Why is Starmer Standing by Azhar Ali?

[Dogfisher]

AIBU to think that he should be out on his ear for his blatant anti-Semitism? I actually thought that Starmer was dealing with this in the LP - but this seems to suggest otherwise.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/12/labour-criticised-for-backing-rochdale-candidate-after-offensive-israel-remark

@brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Exactly.

The you're cutting your nose off to spite your face.

Some people will find any excuse to carry on voting for a party that consistently hurts the poor and disabled and fucks the country over. Give yourself a pat on the back 🙄

No. I will not vote for an anti-Semitic party and left the LP when Corbyn took over. I have not rejoined yet and am unlikely to in the near future.

And that's apart from the hideous misogyny in the party - a different argument for another day.

Because what he said doesn’t attack Jewish people for being Jewish.

Imo it’s minimising & prejudice.

It was a dumb thing to say but what he said suggests a government / intelligence organisation underperformed.

I wouldn’t say security services underperforming equals “allowing an attack so the gov can do what they want”. To me they are different things…

Even if it is a conspiracy theory it's not antisemitic to be suspicious. In the same way it's not anti American to have suspicions about 9/11 (which plenty of people do).

I don’t remember any MPs saying the American gov allowed the attack in the subsequent months?

I agree with you @Dogfisher, I can’t vote for it either.

Some people will find any excuse to carry on voting for a party that consistently hurts the poor and disabled and fucks the country over. Give yourself a pat on the back 🙄

How strange that you assume my voting intentions. 🙄

Because Labour needs the Muslim vote and don't care about weeding out antisemitism.

There are very good definitions of what antisemitism is. Here’s one: AJC

I cannot see that what this guy said - which I agree was dumb - falls under any of these and for this reason I fail to be able to classify it as antisemitism. I do not think this guys words hold Israel to a different standard as exactly this daft hindsight criticism was also levied towards the USA around 9/11 and MI5 around 7/7.

This does not detract from the awful fact that there are many horrible examples of antisemitism occurring now in connection with the Hamas attacks and subsequent action taken by Israel. And those are absolutely clearly examples of antisemitism and fit perfectly the descriptions provided by AJC.

It's very curious that some posters on this board are more likely to trust the Israeli government's actions than our own MPs.

Let's face it... the attack on Israel HAS allowed them to do what they want.

@roarrfeckingroar true.

@Yorkshirelass04 you do realise some posters on here don't live in the uk? There are several from Israel.

Starmer is a very weak leader. He's standing behind him in this case because of his weakness. His whole approach is not to commit to a position on anything (other than saying he's committed to a position and then going on to reverse it).

He's the reason Labour could still pull off a 1992-style cock-up in the next General Election. The trouble with him is a consequence of his legal background I think, his career was built upon the principle of argument over fact, and that's a trait he carries with him.

His only real argument is "we're not the Tories" which isn't enough for many. Truss wasn't Johnson. Biden isn't Trump, and Trump isn't Biden. Few would argue just because they were different they were/would be a particularly good replacement.

I do not think this guys words hold Israel to a different standard as exactly this daft hindsight criticism was also levied towards the USA around 9/11 and MI5 around 7/7.

which MPs believed the conspiracy theories re the above?

Pretty appalling that people pretend they can’t see the anti-semitism in a conspiracy theory that has blood thirsty Jews secretly collaborating behind the scenes to be able to carry out their twisted, bloodthirsty plans. Especially a conspiracy theory that uses a racist brutal massacre against the Jewish who were its victims, by saying they connived to allow it. Thus upending Jewish victims into Jewish perpetrators.

Anti-semitism is rife and pervasive as these posters show. October 7th shone light on you all.

Why is Starmer standing by him? I hate to say it but maths.

However unpleasant the thought is, and however appalling antisemitism is, that area has more voters of Asian origin than Jews.

The comments won't damage the outcome.

When I heard about this my first thought was he must be sacked, but as others have said, he cant be. Starmer should be publicly condemning what this man has said in the strongest way because it’s plainly nonsense.

However I genuinely do not know why what he said was antisemitic, to me he’s clearly talking about the government, not the people of the country.

There are very good definitions of what antisemitism is. Here’s one: AJC

But the one used in the UK is by the IHRA I believe?

God this thread I’m surprised

Constituency probably op

I agree with you notherday. It's bloody grim.

I’m not pretending!

So with your example if I was to say something awful about the government of Pakistan, that would be Islamophobia?

Starmer is standing behind him because he doesn't really care about anti-semitism in the Labour party - after all, he was right behind Corbyn and wanted him to be leader not so long ago. Also, he knows the party hasn't really changed and there is still a lot of support for those sort of views both within the party and also from some voters.

It's one of two reasons I would never vote Labour - the other being the wholesale destruction of women's rights and safety on the trans altar.

I think it's possible to think it was wrong to say what he said and at the same time not think it's anti semetic/be anti semetic, surely?

I’m a member of the Labour Party and I’m aghast.
I don’t believe a word of his apology, and he needs to go immediately.

Starmer is married to a Jewish woman and kicked Corbyn out of the party as soon as he had the power to do so.