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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be angry that Scarlet Blake is being called a woman.

795 replies

ArabellaScott · 23/02/2024 15:42

Scarlet Blake has been found guilty of murder. He also tortured and killed a cat.

He is not a woman.

This shouldn't be reported as a woman's crime.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-68360122

Scarlet Blake

Cat killer Scarlet Blake found guilty of murdering Jorge Martin Carreno

Jorge Martin Carreno was pulled from a river after being killed by Scarlet Blake in 2021.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-68360122

OP posts:
Thread gallery
34
GailBlancheViola · 24/02/2024 19:37

You've completely missed the boat in anger. I never said that trans women are female. I said they are women.

Female = Mammalian/Sex
Woman = Human/Gender identity.

No, Woman is an Adult Female Human, Man is an Adult Male Human. TW are not women.

You can be a female and feel like a woman, or you can be male and feel like a woman. Being a woman is related to ones internal sense-of-self. It's how we feel about ourselves and unique to all of us. Having ovaries doesn't make you judge and jury over anyones sense-of-self.

No male has the first clue of what a woman feels like all he has is his male version of what he thinks a woman feels like.

And of course you talk of paraphilia's...we're back here again are we? Back to autogynephilia? When trans women go on HRT, their sex drive usually plummets and they tend to become impotent. It makes no sense. If it's sexual, then why we not de-transition when the so called "paraphilic disorder" element disappears?

Bollocks.

And don't you like feeling sexy? When women wear lingerie and red lipstick so their lips resemble a vagina, is that not sexual? You don't like feeling desirable? Of course most women do...but if a trans woman does these things, suddenly it's a paraphilia? Maybe it's just us feeling in-tune with our femininity and sense-of-self, the same as it is with most women.

More offensive, insulting, sexist, misogynist bollocks that could only have been written by a male. What about Goths and Punks of both sexes wearing black lipstick, what are they projecting? No problem with males wearing makeup, crack on it does not make said male female or a woman.

Plus, even when it is sexual and comes up later in life (which it does for some trans women) it's usually merely an outlet because it's the only way they feel able to express their femininity and experience euphoria. Hence when they go on HRT, the so called "paraphilias" disappear.

Ah good old euphoria, a favourite of the TRAs. But it's got sexual, oh no.

For most of us, it's not sexual. I hated being a boy from as young as 5 years old. I asked for a dolls house for my 6th birthday and was refused and reprimanded. I knew I wanted to be a girl before I knew anything about sex. I couldn't bear the idea of living as a boy or growing old as a man. I would have rather taken my own live 100 times over. Just as most people would if their gender identity doesn't match their gender expression. Imagine waking up and seeing a man in the mirror. In that scenario would it be realistic for me to just tell you to "get on with your life, that's your body now"? Or would you try to do something about it?

Your parents were wrong. As for the imagine waking up and see a man in the mirror, not likely is it? Are we in the realms of alien body snatchers now?

Ironic that you say we have mental illnesses, yet when we transition, the mental illnesses rates among us seem to plummet. Seems we're not fixing the "illness" in "the right way" in your view? Even the pseudo-scientist Ray Blanchard who peddled the same paraphilia argument last century (and was humbled some decades ago) came to the conclusion that transitioning was the best solution. But "I've got a degree in molecular biology" over here knows what's best for us apparently!

Various studies have shown that mental illness is not improved by transition, the goal you seek is impossible.

The thing is, we do just want to get on with our lives. We don't ask for much. Mostly just basic HRT and gender identity clinic access so we can transition and become productive members of society with decent well-being, for people to treat us with dignity as human beings like everyone else, and for people to not thrust being trans front and centre when anything bad happens.

You want the world and everyone in it to revolve around you and to dance to your tune. The dehumanising language used for woman, the addition of an unwanted prefix, full and unfettered access to all spaces, services, sports, etc., set aside on the basis of sex for women. You will not afford women the basic consideration of safety, dignity and privacy.

You thrust trans front and centre when it suits your narrative and then insist it is not relevant when the PR looks bad for you.

Case in point - here we have a psychopath and a murderer, but the priority on mumsnet is that the criminal is trans?That's what angers people about this person? Seriously? Maybe reflect on that a bit. It's insane.

The case in point here is that due to the activities of TRAs like yourself the male guilty of this horrendous crime is being reported in the media as a woman. He is not. This is not a woman's crime, he does not belong in the female prison estate, this crime must not be recorded as having been committed by a woman.

