To think karma doesn’t exist?

[Fuckfucketyfuckfuckfuck]

I went through an utterly horrific experience a few years ago. Someone who I trusted and considered a friend was the cause of this. I don’t want to provide the exact scenario as this could be outing but she betrayed me in a horrific way when I was at a very vulnerable point in my life and it blew my life apart. Although I have rebuilded my life, I still think about what happened all the time and obviously I still feel a lot of hurt and anger because of what happened. I still to this day feel Kirby to but red hot visceral hatred towards her. I’m not by nature a person who holds grudges, I have always been quick to forgive and don’t like conflict but what she did was unforgivable. Not once has she reached out to me, to try and explain, apologize or try to make amends. That’s fine as it’s obviously just indicative of the type of person she is but what really sticks in my throat is the fact that it seems her life has gone from strength to strength ever since. New (better) job, new partner, new home, new baby. We live in a small community so all of this stuff gets back to me whether I like it or not. Moving away is unfortunately not an option for us, certainly at the moment. I feel like she’s treated me like garbage and been rewarded for it by karma rather than punished. AIBU to think karma is just a made up concept that people tell themselves to feel better about someone who has treated them badly? That actually, it doesn’t exist, and people like this actually just get to live a normal happy life despite their actions?

You need to learn what karma actually is before dismissing other peoples religious beliefs as nonsense just because you haven’t managed to get your own back on a friend.

That doesn’t really take into account the other person’s perception of a situation, or personal moral compass/conscience. Some people live very happily, and sleep well, having done something you couldn’t live with. That you couldn’t conceive of being happy in the same situation, doesn’t mean that someone else isn’t absolutely fine.

@Mairzydotes of course I’ve considered that. Of course I’ve done things in my life that I regret and I’m not proud of, mainly in my younger years. Haven’t we all? I’ve definitely considered if karma is paying me a visit. I’ve had a lot happen to me over the years that I’ve wondered if it was a result of my own past wrongdoing. Deaths of close family members and friends, chronic illness at an early age, my children born with certain difficulties. But despite it all, I don’t think I’m a bad person and I don’t think any of my past misdemeanors would make anyone think I deserved what happened to me. As I’ve gotten older, I try very hard to treat people with kindness and respect, and wouldn’t dream of doing the kind of things that were done to me, to anyone. Well, perhaps with one exception now.

Then don't turn yourself into a victim at the ex-friend's expense. You can't change what they chose to do back then but you can separate yourself from their action so you don't become a prisoner in your own head, hoping that karma will do your bidding.

I don't think there are many people who haven't felt let down and betrayed by someone. I certainly have. Being successful as the best revenge takes a lot of time and strength to pull off but it's worth it if you can do it!

@TinyYellow I’m not dismissing anyone’s beliefs, I’m just questioning my own. Happy for people to have different opinions and perspectives to me, makes life more interesting. So no need to get worked up.

I have had experience of a (professional) situation where one person felt terribly, personally betrayed by my actions, and another thought I was very brave and standing up for myself admirably. I only found both of these things out after the event and never even considered either when I was making my decision. It felt like a fairly neutral, professional thing to do (and was, really!). What I’m trying to say is, this idea of “how can they live with themselves” is so flawed - the person you believe has acted in an abhorrent way probably never thinks about it again. And likewise you might have really screwed someone over without knowing it (took the last car park space so they missed a hospital appointment for example).

Just bide your time. I know someone who has lied, cheated and stitched people up. Slowly, slowly things are unravelling. Be patient. Just sit back and wait x

To be clear, what she did wasn’t something that is open to interpretation or circumstances. I think 99.9% of the population would consider it abhorrent. There were no shades of grey to what happened.

It doesn't exist as most people think of it. Life is unfair.

But the concept of karma isn't that life is fair. It's that your actions now shape your future. Not that you can 100% control everything, but that you can make choices that will have outcomes. Treat everyone like dirt and you'll have no friends when you need them. Put the time and effort into that project and you'll get results. That sort of thing.

And the one I will probably never be able to do: forgive or let go of anger and that person will no longer be able to have the same kind of influence over you (not saying there are no consequences but you can take back a lot of power). It's very hard so don't ask me how to do it, but I see how it works. You will no longer be poisoned and consumed by it.

I think it also helps to see "rewards" as connected to the actions that brought them. So yes, a shit person may have a great career, but a career isn't a reward for kindness; it's a reward for working towards your career.

