Asking employer to cover childcare costs

[Totupthenumberspls]

I’ve been asked to go on a business trip for a week, is it unreasonable to ask the company to pay the incremental childcare costs?

I can’t help but shake my head here. I am evil HR, there for the business (according to mumsnet!) and can’t believe the race to the bottom on this thread. Of course you should ask for work to cover any out of pocket expense. What this thread highlights is that there’s an imbalance here between most posters and their employers, as too many of you are happy to accept working conditions and practices that just aren’t fair or reasonable, and you using equality as a reason for accepting unfair conditions. They are only your employer during working hours. They don’t own you. Be aware of your rights and make sure you get them.

A temporary responsibility payment (as it sounds like OP is getting) is completely reasonable here. 10 days is a very big ask of an employer, whatever is in the contract. They don’t own her. 250 a day barely covers the overtime hours - to cover those hours abroad while not in training- based on a 37k salary at basic rate. It’s not a holiday. Her employer owes her remuneration for her time.

So, by that same logic, if you were here and not in Africa, you wouldn't incur the costs involved in having to pay someone else look after your child. So, for that reason, it should be factored in like any other expenses.

But again, my dog, my cat, my plants, my volunteering - all things that would/could incur costs if I am away, what about the second job I have in the evenings at the local pub, I wont be getting that money either.... and I also make scultures which take 2 nights and I sell each one for £10,000 - so the company needs to pay for 5? of those, £50,000 please (obviously I am being ridiculous with numbers)

Where do we draw a line? Should we pay for childcare - personally I think not. Just because you cannot drop them at a kennel (as a pp said) children is a choice (for the majority of people)

To me it depends on two things: is the travel (even occasional travel) part of the job you signed up for? When you sign up for a 9-5 with children, you don't ask to be paid more than a childless person working those hours, it's your job to factor the childcare in when you decide whether the job pays enough for you to apply. If you apply for a job with travel, then you factor in the overnight care costs when you apply. No need for them to pay you more, you shouldn't have taken the job, if you could afford to get your children cared for while you did it. However, if it is an unknown one off, maybe a sudden conference that you weren't expecting, then I think yes they should pay costs, because you didn't know you would have those costs.

Secondly, is it essential that you go? If it has just been suggested you go, then if you can't or don't want to fund the childcare, work have given you an excellent option of not going! They don't need to fund the childcare because you can take the other option they have given you. If however, there is quite a lot of pressure on you to go, then they need to either make not going a reasonable option, or help remove the barriers to you going.

@Littlegoth I know you are HR but you are also missing the point. If a company want to compensate EVERYONE on the team for their time away that's fine. Because everyone's time outside working hours is valuable. The issue here is the justification of asking for covering for childcare because the father of the kids can't cope. That's ridiculous, sorry. Why would you make an special allowance because this person can't sort this out at home with a partner. And seing this as progressive is to me frankly stupid. We need men to get the finger out and not employers to subsidise their lack of cop on.

As the last poster said, where do you draw the line?

He's expected to because you signed up for it when you took the job.

@girlswillbegirls i would expect to compensate everyone who was going on a 10 day trip. But then I don’t work for a shit company, we look after our employees. It’s not up to an employer to decide who does what in our employees’ homes. If sending them on a work trip is going to cause issues, financial or otherwise, then of course I would plan to mitigate that.

This thread provides an example of why the gender pay gap persists. Women often hesitate to negotiate their salaries-perks and sometimes even react negatively when their colleagues do. However, contracts are not set in stone and can be negotiated with flexibility. Men, on the other hand, tend to ask for what they want without the same internal hesitations that women experience.

I hope that none of the individuals who are opposing our ideas hold management positions. Their advice appears to be motivated by spite and is quite unhelpful.

I agree. I just put the scenario to my partner - his contract requires ‘some’ travel, and he’s had the odd 3/4 night trip. If he was going to be sent abroad for 10 days what additional expenses would we incur as a result and would he ask his employer to cover it - he didn’t even hesitate, of course he would!

I find it at work too. Men are more likely to ask for an increase on salary offer, or pay rise, or challenge appraisal rating. Men are more likely to ask for job title to be amended (Yes really! exchanging ‘senior’ to ‘lead’ for example). Sabbaticals. Compressed hours (women more likely to ask for part time - usually due to childcare whether we like to face up to that or not!), pay rises, responsibility allowances.

I agree with this.

It's the most anti-feminist nonsense I've heard that this woman's employer is going to be asked to cover the cost of her partner not being able to cope. OPs partner sounds like a real catch. To avoid being inconvenienced for ten days because he can't do something the OP does literally every day, she is jeopardising her career further by either not going or by asking her employer for money to cover her partner's entitlement.

