools are literally crumbling apart. Have the standards risen throughout all this misery? I very much doubt it.

I left teaching after 15 years. I just walked out one day. Couldn't do it any more. I had to declare myself bankrupt and move to a tiny studio. I was already struggling financially due to high living costs in London (where I've lived all my life).

I was a good teacher but the constant micro managing was draining. I was tired of crying. I was tired of working ridiculous hours just to complete pointless and time consuming admin tasks that had no positive effect on my teaching. I was waking up every morning (exhausted after only 3-4 hours sleep) wishing I was dead. I used to fantasise about being hit by a bus and breaking my legs so I could have a break from it all in hospital.

And I was so tired of the disgusting behaviour of some of the children and some of the parents.

This wasn't my experience of just one school, I'd worked in a few during my career.

I am now starting to feel happy again. My spark is gradually coming back. I've lost two stone. I've got my periods back. I'm not vomiting on the way to work any more. I don't have to use my inhaler as much. If I get a cold, I recover in a few days. I sleep better. My hair isn't falling out, it's growing, as are my nails, even my eyesight has improved. It's amazing how much stress can affect your mind and body.

I now work two part time jobs - retail and admin. I love having a life again.

If you read this thread and all the other school related threads on here, in my opinion it’s safe to say the education system is totally unfit for ANYBODY, child, teacher or parent.
It’s just not working (other than the fact it provides childcare which enables adults to go out to work).

It’s clearly dysfunctional, it meets the needs of very very few children by its very nature, it’s outdated, hasn’t kept pace with the modern world and all we know about how people learn, how neurodiverse a lot of people are, how we live in a digital world with information at our fingertips in seconds. At this point it feels like we’re banging our heads against a brick wall and expecting a different outcome!

WHEN will the government listen??

Which shows there's not one answer to this. I love my job. I'm closing in on 20 years in the same school. If we applied Michaela style rules, I wouldn't last a week. I'm not a robot and neither are my children. And I prefer working in a school where students of all faiths and none are free to be themselves.

WWhere did we get the money from after the war? Where did Roosevelt in the new deal? You expend a bit to get things moving, then the economy grows and you are out of a hole. Austerity just crushes the economy. It’s not a household budget. Making everyone think it’s the same is the worst of Thatcher’s many terrible legacies.

Wow @fuckityfuckityfuckfuck your username is clear now! That's insane to have 2/3 with SEN! That's way beyond the national average. This is insane. In some places it's not supposed to be over 1/3 of students are SEN - isn't there a limit here? I've just returned to the UK. We were in a co-teaching class and there was a limit of 20% SEN. The ration you have isn't fair to anyone.

@cremebrulait how can there be a limit? What do you do if it exceeds it?

Have never heard of a limit on SEN numbers! How on earth could there be? Children apply for places at schools and if they qualify on distance/siblings/whatever the criteria is, they get a place. You can't boot them out once you've placed them on the SEND register or discover that they already are.

No, it's not uncommon to have classes with more than 50% of children on the SEND register in mainstream schools. Remember that that includes social and emotional health needs as well as learning and cognition, language and communication disorders and physical disabilities.

There’s no limit on Send numbers in class. I’ve often had 3/4 or 2/3

Oh this is just so naive I don’t even know whether to respond properly.

Tony Benn was not naive. Maybe he expected too much of our inward thinking western politics, but stupid or naive he was not.

https://www.facebook.com/YourNHSNeedsYou/videos/tony-benn/958641711703102/

Where we lived they tried to remove SEN kids from GE classes and send them to Special Day Classes. One wiuld think there would be a legal requirement to hire more teachers or aides?