Naming convicted killers - Brianna

[Noangelbuthavingfun]

...Ghey case. In favour of or against as it impacts their rehabilitation? I'm in favour of it - if you've committed a heinous crime you sign away all your rights to be protected in my opinion - what comes your way and being ousted is part of your lot.... I'm not talking about self defence type, rather premeditated and horribly evil crimes. But I think this should be a consistent theme and not just when some judges decide to....at the momentvits not consistent practice.
Aibu to think it's right to name and shame?

Not according to this

https://www.gov.uk/types-of-prison-sentence/sentences-children-young-people

But a whole life order is different from a life sentence, (it's a life tariff with no tariff after which the offender may be eligible for release on license) and I'm not sure what the situation is for under 18s.

Wasn't @Flickersy using "life sentence" to mean a whole life order? Most life sentences aren't actually for life.

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Yes, I assumed the PP I responded to meant a whole life order, which are not given to those under 18.

All life sentences are for life. It may not be served in prison in its entirety though - being out of prison doesn't mean someone isn't still serving a sentence.

I think everyone involved in serious crimes should be named regardless of age. They don't deserve to be anonymous when the victims life is ruined/gone.

All life sentences are for life. It may not be served in prison in its entirety though - being out of prison doesn't mean someone isn't still serving a sentence.

Yes, that's a good point, but I think most people don't see it that way, and would see you being released as the end of the sentence. So when people say "life should mean life", that's what they mean. Life in prison without ever being released.

I Respect your opinion. Mine is to keep them locked up forever. You can't rehabilitate a psycho.

Even when the motivation is to gain fame?

I remember the awful massacre on that Norwegian island and the killer deliberately used the court case (which was televised) to spout his propaganda, he was using the entire legal system to his benefit.

These killers know carrying out the act will allow them to go down in history.

People think killers feel shame for being publicly named, when a lot of them don't feel shame, but fame.

@notthatthis they won't be locked up forever

The boy will be less of an issue than the girl. If he keeps his head down in custody and works with the staff rather than against, then for him at least, I feel there is hope

The girl, less so

There is no way I would be leaving a 15 year old completely to it, with no supervision, restrictions or limits! They are exactly the age at which they need guidance, support and boundaries to enable them to make good choices etc.

It is a gradual process of course, with them needing a degree of privacy. But I won't be absolving myself completely of responsibility while I have any part in paying the bills!

Name them because when they inevitably get out, just like James Bulger's killers did then we all know who they are to avoid them like the plague. If you're capable of this sort of thing at this age then I don't think they're ever safe to be around the general public. You can't rehabilitate these sorts of people and tbh why should we rehabilitate them? You can't take away what they've done. They should lose their lives via prison for their whole life just like Brianna will never have her life back.

I don’t see what is to be gained from naming them. Now they are named their names will be forever linked in the minds of the public with that of Briana. She deserves to be thought about they don’t.

it also has even more of a knock on for any siblings or wider family of theirs. Makes it harder to ever move away from what has happened.

It's good that everyone knows who they are?
If they didn't like it don't do the crime.
Everything that happens it totally of their own doing?

@PastIsAnotherCountry - paranoid schizophrenia is a treatable condition. And thus the culpability of the person involved with that disease is in the eyes of law diminished and they receive a hospital order instead.

Personality disorders are relatively untreatable; you cannot reduce the risk because that is who someone is. Criminally then, these are the killers who are nearly impossible to rehabilitate and end up with whole life orders, people who kill for enjoyment and sexual pleasure. That is people like Ian Brady.

It may also apply to 15 year olds who enjoy inflicting pain and murder. The motivation here seems unclear but this girls enjoyment of what she did is telling.

The theme right through the trial reports seemed to suggest the girl was the dominant player and the boy went along with it. In my opinion at least.
Maybe that's the case with other killer duo's. Brady and Hindley, Thompson and Venables to name two

It seems like the boy was easily led by the girl, he has been diagnosed autistic since the arrest so he would have been easily manipulated
Ive read that they considered adhd for the girl but then changed their mind and said some sort of social disconduct disorder
Is this correct ?

Conduct disorder is a personality disorder. It includes violence and enjoyment of it.

Her defence counsel is not even bothering to contest that. I just hope she gets a very long minimum. No WLO given her age

In three years when she hits 18 they’ll change that to antisocial personality disorder - what used to be called sociopathy.

Their names don't mean a lot unless you know them or their families. I dont think they should be released with new identities. I do not agree with that approach at all.

No. They're in prison. All this does is cause more grief and hurt for the family of the victim, and families of the killers.

''Don't do the crime if you can't do the time''

Oldskool cons used to say that years ago, and it's true.
Pointless bleating once you are caught - Should have thought of that before killing someone.

It is right that they are named.

It was a disgusting murder , really sick and perverted, and Brianna didn't stand a chance.

My sympathy is with Brianna and her family. Not the killers or their relations.

According to the MEN, he is unpopular and ‘arrogant’ in his secure unit. Complained that the fruit isn’t fresh enough. They also write that on the day of the verdict, he went to his room to change into his Christmas jumper to participate in the festivities with the other boys.

His mother has been asked to leave her job. Article doesn’t name her but I can’t imagine there are many ski instructors in Leigh (I live about 7 miles away).

Hypocritical. Either its wrong to harm others/wish harm to others or it's not. No picking and choosing.