You aren't taking into account different types of organisations.
I can assure that there is NO negotiation in relation to my contract, pay or conditions.
Policies around travel and expenses are set centrally and are non negotiable.
They are applied equally across all grades and staff.

I'm willing to put up with these terms and conditions for a whole range of reasons. I'm well paid, I have very generous annual leave and flexibility. I also happen to really enjoy my job.
That doesn't mean I don't know my own value or that I'm a 'reason the gender pay gap exists'.
It means I work in a sector where terms and conditions are fixed.

Actually in the UK before the Tories came to power in the coalition there were a lot of workplace nurseries.

I actually remember working at 2 organisations and bumping into parents dropping off their kids at the workplace nursery.

My own DP's employer had a workplace nursery until about 2010. They then worked out it was cheaper to run the voucher scheme and then pay for some emergency childcare if an employee needed it.

You can ask. I don’t think they would though. If it’s in your contract that occasional travel is required then they have every right to ask you to go on a trip. That being said, I would say to them you can totally make the trip but you can’t sort childcare on this occasion so unless they can help with the cost of wraparound care then you can’t go. And they can’t expect you to if that’s your reasoning. If they push explain that you can’t afford the extra £. You may then be surprised and they could cover it if they really need you to go.

I have to travel occasionally for my job as do many others in my team. My DH works shifts so he’s not home on evenings to look after DS. I have never ever considered getting childcare for those evenings when I’m away as we absolutely couldn’t afford to pay it. So if family can’t help out I have to say I can’t do the trip. There’s been several times we’ve all travelled to meet for away days and team meetings etc which are usually a night or two away from home, and there’s always one or two who haven’t been able to make it because of childcare. It’s just accepted.

No, attitudes like yours ruin it for other women.

This is a broad discussion not company specific.
The OP quite rightly asked and was given what she wanted. Both parties benefitted. This is now a precedent, she can in the future perhaps look forward to travelling without being penalised personally.

OP I’m really glad that you got the expenses and then some paid. My husband had to go on a work trip which clashed with the normality scan for our eldest. When we tried to rebook it, it clashed with the flight home which was worse as he was in the air - facepalm. His company paid for a private scan so he didn’t miss out.
Companies that get the best out of their people and keep the best people value them as PEOPLE not just numbers.
Enjoy the work trip.

This may be true as a general position but it's not true in this specific case. The OP is asking if she can ask her employer to pay for wrap around care whilst she is away with work because another available parent can't be bothered to do it. In the alternative scenario if her partner was away he would not ask for the same support from his employer because he would have the OP doing this for him. The end result is that OP is the one taking the hit on her career and a VERY IMPORTANT MAN is left to pursue his entirely unfettered from childcare responsibilities because his partner does it when she is here and her workplace covers it when she is not. What would actually progress women's rights in this scenario is for OP to tell her husband she's off on a work trip so he needs to cover the drop off and pick up for ten days and for him to tell his own workplace that is what he is doing for ten days whilst his partner is away. End result in this scenario is the OP nurtures her career, her partner gets off his arse and becomes an equal partner in childcare and his employer sees that men are also capable of childcare and that men also need concessions for childcare rather than it just being the sole responsibility of the woman and, by extension, her workplace.

Is your workplace unionised?

One of my brothers' recognises a union so they do all negotiations. Many people like him were very sceptical until the union actually saved all their jobs plus some of their colleagues outside the UK, as they were all going to be moved to a cheaper location abroad.

Dogs, cats, plants, second jobs, voluntary and sporting activities aren't covered by the Equality Act. That's where the line is currently drawn.

Posters are really struggling to understand this

Get a grip. Just don’t go and say you can’t for personal reasons.
Employers arent going to start coughing up for costs related to kids, pets, hobbies, elderly parents etc.

Is your workplace unionised?

Yes. I work at a university.

I should point out that I think my terms and conditions are pretty good - just not negotiable in the way some people seem to be assuming.

I can't simply negotiate a pay rise for example. I'm on a specific pay scale with annual increments. Any movement from that requires me to be able to prove my job role has evolved into something that should be on a higher pay scale.

Still missing the point that a business can be flexible in giving employees perks via personal one-to-one negotiations.
I'm not buying the patriarchal shoehorning in this example.
Sorry.

OP explained several times that her partner can’t do it as they already split the drop offs and pick ups 50/50 but her husband’s job isn’t flexible. She did not say her partner couldn’t be bothered.

When both parents have a job, sometimes that is simply the way of things.

But they did pay for costs related to kids.

The attitude towards parents and children is vile. Children are not remotely akin to pets or hobbies.

Employer, can I have flexibility to leave at a certain time each day to do nursery pick up and avoid wrap around charges?

Sure.

Employer, can I have some extra cash to pay for wrap around to cover the fact that my husband’s employer wont offer the same flexibility on finish time that you kindly do?

Jog on…