To stop my children seeing their dad on the grounds of neglect.

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I separated from my childrens father 2 years ago after an emotionally abusive relationship for 6 years. I have 2 children ds(7) and dd(5) and they go to their dads every other weekend and the Wednesday overnight on the alternative week. He does not pick them up from school or drop them off as he says he works (so do I) and does not pay any child maintanance (ongoing issue with cms) and will not even provide clothing etc when they are at his.

I am not able to communicate with him about anything because he will shut down any concerns or call me manipulative or abusive. I have tried to keep contact going for the sake of the children, my ds especially struggled with their dad leaving and I think to an extent blamed me (their dad uses very self pitying language around them and is not tactful in the slightest). I have gotten to the point where I am not able to ignore the treatment of them anymore. This last weekend my dd had a headache for the last few days before and had been off school. I sent her over with a high temperature and asked if I could call on the Saturday to check if she was okay. He said at the time but on the day ignored my call which I expected.

when they came back they had been wearing the same clothes all weekend, had not brushed their teeth and dd’s hair was matted, this is not the first time that it’s happened but She was boiling hot and i asked her If she had had calpol which she said she hadn’t over the weekend. Ds said that their dad had been asleep the entire weekend in his bedroom leaving them to their own devices and waking up to give them meals. I texted their dad to say that they need to have their basic needs met if they are to go to his house which he accused me of lying. I’m not sure how to go about fixing this situation as I’m in no two minds that it’s neglect and I don’t feel safe sending them to be perfectly honest. Does anyone have any advice as to how to go about doing it.

Not brushing their teeth ( which btw should be automatic at 7) and mated hair does not make them unsafe.

Talk to social services yourself, or often what is more effective is talk to the safeguarding lead at their school and ask them to make a referral.

Then refuse to give him access and let him
instigate legal action to get it. Put everything in writing.

In itself possibly not (although it is undeniably shit parenting), but coupled with failing to notice a fever, sleeping all day and only waking up to feed them it certainly would constitute neglect.

I would stop sending them OP, if he wants to see them he can get his shit together and take you to court.

@ilovebreadsauce my children will brush their own teeth (with prompting) at my house. My son brings it up off his own back when he’s home and from the way it’s implied he’s told he doesn’t need to/it’s not a problem as he mentions it himself so it’s on his mind

@AlltheFs I’ve had social services ring me around 6 months ago when he split with his girlfriend. She maliciously claimed his house was filthy and he was neglectful. I went and checked his house and it seemed okay but the impression that i get was that she had looked after them up until that point and then made a malicious claim as they had broken up. She claimed he slept all day ect, didn’t clean his house etc. Since he has been on his own the last 6 months is when it has really gone down hill. All of the issues were still there but not to this extent of feeling concerned.

Refer back to SS. Like you say it was probably the girlfriend who sorted stuff

leaving them to their own devices and sleeping all day is neglect.

you could stop them going and let him take the matter to court if he can be bothered

This! Failing to appropriately medicate an unwell child is unacceptable.
Why is he sleeping all day?! What kind of “contact” is that, if he’s not even conscious for it.

I have contacted a mediation service but I can see how social services would be a good option although It worries me mentioning social services but I can’t think of another option. I don’t want to take them away from their dad but it make me so anxious when they go genuinely.

'Neglect' doesn't necessarily mean making children unsafe. Neglect means failing to make sure the child's basic needs are being met.

I would say that hygiene, clean clothes and giving appropriate medicine to a child when they are unwell all count as meeting a child's basic needs. It doesn't matter whether you think brushing teeth should be automatic for a 7-year-old - the parent is still the one with the responsibility for making sure it happens.

I also think it's very concerning the father essentially just left a 7- and 5-year-old, one of whom had a temperature, unsupervised while he stayed in his bedroom, and only came out to give them meals.

Is he depressed, or just a pig? Could you ask him about it, suggest he sees them for a day or afternoon rather than having them stay over? Then if he gets his act together it could be more. I don't know about others, this seems like social services/courts etc would view it in a better light than you just cutting things off.

Why should it be automatic at 7? If I didn’t prompt my 7yo to brush his teeth, he wouldn’t. And if the op decided she was never going to brush her children’s teeth and hair then the school would be referring her to social services. Never mind the lack of care and medication when his child was sick. She could have got so much worse and he wouldn’t have even known. Of course it’s fucking neglect

How was this your first response 😑

@NoCloudsAllowed hes always hidden behind the screen of being depressed the entire time I’ve known him which is why I tolerated so much nasty behaviour in the first place but it’s plain old selfish narcissism im afraid. If you had a conversation with him then. He’ll tell you 100 reasons why he’s the victim but all he really cares about is himself

It is neglectful and a safeguarding issue. I would talk to the safe guarding lead at school.

In the interim, can you just not send them? Or shorter daytime visits?

I wouldn't send them he's neglecting them

Stop the visits and let him take you to court

I’d start taking pictures of before and after so you have evidence and keep a log.

raise it with him then raise with social services or reduce contact.

Maybe it wasn’t malicious as he is exhibiting those behaviours now.

@beAsensible1 no, I’m sure that there was truth to it but the timing was malicious as they had just broken up. That’s the reason that I went to check the property. I’ve always been under the illusion that he is lazy and does not do much/anything with them so I don’t doubt that it’s true.

I’m worried how to broach the situation. I have a lot of trauma towards him from years of manipulative and abusive behaviour. Lots of gaslighting and punishments when speaking ‘out of line’ I want the smallest amount of communication with the least potential to kick off as possible. I know I’m asking for a lot but I’m just trying to gather my bearings because I find confronting him a very difficult thing to do.

Is this arrangement through the courts? If not, I would stop sending them and tell him why. Let him take you to court if he wants to see them. Also report to SS for backup.

Is the current contact arrangements court ordered?

I feel for you OP, these things are really difficult to handle when you have that fear response ingrained into you. Still, you must be brave for your babes. You can do this.

Send a short message saying you have concerns for their well-being and will stop access until it is formally addressed in the courts. Then mute him (and don't answer his phone calls) for a few weeks. Be prepared to call the police if he comes to your house, and let school know a broad outline of the situation.

I'm betting you'll never hear from a lawyer.

Just tell the dc the truth. Df isn't well enough to look after them at the moment... Imagine the risks of mishaps him sleeping and leaving them unsupervised..

I wouldn't send them either, what an awful way to spend their weekend. Your poor daughter feeling Ill all weekend, how sad.