Well either way dwelling on the other persons perception and life is going to get you nowhere. It will achieve nothing but to propel your anger. The only way to find peace is to accept what’s happened, come to terms with it and mive on, focussing in yourself and living aswell as you can.
My post was to point out you don’t definitely know that the person is happy- we can never know- but generally speaking a person doesnt purposefully harm another whilst happy and content. OP said this person knew they were causing harm.

@AtomicBlondeRose you've described it very adeptly from the perspective of the person "doing the betraying" and your account of the rationale and circumstances that governed your behaviour and decisions is what the OP @Fuckfucketyfuckfuckfuck isn't sighted on in their scenario of the ex friend which includes the ex friend suffering from low self esteem, their own demons, paying the OP back for a different perceived wrong, a million and one reasons.

They are only able to see it from their perspective and probably won't be able to accept there are other perspectives, good bad or otherwise - although counselling can help unlock it if it's important enough.

Sadly, I agree @Fuckfucketyfuckfuckfuck (great name, btw).

Life IS unfair, as your Mum probably told you when you were three and the sooner you except that the happier you are.

All I can suggest is when your thoughts turn to how shamefully she treated you wrench them away and start singing the silliest song you know.

All ways look on the briiiiight siiiiide of life...

Karma does not exist. There is no order or meaning in life other than that which we create for ourselves.

If you possibly can, try to forget. Not to release her, but to free yourself.

I'm a firm believer in karma, and see it played out time and time again. Sometimes it can take years though. As the saying goes, "The wheels of justice turn so slowly, but they can grind so fine."

My favourite case was my boss in my first professional job. She bullied me awfully, was a horrible human, and in the end, I left. 18 months later, she was "escorted off the premises" for "financial irregularities". And as far as my extensive digging can unearth, she's never worked in the sector again. Boo hoo eh?

If that is the case - I would honestly say, for your own mental health and happiness - do everything in your power to move out of the area.
You hate the person - you don’t need to hear or see what they are up to.

Move on completely - once you have completely & fully done that - then in my opinion, if you hear news about her - good or bad, you’ll be so detached from her & the situation, you genuinely won’t even care.

That sounds like a pretty natural consequence for fiddling the accounts. It wasn't because she bullied you.

According to my teacher, karmic results can take a long time to come, because karma deals not just with this lifetime but many ones previous, plus impacting the future ones. The person who wounded you and yet seems to be doing well in her life may be reaping rewards from good actions done in previous lives. At some point, the negative consequences of her bad actions will certainly bear fruit. The more ego a person has, the longer the results, either good or bad, take to come.
With all this in mind, please try to forgive - you don't want to be reaping the consequences of anger and resentment towards her...

I don't believe in Karma, but I do believe that people who are unkind to others are not happy people. Happy people don't need or want to hurt others. So I believe this woman's life will almost certainly not be as "happy" as it looks from the outside. Try to focus on your family. Take time for you. Exercise is a great healer. Start with daily walks if you don't do that already. You have obviously pulled yourself out of a hard situation so feel proud of yourself for that. 💐

Karma does not exist unfortunately, at least not in the MN “karma will get them way”. Good things can happen to shitty people just the same way shit can happen to good people.
Spending your life holding onto hate and believing that something bad will come to them anytime now if you just wait long enough only stops you moving on from the hurt. Your happiness shouldn’t be linked to their unhappiness. It gives them too much power over your future.
All you can do in life is focus on you and yours and make the best of whatever hand life deals you.

Karma doesn't exist just like heaven doesn't exist - these are stories we tell ourselves to make us feel better about things.

I don’t think I really believe in Karma. Everyone experiences good and tough times throughout their lifetime.

Who knows what really goes on in your friend’s head, now or in the future? But she has to live with what she did. She may not give it a thought now but she may reflect and regret what she did someday. You will likely never know.

Of course it doesn’t exist but people say it or want to believe in it to self soothe.

You need to forgive her to free yourself. Read The Twins of Auschwitz, a story of forgiveness, not forgetting, but forgiving. Without forgiveness you retain the bitterness and it harms you, not her.

I think the way the term has been adopted in the West bears very little relation to it's actual meaning.

I don't believe in Karma, just natural consequences. If you go through life being an arsehole eventually you will come up against a bigger bully or someone who is a position to sack you/dump you/bop you on the nose (not condoning violence). I get angry and then let it go (not always easy and sometimes have to work on it) I don't wish bad on anyone, but I do hope that maybe my childhood bully might wonder how it would feel if her kids were to be on the receiving end of the sort of treatment she dished out (though I hope they are not)..

I live my life so I can sleep at night (menopausal insomnia not withstanding). I want to live with my conscience.. other people's abililty to sleep peacefully is not my problem.