Doctors right to strike, should it be removed?

[DistinguishedSocialCommenator]

Hello
Several people within our families are doctors. Most started out wanting to care for people, but as time goes on, the reality of money, and spending comes into play for some.

PM Rishi Sunak in a tv interview partly balmed doctors strikes for failing to bring down hospital waiting lists. I rarely agree with a politician but in this case, I know he is right. EG, myself, my OH, one of our children and grandchildren have had their appointments cancelled because of strike impacts. Our children and grandchildren do have private healthcare but those do not cover pre-existing or you end up on the NHS with chorionic conditions.

Our police officers and armed forces personnel are not allowed to strike

AIBU to expect a no-strike agreement for doctors and possibly nurses. If agreed, give them 9 months' notice about no-strike agreements. I honestly believe hardly anyone would leave and those leaving would have possibly left the NHS anyway as some do and go to another country just like we get doctors from abroad. Their pay claims could be easily managed in the same way police/armed forces pay rises are managed as well of those MP's.

Failing to bring down hospital w/l lies with the present government and the growing of these waiting lists, the doctor's strikes have certainly made things a lot worse. We are regularly hearing on our news media about growing waiting lists and people waiting for urgent treatments and the waiting times in A&E departments etc

AIBU to feel that doctors should be made to sign a no-strike agreement with a few month's notice to have the no-strike agreement in place before next winter? Also, have a pay body set up like the ones our MP's enjoy.

An Elf at Lapland UK earns £15 an hour. As does a barista at Costa. As does a doctor. Pay what they are worth. Or they will leave.

These people are on a career path to a huge salary. They knew what they were taking on. Cut out all the emotional crap.

Haven’t RTFT, just the first page and am skeptical about OP’s reasons for this thread.

Junior drs salaries are available to view on the BMA and other websites. They show basic pay , weekend allowances and the additional pay for hard to fill training posts. Salary varies greatly because the junior dr title covers such a large range of experience. Basic pay is between 32397 and 63162.

@Peanutsnanna so since people tend to go into a career path knowing what their earnings trajectory is going to be, I can conclude that you think nobody should have the right to strike?

People who went on strike gave us sick leave, paid holiday, legislation on equal pay and pensions. Your thinking takes us back to Victorian times, when employers had all the power and staff had none. Think about that, if you can.

The respected Jeremy Hunt!
yeah you’re definitely on a wind up

@Peanutsnanna 😂😂 6 years ago when the new F1s applied to study medicine they earned 22% more than they do now.

@Sunshine322 so people working 72 hours a week earn more than people earning 40 hours a week. Is this your point ?

A poster asked about junior drs salary so I posted that the information is freely available and the salary range. I didn’t mention hours worked. The figures I quoted are based on a 40 hour working week. I appreciate that you feel very passionate about junior drs pay, with having a junior dr in the family. All I can say is that if your daughter is working 72 hours a week and only getting paid for 40hrs that absolutely needs brought to the attention of her clinical supervisor, her nhs trust and the deanery. Especially with the working time directive.

They never said that.
Importantly, where I worked many wanted overtime to feed their lifestyles of three hols a year, eating out often, doing their homes up, falsh clothing bit the
overtime was not there

In the NHS, many can get overtime if they wanted and in many organsations people want overtime but there is none

Yabvu - they should be allowed to strike. Maybe things should be made better for them so they don't bloody have to in the first place!

Not sure what your point is?

@DistinguishedSocialCommenator @Sunshine322 I never said they are not paid for the extra hours, they are. At £15.33. For saving your 2 year olds life. For sticking a chest drain in at 2am. For ensuring your 90 year old mother is safe and cared for.
You want a doctor ? Then you need to pay them. Because otherwise they will leave.

@DistinguishedSocialCommenator junior doctors are people with families too. And at their wage, they need overtime... to feed their families. Your comparison with people wanting overtime for flash luxuries is just crass.

@Sunshine322 are you not aware that working unpaid hours is the norm in the NHS? Really? If everyone in the NHS worked only their hours, it would die overnight.

@pointythings so true. Unpaid hours can amount to hundreds every year. But all goodwill has now gone.

My union just informed me that my pay is minus > 30% since 2010 as well. So I hope that pay restoration is agreed and applied across the whole of the nhs . I’ll be retiring five years earlier than planned if it is. The private sector should also have to pay those working in care homes and for care agencies better as well, their salaries are criminal.

@Sunshine322 totally agree. The care sector is criminally underpaid.

are you not aware that working unpaid hours is the norm in the NHS? Really? If everyone in the NHS worked only their hours, it would die overnight.

Any hours in excess of 15 minutes over a shift can be claimed as toil in my trust and if not taken within 3 months is paid as overtime. I don’t know about other trusts

Some of the public really think they are entitled to doctors' labour for minimum wage. That they can have a Rolls Royce healthcare service on a Skoda budget. The NHS has a monopoly on labour and low staff salaries already subsidise your free-at-point-of-use healthcare. Trust me in 10 years time if you want to see a GP you'll be paying out of pocket or private insurance. The staff are warning you. Enjoy this while it lasts.

@mumsneedwine my first ‘proper’ job was in a care home and I earned £3.00 an hour😳. I absolutely loved it but left for uni after about a year. Was never going to support a family on that. I don’t think they are in a much better position now tbh, minimum wage mostly.

@Sunshine322 your Trust must be in a healthy financial position and very generous. Mine isn't and can't be. Getting TOIL is difficult and has to be pre-authorised. Everyone I know works over their hours because we don't have enough staff - not clinical, not non-clinical. We do it because if we didn't, patients would not get care.

@pointythings it absolutely isn’t, I think all nhs trusts are in a deficit ( surely they must be). We are rural with rubbish infrastructure etc, so recruitment has always been an issue. They place a heavy focus on retaining the staff they have because recruitment is so challenging.

Remove the right to strike = giving your rights to those in charge who can test you how they like and pay as little as they like.

So you get your appointment next week. But no one wants to be a Dr etc in the future and so no one gets them in 10/20/50 years time.

@mumsneedwine when they work over 40 a week do they get paid for the extra hours ?

I get it now.... The picture you have in your mind of the NHS....

It's because you're jealous isn't it?

You never got the grades because you weren't smart enough, and now you're sitting there thinking 'why can't I be like this lot? A quick jaunt through med school, a flit through training and onto £110k, £250k private practice, a four day week, private jet and guaranteed job security....'