Is this child abuse?

[Hah20]

DS who is 2 years old has a habit of trying to scratch DH in the face. In the past DS has got a big reaction from him for doing this. I believe this is why DS repeats the behaviour.
Today this happened and DH pushed DS off him, he fell backwards and was very upset,bumped his head but with no lump. I just want some opinions. Was that just rubbish parenting or is this classed as physical abuse?
I am very much of the gentle parenting approach and am horrified by what happened, but not sure what to do. I told DH in no uncertain terms that what happened wasn't okay and he disappeared in a sulk for the rest of the day.so we are yet to have a proper discussion.

In real life, parents aren't perfect and we learn to respond better over time. This wasn't great but I wouldn't be booting him out over it or anything.

It sounds to me that your DH is quite a disempowered and underconfident parent - doesn't spend time 121 with DC, probably feels a bit bewildered and out of his depth, could do with learning more about child development and discipline through books or training course etc.

But also that your gentle parenting approach is at odds with your DH's instincts, which are to be a bit firmer. You probably need to agree a shared approach so you respond the same way. Right now he's probably being irritated by child, trying to follow what you do but feeling like it's the wrong thing and getting slowly more and more wound up.

Personally I think gentle parenting has its limits and in this situation, I'd firmly be moving child away from me eg setting down on the ground off my lap, or standing up away from them, with no risk to child but making it clear very sharply, possibly with a slightly raised voice, that scratching is unacceptable. If it upset the child a bit, so be it. Parenting that is loving but firm, confident and maintaining self control when DC are testing the boundaries.

I know a few parents who just bleat fecklessly at their DC when they do something completely out of order, like throwing stones, breaking stuff, hitting other kids etc. 'Oh don't do that, it's not nice' - well actually I think they need a much firmer approach than that. You're not their friend, you're the person who needs to make the effort to really ingrain in them that some things shouldn't be done.

If anyone... adult, child, dog, scratched or hit my face I'd instinctively push them away from me. If they fall then I'd be sorry but it would be instinctive and hopefully they would not do it again.

This. Expecting someone to just stand up out of the way rather than deal with the issue is madness IMO.

Why make it an if I hurt someone they run away/stand up game? That's like getting a child to stop running away by running after them a stop means we will play chase and that's really funny seeing mummy run game.
Where are the natural consequences in what your suggesting? Gentle parenting still has consequences

I think without the exact context it's hard to say if it's abusive or not. I think pushing ds away instinctively to stop him scratching and it causing ds to over balance and fall is one thing and not abusive, shoving him hard onto the ground in temper is very different. And from what I've seen in the thread op you're not exactly sure which one was it and can't clarify that for us.

So I think what matters here is probably going to be how your dh reacts when you sit down and talk it through. As will his past history of interactions with your child... is he normally gentle and caring or does he lose temper often?

If you think it's intentional and he has form for bullying behaviours like this then I'd start making steps to leave. Your child deserves to feel safe in his own home.

If this is out of character and you think it's more likely that it was a movement that went wrong than an intentional shove to the ground and your dh shows remorse that it happened then I think it's about reading some parenting books etc together to learn together how to handle challenging behaviours from ds like scratching faces. I would also encourage your dh to be more hands on and spend more quality time with ds, make sure you're doing things as a family for fun and that you both are talking together about what you're finding difficult or what you're finding works well for ds. I think you need to have an honest conversation with your dh about how he finds those to types of conversations as well, and how you can support his parenting without having to go with it in the moment if you disagree with his approach and vice versa if he disagrees with you. Presumably you've learned gentle parenting from somewhere- can you share your learning with him so he has those resources as well?

Do you think your dh us abusive? It seems strange to leap to that conclusion, unless there's other examples, it sou ds like it was accidental , maybe a moment of rubbish parenting (I'm sure most of us have had a moment of rubbish parenting)
My experience of parents that practice "gentle parenting" is usually the parents are overly soft and wishy washy, not addressing inappropriate behaviours , and the children are often displaying rough or inappropriate behaviour, because they don't have boundaries.
I'm not saying this is you , but this is my experience as an early years practitioner and now childminder.
Young children need to know their boundaries.

Yes it’s abuse.

Sorry - but are you saying your husband never looks after his son on his own? Why not?