EveningReflection · 24/02/2024 19:58

Timefordrama · 24/02/2024 16:11

Aside from putting in complaints to the BBC and other media outlets, what can we do to change things? A petition? Talking to our MPs? Engaging with those people in power who believe in objective and biological reality so they introduce legislation reflecting the necessity for truthful reporting? What would be best?

There are some organisations you can support, for example Sex Matters

Redebs · 24/02/2024 20:58

Please can we just stop calling men 'she'?

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 21:18

@ArabellaScott I don’t know of any trans people, in the media or elsewhere, that say sex can be changed. They say they can change their gender, not their sex.

ArabellaScott · 24/02/2024 21:20

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 21:18

@ArabellaScott I don’t know of any trans people, in the media or elsewhere, that say sex can be changed. They say they can change their gender, not their sex.

You've not RTFT, then?

OP posts:
SomeCatFromJapan · 24/02/2024 21:44

@Notamum12345577 India Willoughby offered to whip out the cervix that India fondly believed that India now posseses, on live tv.

PonyPatter44 · 24/02/2024 21:54

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 21:18

@ArabellaScott I don’t know of any trans people, in the media or elsewhere, that say sex can be changed. They say they can change their gender, not their sex.

So why do the papers report that this murder was committed by a woman? It blatantly wasn't done by a woman, Scarlet Blake has a woman's name and long hair but is categorically NOT a woman, so why refer to him as such?

DamasceneRose · 24/02/2024 22:00

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 21:18

@ArabellaScott I don’t know of any trans people, in the media or elsewhere, that say sex can be changed. They say they can change their gender, not their sex.

India Willoughby claims to be female.

To be angry that Scarlet Blake is being called a woman.
PrincessTeaSet · 24/02/2024 22:29

Erin394 · 24/02/2024 16:28

You've completely missed the boat in anger. I never said that trans women are female. I said they are women.

Female = Mammalian/Sex
Woman = Human/Gender identity.

You can be a female and feel like a woman, or you can be male and feel like a woman. Being a woman is related to ones internal sense-of-self. It's how we feel about ourselves and unique to all of us. Having ovaries doesn't make you judge and jury over anyones sense-of-self.

And of course you talk of paraphilia's...we're back here again are we? Back to autogynephilia? When trans women go on HRT, their sex drive usually plummets and they tend to become impotent. It makes no sense. If it's sexual, then why we not de-transition when the so called "paraphilic disorder" element disappears?

And don't you like feeling sexy? When women wear lingerie and red lipstick so their lips resemble a vagina, is that not sexual? You don't like feeling desirable? Of course most women do...but if a trans woman does these things, suddenly it's a paraphilia? Maybe it's just us feeling in-tune with our femininity and sense-of-self, the same as it is with most women.

Plus, even when it is sexual and comes up later in life (which it does for some trans women) it's usually merely an outlet because it's the only way they feel able to express their femininity and experience euphoria. Hence when they go on HRT, the so called "paraphilias" disappear.

For most of us, it's not sexual. I hated being a boy from as young as 5 years old. I asked for a dolls house for my 6th birthday and was refused and reprimanded. I knew I wanted to be a girl before I knew anything about sex. I couldn't bear the idea of living as a boy or growing old as a man. I would have rather taken my own live 100 times over. Just as most people would if their gender identity doesn't match their gender expression. Imagine waking up and seeing a man in the mirror. In that scenario would it be realistic for me to just tell you to "get on with your life, that's your body now"? Or would you try to do something about it?

Ironic that you say we have mental illnesses, yet when we transition, the mental illnesses rates among us seem to plummet. Seems we're not fixing the "illness" in "the right way" in your view? Even the pseudo-scientist Ray Blanchard who peddled the same paraphilia argument last century (and was humbled some decades ago) came to the conclusion that transitioning was the best solution. But "I've got a degree in molecular biology" over here knows what's best for us apparently!

The thing is, we do just want to get on with our lives. We don't ask for much. Mostly just basic HRT and gender identity clinic access so we can transition and become productive members of society with decent well-being, for people to treat us with dignity as human beings like everyone else, and for people to not thrust being trans front and centre when anything bad happens.

Case in point - here we have a psychopath and a murderer, but the priority on mumsnet is that the criminal is trans? That's what angers people about this person? Seriously? Maybe reflect on that a bit. It's insane.

Ugh! You are nothing like any woman I know with this crap about lipstick and vaginas. It sounds like a male fantasy... Unsurprisingly?

Being a woman is nothing to do with feeling sexual or playing with dolls houses.

Anyway surely men can feel sexual and desirable too?

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 22:46

@DamasceneRose Yes, but has she claimed to change her sex or gender?

