To think raising school absenteeism fines won’t help much.

[Boomer55]

Fines for parents taking children out of school without permission will rise across England from September.
The minimum fine will increase from £60 to £80 per parent as part of a government drive to return attendance to pre-pandemic levels.
One school told BBC News one out of every three of its pupils absent without permission had been on a family holiday during term time.
A head teachers' union said fines were needed to avoid "chaos" in schools.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-68420275

@Laiste that "x10" comment was about holidays.
Families with "no spare cash" can't afford to go on holiday in the first place.
(I'm not saying I agree with that idea....)

No, it was about the precise aspect of business you mentioned. Regulation.

Yes i know. We can't afford to go on holiday during term time, but can get enough together for a week in July.

I don't think you'll find that's something unusual ...

sorry - can't afford a hol during school hols i mean

@Laiste sorry did you mean you can or can't afford term time holidays?

@Laiste just seen your correction.
My point was that many families can't afford any holidays ever. Term time or not.

If the government is not careful we’re going to soon end up with headlines about record-low birth rates and population crisis like in Japan or South Korea. Why would parents choose to have more children when they have to deal with this nonsense and being told how to parent their own kids? They really need to back off, the record numbers of parents taking their children out of the school system and choosing to home educate should be a warning sign.

''10 x the fine'' would be £1160 per child.

For people with low income that would have to be recouped with a payment plan based on affordability ect ect. Who the hell would vote for taxes spent on all that admin?

Yes to this^
of course most of ministers are ok financially and don’t care about cheaper holidays plus their kids are in public schools which break up for holidays earlier.

Any regulation that means holiday providers can't have seasonal pricing will have one of two results - prices rising year round so those without children are paying more, or holiday providers going bust.

The travel industry works on small margins and there's negligible profit in low season.
Hoteliers and overseas airlines will charge tour operators what they want as they can't be ruled by UK law, so the only option is to increase low season pricing or go out of business.

No that's very true.

A specific thing you think prevents regulation and not what my post was about. UK regulation of business protects us - most people want that.

It's easy money for the local council though as families factor in the fine in holiday cost.

If they truely meant it they would put a fine that would get parents thinking.

But the increase will stop people taking them out for a day off for their birthday etc

We just love business holding us all to ransom these days. Thatcher and all the attitudes she promoted have so much to answer for.

Holiday cottages in Cornwall in peak season command over £1000 a week. Liscence to print money

Sadly it's true also that holiday companies would try to increase the average price across the year.

I'm wondering how that would work in principal though. No one's going to pay big(er) bucks for a week in Bognor in October. (no offence to Bognor)

I think it's fair to say that it's always going to be more expensive to go away during the school holls.

I think it's also fair to say that fining parents for absence isn't going to work. For all the reasons outlined so far.

It's lazy from the government and putting more pressure on the relationship between parents and schools.

Their fine is paying fir weeks they aren't using

The whole system needs complete reform.
**
I believe that the reason for the uptick in persistent absences since the pandemic is for several reasons.
**
Firstly, the fact that the government closed the schools to most children during the pandemic and then continued for ages with all the silly "bubble" stuff that made no sense, broke the contract between schools and families and undermined the importance of regular school attendance for a number of people. Before anyone shoots me down, I am not saying they were right or wrong to close schools initially, or that it's OK for parents not to take attendance seriously. I just think it has caused a shift in attitudes for some people in recent years.
**
Secondly, the Tories have overseen the wholesale destruction of mental health and SEND services, as well as the NHS as a whole. This has clearly had a massive impact on the wellbeing of millions of people, some of them school kids. Absenteeism or absence due to persistent illness is one of the ways that this manifests.
**
Thirdly, people in almost every income bracket are feeling the effects of the COL crisis. Taking the kids out of school for many families is the difference between having holidays or not. It's not just about saving £100 nowadays. They simply can't afford to go away in the school holidays. It's beyond unreasonable and unrealistic to expect families to never experience family holidays together. School is important but it's not the only important thing. Life is important. Family time is important. Enrichment is important. Cultural experiences are important. Time away from the daily grind is important.
**
I think the whole school system (and public services in general) is unfit for purpose and needs urgent and radical reform. The curriculum is outdated. SEND children are not adequately supported and able to reach their potential. Resources are stretched beyond belief. The issue of families not being allowed the flexibility to take affordable holidays is really the least of it.
**
It's much easier for the Tories to punish and blame children and their parents than it is to actually analyse the numerous reasons why this situation is occuring and address the root causes, for which the blame lies squarely at their feet. Basically it's just more DARVO from the government. Kids deserve an education and the government is not fulfilling it's obligations to make education and healthcare accessible to all.

Spot on @Fargo79 👏

My son had awful attendance in reception because it was when the world went back to normal after the pandemic, I believe the first full school year with no lockdowns. He caught everything going, at one point I had covid and he had chicken pox which was not a fun week. He's now year 2 and recently got 100% attendance award which I chucked straight in the bin.
I hope parents won't be fined in cases of children catching one thing after the other. If the school can prove you've been on holiday, fair enough. If social services need to be involved because school suspects something more going on, fair enough. But I resent being told to give my child calpol and send him in so his attendance won't be affected. If he needs calpol he's staying at home.

Absolutely, I was just saying that it's not just 80 quid. I don't blame parents for doing it, for me the government and schools broke down any concept of every second counting during covid so I doubt thigs will recover and the respect for education has long gone

In my case they don't have to prove it (going on holiday) i tell the school politely and honestly in advance. I wouldn't ask my DC to lie.

I agree with you on the point of 'send them in unless they're dying' advice. IME working in schools we dreaded the poor snotty child coming in day after day feeling ill and spreading germs. I don't imagine anythings actually changed re: attitude of staff. No one wants to try to teach a poorly child.

I didn't read the full article but the OP mentions the head teacher association? So they are in support I assume?

Well we have got record low birth rates and a population crisis and why would government be concerned about home education it's cheaper for the public purse?

Again, you wrote regulation and did not specify further. You then used the concept to make a daft comparison, which means your post was indeed about that aspect of my argument.

It appears that we're back to the concept of trying to regulate holiday pricing again. Please do tell us what you suggest and how it would protect us. You haven't so far.

@40somethingme yes several schools in South London have recently closed or plan to close.
Schools that just a few years ago that were oversubscribed are now undersubscribed.

It's an interesting point. So far it's been a locally specific thing, as DC who were born around the early 2010s mini boom are still in the school system, and those from the 2020s drop are too young yet. But we're likely to see the impact in a few years.