Your family dynamics seem odd. Different parenting strategies, different approaches to discipline, a seemingly detached father who lashes out and then sulks all day......

What is actually going on here?

Sounds to me like an accident just a startled reaction that was stronger than he meant it to be - unless there is other stuff going on, I think calling it abuse is over the top. Nor is an accident 'rubbish parenting' or a sign of being careless - anyone can accidentally mishandle a scenario like that.

🙄

You also need to discipline your little darling not to scratch people's faces.
But that's okay because you're a 'gentle parent'

Anyone who calls this abuse clearly does not understand what abuse is.

Why does it even matter OP what word you put on it? I don't get what your agenda is here unless you are hoping to accuse DH or child abuse for some reason? If that is the case then there is definitely more to this story.

It sounds a bit rough, but if someone scratches you it is awful and you would push them away, whoever they were, but he should not have used as much force. Gently but firmly grabbing his hand and moving it away from your face might work better. I'm just thinking if someone scratched my face/eyes what reaction I would have. I guess you are trying to stop it happening in the first place, as if he did it to other kids he could injure them quite badly so he really needs to stop. You should make it clear to DH that he was too rough and come up with another plan for next time. Does he do anything to indicate he's about to scratch, do certain things set him off?

Best guess is a nice guy trying to follow his DW’s lead and finding that her ‘gentle parenting’ approach means DS does what he likes with no boundaries allowed to be drawn by his dad, hence the lack of bonding and resentment. IMHO OP needs to learn some distance from her DS before the family is warped permanently.

Why you saying abuse on a normal family situation, 2 year old scratches dad who pushed him away, unfortunately toddler fell. Can't imagine dad did it on purpose as it's a response to something happening. Sounds like 2 year old has scratched before... Yabu. Just can't believe you thinking abuse unless there's a crack story. Is dad dad to the 2 year old

Your DS wants a reaction. DH just needs to calmly and silently walk off and give zero attention for a few minutes

So your DH is the devil incarnate but you prefer to take a 'gentle parenting' about the fact your son keeps trying to claw at his face every five minutes. Why are you not teaching your child that it is never ok to keep scratching people's faces? Can you not see the trouble you are going to have at nursery if you don't stop this? They will be calling you in every day and there will be irate parents gunning for you who's children's faces are being scratched all the time because of your 'gentle parenting'.

Honestly, is this flipping child abuse! I can see nursery being a serious wake up call for you.

No it's not
He didn't meant to harm him

This

Abuse? Really?

Kids can hurt, it's natural to try and push away something that's hurting/going to hurt.

Do you honestly believe he pushed your DS with the intention of him hitting his head?!

not disciplining your child is abuse. It is neglect. Why hasn't your child had consequences for scratching? He needs to know right from wrong, and the window for teaching that is fast closing. If he doesn't learn that now he never will.

My children have tried to hurt me over the years, usually by hitting or kicking when they are angry. I've always either dodged it or held their hands so they can't. I cannot believe anyone would think it's acceptable for an adult to push a two year old.

He is going to have fun at nursery/school. Will be the spoilt kid who has never heard the word no and won’t be having any play dates. . It’s not abuse, it’s human instinct to defend yourself.

Child abuse? No. I would also push a toddler away if they scratched my face. He didn’t mean to push him over (let’s face it, toddlers fall on their backsides about twenty times a day anyway) and all he did was bump his head a bit; it was an accident. Maybe he will learn to stop scratching people’s faces now, so every cloud etc.

You know that if he scratches other kids’ faces like that he could seriously damage someone’s eye, right? He’ll get ‘a big reaction’ from other children too and they’re not going to respond with negotiation and cuddles.

He’s a child, not a feral cat; you can’t patiently coax him into behaving. Your gentle parenting clearly isn’t working and I suspect your DH is at the end of his tether as a result.

You're going to raise a horribly behaved child and destroy your relationship if you continue this dynamic, where it's you and DS Vs horrid, inexperienced (isn't every parent at first?) DH who is "abusive" for misjudging an instinctive reaction to being hurt.

Do you really have to ask if a two year old should be pushed by an adult male?

By all means block a scratch remove child but I could never forgive anyone for laying a hand on my child.