TheKeatingFive · 24/02/2024 22:47

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 21:18

@ArabellaScott I don’t know of any trans people, in the media or elsewhere, that say sex can be changed. They say they can change their gender, not their sex.

I agree that this is the position of most trans people, the blessed India notwithstanding.

But why then do they want access to women's sex specific spaces?

TheKeatingFive · 24/02/2024 22:48

Notamum12345577 · 24/02/2024 22:46

@DamasceneRose Yes, but has she claimed to change her sex or gender?

He's claiming to actually have a cervix, so what do you think?

Chocladore · 24/02/2024 23:50

This fucking nonsense just needs to stop!

WomaninBoots · 25/02/2024 07:33

TheKeatingFive · 24/02/2024 22:47

I agree that this is the position of most trans people, the blessed India notwithstanding.

But why then do they want access to women's sex specific spaces?

Yes! This!

Stop pissing around with gender/sex semantics. In practical terms transwomen are using single-SEX spaces and sporting categories that exist for women to have safety, privacy and dignity and full engagement with society due to the physical differences between the SEXES

"Trans people know they've only changed their gender" 🙄 I'm running out of ways to say 'have a fucking word with yourself'.

Dogfisher · 25/02/2024 08:24

Abouttoblow · 23/02/2024 17:54

I see there's a few of the "be kind" brigade in the voting. They're part of the group that helped this shit show get to where it is.

Just use she even if they're a man, it's kind and it costs you nothing.
Of course they're a woman, you wouldn't be referring to them as she if they weren't.
Of course they're female, everyone refers to them as a woman and uses she when talking about them.
Of course you can't exclude them from female spaces, services, prisons and sports, they're female.

Being kind doesn't "cost us nothing."
It's cost us everything.

Great post.

ArabellaScott · 25/02/2024 08:32

The total vote is hovering between 93 and 94% of MNers who think that IANBU.

I'd love to see broader polling on this.

How many people thought Scarlet was a woman?

How many people would want to know that Scarlet is actually a transwoman - that is to say, male?

How many people think that crime stats should be recorded by sex, not gender?

OP posts:
EasternStandard · 25/02/2024 08:37

High majority yanbu and yet the law enables this via the GRA

We have a massive clash - so what next?

Men keep overriding women?

All these threads are due to the law

Alphavilla · 25/02/2024 08:39

A woman is an adult human female and so to be a woman you must be female. It’s impossible to be a woman and not be female. A trans woman should be reported by the BBC as a trans woman not a woman. That article was clearly wrong and misrepresenting the facts.

whilst I have every compassion for the trans community and we should be in a live and let live world, we should not allow trans issues to cross the boundaries put in place to safeguard the female sex. It doesn’t matter how much medical intervention one has, how many body parts are chopped off or added on, one cannot change sex. One can present as a woman to society but that does not mean you have morphed into an actual one. I can make a cake look like a very realistic teapot, but when you cut it open it’s still just cake. It could never brew a tea. My cake presents as a teapot only. If it fell on my foot I would not say I had been hurt by a falling teapot would I?

ErrolTheDragon · 25/02/2024 09:01

How many people think that crime stats should be recorded by sex, not gender?

By sex (obviously) but might be useful to have some record of 'gender identity'. Obviously that's harder to do reliably as, unlike sex, 'gender identity' isn't a simple binary but there are stats on demographics such a religion and ethnicity so there's obviously ability to collect and analyse extra information.

Walkaround · 25/02/2024 10:13

If you have to spend a lifetime fighting against the physiology of your otherwise perfectly healthy body, because it does not naturally comply with an extreme fantasy that you are stuck in a body of the wrong sex, then this is an illness, imvho, and it is not an illness caused by the healthy body, but one caused by the unwell mind. Harming the body to comply with the mind’s desires does not cure the illness, as the fight between the body and mind goes on for the lifetime of the trans person, regardless - the body will otherwise attempt to re-masculinise or re-feminise.

It is not fair to insist women put up with men in their sports, prisons and statistical data to safeguard what are, basically, unwell men’s fantasies. It’s even more dangerous now people are simply self-identifying, as that provides zero protection from perverts and psychopaths who get off on playing “women.”

You are not a woman just because you think you are a woman, any more than you are a cat just because you think you are a cat.

PoddleOn · 25/02/2024 12:12

Erin394 · 24/02/2024 13:33

Maybe because being trans isn't the reason that a bad person commits a crime, but being denied basic healthcare and wanting to get on with our lives is something that most of us are afforded? Most of us don't need or care for your sympathy.

