Assigned Female at Birth - AFAB

[ShugarTits]

AIBU to get the actual rage every time I see this written down? Often in reputable sources.

Obviously this has come about due to people differentiating between gender and sex - I understand needing clarity between those two when talking to or questioning people.

but every single bloody time I read it I can only think of the horrific female infanticide statistics. AIBU to think ‘assigned female at birth’ is fucking offensive to women, as so many of us are killed at birth ONLY because we are female. Nobody assigned those infants a female sex, they didn’t just randomly pick half of the babies and murder them.

can’t we agree as a society to call out AFAB and AMAB as being horrific and change it? Happy to hear alternatives. Observed female/male at birth sounds reasonable to me if you need to specify birth sex vs gender.

I said males not men.

Men & transwomen are both male sex so when I say males in female spaces I am including both groups of males.

Transwomen are men. You know this as well as anyone.

@izimbra

I think that poster is referring to men who abuse self ID- therefore not trans but chancing their arm to access female space. How are women supposed to tell the difference of gender is a feeling and nothing to do with physical sex or outward presentation?

@izimbra can you tell me what a woman is without referencing biology or society-bound gender stereotypes?

Or unspecified feelings in heads

Or a circular definition, e.g. “a woman is a person who identifies as a woman”.

What you are trying to do is tell women to shut up and be respectful about something in society that is harmful to women and children. Why should we?
The 'other side' has no respect. They just think that women and children are acceptable collateral damage and call women who call this out bigots.

//

Absolutely this.

And in the week that a thug TRA bloke in New Zealand who openly and publicly punched an older lady on the face at a rally was freed without convictions and anonymity for life on this charge.

See how that respect on both sides is working out, eh ladies?

God it’s depressing

Women stop speaking up

'Can we be clear' is a pertinent question on a thread where women are being told words matter. It's hard to be clear when people play Humpty Dumpty with words and use them to mean whatever they want.

It's not us who are deliberately attempting to change words from simple, clearly understood meanings.

Male and female - sex. Biological fact. But there are now those who'll claim these words can be used for 'gender' - XY individuals, no DSDs claiming to be 'female'.

Man and woman. Specific terms meaning adult human males and females. Necessary words.

There's no good reason to subvert these to describe 'gender' as that has its own terms 'masculine and feminine'.

'Assigned' ... you can assign the value of a variable, you can assign a task - you can't 'assign' an immutable property such as sex.

Words matter. We can't communicate properly otherwise, and there are real consequences to these changes if laws have been written with the long-existing meanings and then are (mis)interpreted using new ones.

You don’t have to respect the outcome just the viewpoint.

//

It's quite difficult to respect the opinion that humans can change sex.

Exactly. I don't respect the position of flat earthers either.

I don't respect liars or those that bully others in yo accepting their lies.

I can respect your religion up to a point. I will use your preferred name and pronouns (as a courtesy) in almost all circumstances. But I shouldn’t feel pressured to practise your religion. I’m not going to pretend that it’s possible to really change sex, or that there aren’t situations where sex really does matter.

😁 that's what I was alluding to....😉 but it looks like Izimbra has nothing....

DreamyCritic
I am still wondering how many women & children need to be harmed before Dutch deems it a meaningful impact.

These are EXACTLY the same arguments used by the far right to stop migration to the UK from Pakistan & India.

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Except they are based on the belief that humans can change sex. Which isn't AT ALL ridiculous 

Oh ffs, you can’t be serious?
So the men who currently oppress women in Afghanistan would stop doing it if those women declared themselves male? 🙄

So a woman raped by a male (transwoman) in an NHS single sex ward then being told that that could not have happened because there was no man on the ward has not meaningfully impacted the safety of the woman who has been raped?

And that's just one example.

Do you know what your views disgust me. I've got a fair idea that no amount of harm to women & children will be 'meaningful' to you.

Yes. As they are men. You can't be one without the other.

Can you explain to me what the difference is between a trans woman and any other man?

And why that difference means they should have the right to be treated as the opposite sex in relation to single sex spaces?

Yeah it doesn't work like that though. "You consider it a fact, others do not". Some things are objectively true mate
-He drove under the influence .

• The sun is hot

-The baby has blue eyes. -The baby is a girl

You can't make up your own facts."oh no I don't feel like I was under the influence" You can feel any way you like but it doesn't change facts

YOU consider it a fact, others do not.

If you don’t believe it’s a fact, then you presumably think it’s an opinion.

You think whether or not sex exists is a matter of opinion?

Did you miss the bit of the KS3 English syllabus which covers the difference between fact and opinion?

I don’t know why they don’t just call it legal sex.

But remember…

‘War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.' - ‘1984’ Fiction book about fiction

‘Males are Females if that’s what they claim be’ - 2024 dystopian bullshit spouted by scientific fact denyers.

So the transphobes here who are adamant that no human being should 'be allowed to live a lie' - how does this impact on your interaction with trans people?

Assuming you know any trans people?

Would you refuse to use a person's chosen name if usually belonged a gender different to their sex at birth? Would you refuse to refer to them by their preferred gender if you were discussing them with a third party?

Would it be the same for friends or family? Even if you knew it was deeply hurtful to the person and was experienced as bullying?

Really interested to know how your fanaticism on this issue impacts on your relationships with trans people. I imagine it's very similar to how homophobes behave - you know the sort of people who object to homosexuals on the grounds that 'it's just not natural', or that homosexuality is a threat to the family unit.

"I don’t know why they don’t just call it legal sex."

If you have a gender recognition certificate you are legally recognised as your preferred gender. Birth & marriage & death certificate & passport in your preferred gender.