99% of us just want to get on with our lives, and the fact most people will walk past trans people all the time without realising is testament to that. But the media just can't help but use us as rage bait to get clicks.

I wonder if you hold similar views about inequality in other areas? E.g. if a black person kills somebody, do you think it's right to thrust their ethnicity front and centre?

No. It’s not comparable. A black person is exactly that, a person with black skin. They were born as black people, they have struggled as black people. If a white person were to try and identify as a black person, it would rightly cause outrage.

You can put contact lenses in to change the colour of your eyes, or dye your hair to change the colour of your hair but it’s hasn’t changed the actual eye colour of hair colour, it’s effectively an illusion.

A trans woman is exactly that, a trans woman. And if trans women were only pursuing that narrative, then your so called “cis” women (funny how we aren’t allowed to have an opinion on that labelling isn’t it?!) would by and large be totally supportive of your choices.

But this constant battle that you wage over “we are real women” is obscene and as women who were born as women, have experienced a whole life as women with all that that entails, have struggled as women and suffered as women now being told that we are bigots if we don’t conform to your twisted ideology of what a woman is. You expect our unwavering support?!

A man has committed heinous crimes and is being reported in the press as a woman. It’s insanity. It is the emperors new clothes!

By saying you are a woman because you “feel” like a woman is ridiculous. How can you know how women feel? Are you just relating your life to the gender stereotypes that are apparently so harmful to us all?

You are born as a man or a woman. How you choose to live your life is entirely up to you but you are not and never will be a woman.

Stay out of our sports, our private spaces, our classrooms, our identity. If you really felt like a woman, you’d support real women.

PoddleOn · 25/02/2024 12:23

PoddleOn · 25/02/2024 12:12

No. It’s not comparable. A black person is exactly that, a person with black skin. They were born as black people, they have struggled as black people. If a white person were to try and identify as a black person, it would rightly cause outrage.

You can put contact lenses in to change the colour of your eyes, or dye your hair to change the colour of your hair but it’s hasn’t changed the actual eye colour of hair colour, it’s effectively an illusion.

A trans woman is exactly that, a trans woman. And if trans women were only pursuing that narrative, then your so called “cis” women (funny how we aren’t allowed to have an opinion on that labelling isn’t it?!) would by and large be totally supportive of your choices.

But this constant battle that you wage over “we are real women” is obscene and as women who were born as women, have experienced a whole life as women with all that that entails, have struggled as women and suffered as women now being told that we are bigots if we don’t conform to your twisted ideology of what a woman is. You expect our unwavering support?!

A man has committed heinous crimes and is being reported in the press as a woman. It’s insanity. It is the emperors new clothes!

By saying you are a woman because you “feel” like a woman is ridiculous. How can you know how women feel? Are you just relating your life to the gender stereotypes that are apparently so harmful to us all?

You are born as a man or a woman. How you choose to live your life is entirely up to you but you are not and never will be a woman.

Stay out of our sports, our private spaces, our classrooms, our identity. If you really felt like a woman, you’d support real women.

And as a side note, you keep mentioning HRT…. You do know there is a shortage of HRT and that women who genuinely need it (like myself for example who had to have a total hysterectomy at 32) are sometimes not able too?
Outrageous that’s it’s being given to men.

soupycustard · 25/02/2024 12:57

@PoddleOn
Not to derail the thread, but the menopause issue is a really interesting one when we think about the media. The last few months has seen a sudden (and what I'm sure will be short-lived) interest in the menopause. There has been a lot, in particular, on the BBC, about its effects and the struggles women have had to be listened to about it. Yet whilst that is going on, the media is still pretending that TWAW. The lack of any logic amongst corporations which are surely run by people who are both intelligent and well-educated, makes me suspect that it's not that they lack logic, but that they lack principles and honesty.
At the other end of the biological scale, DD, coming up to GCSEs is having a hard time with periods. She's asked to go on the pill to try to settle them and a surprisingly large number of the girls she knows at school have already done that. Boys have many other issues and problems which I am not in any way minimising (there are some very interesting studies on how the current school and learning system doesn't work for boys) BUT boys don't have to deal with having, say, heavy periods every 21 days.
Anyway, sorry all for the slight derail but all these things are relevant to the bigger picture about why there are clear power imbalances between men and women and therefore why we can't allow sex-based rights for women to be diluted into meaninglessless.

TheKeatingFive · 25/02/2024 13:02

Stay out of our sports, our private spaces, our classrooms, our identity. If you really felt like a woman, you’d support real women.

This is a key point.

If 'transwomen' actually understood what it felt like to be a real women, they'd understand the need for men to keep out of these spaces.