To think there shouldn't be measles outbreaks?

[fatandhappy47]

Surely we shouldn't be having an issue with measles?
Had an email from school (secondary) 'reminding' us to keep kids off with measles, which got me thinking

All my kids band my friends kids of the same age had their MMR (however my youngest did get measles before this)

So why is it an issue in secondary schools of all places? Are people just not vaccinating their kids?

It's true anywhere.
People who aren't qualified to give medical advice shouldn't.
Many folk have no idea what reliable sources even look like.

I'd be 100% in favour of this. In fact I'd treat failure to get your child vaccinated on schedule as an offence in the same way as we treat it when kids aren't sent to school. If parents demonstrate they're not capable of taking responsible decisions for their kids then those decisions should be taken away from them in the child's interest (and everyone else's).

(and no, obviously not where there are genuine reasons where a vaccine can't be given before someone jumps on me with their specific circumstances).

It is legal not to send your children to school. Home education is legal in the UK.

I am militantly pro vaccine but it is not the same thing.

Clearly a lot of people not taking up the vaccine, which then leads to a failing in herd immunity which would help protect those who haven’t had it, it’s also very likely that some of those now getting measles will have been vaccinated as it doesn’t guarantee not getting it, although should be milder and less contagious

A pp said “measles is very rarely a matter of life of life and death”. For babies who are too young for the vaccine yes it can be, and it can also result in damaged hearing and eyesight. It is a nasty disease. Why on earth would a loving parent put their own child at risk of it when it can be easily prevented.

A relative of mine is a consultant paediatrician. They will be the one looking after babies with measles. Their view of anti vaxxers is unprintable here.

The MMR should be mandatory. You can’t argue with stupid so make it illegal to make stupid decisions instead.

No they didn't. I was a child in the 50s and measles was feared. Parents wouldn't allow their children out to play if there was a case of measles locally. Unfortunately I caught it from a neighbour before her symptoms showed. I can remember how ill I was. I've never felt so bad since. I was only about six, but it's etched on my mind.

The chicken pox parties are a bit of a myth as they certainly wasn't a thing during my childhood and definitely not when my DC were small.

@Dibbydoos, Wakefield and the journalists should be locked up. Personally, I do not blame parents for being unsure with all the lies floating around.
The ones actively propagating it are another matter.

@Wetweatherandmud - not true. I grew up in the 60s & measles was always feared.

I’m 75 and didn’t get any childhood diseases, no mumps, measles, chicken pox, rubella, scarlet fever and no vaccinations either.
Obviously I had no antibodies to pass onto any children I had and after my first dd was born I had blood tests which confirmed this. The doctor was quite concerned and gave me the rubella vaccine before we left the hospital. He said it was to protect both me and any pregnant women I came into contact with should I contract rubella.
I left school in 1964 aged 16, I stayed on an extra year to do GCE’s and I do remember getting the polio vaccine on a sugar lump and the BCG vaccine at school.

@StuntNun

The original Andrew Wakefield paper that started it all never even suggested that the MMR caused autism. The paper only said that the measles virus was found in the gut of twelve autistic children who had bowel disease. All the fuss came from interviews and the media. The link has been completely disproven by studies involving huge numbers of children.

This was the first thing I noticed back in the 90s when I read that case-study.

Wakefield never put me off the MMR but the absolute hysteria and witch-hunt that followed its publication made me deeply wary of institutions that I had previously had a lot of faith in.

Poor understanding of risk is relatively common and not necessarily an indication that someone is thick. But combined with distrust of authorities it’s pernicious.

My proposed solution is to give all parents a short statistics test. If they pass, they’re allowed to make their own decisions about vaccinations. If they fail, their kids get vaccinated (assuming no contraindications).

I know this would never work in the real world. It’s just my personal fantasy that I invoke when I think of all those unfortunate children who are suffering with measles right now because of their parents’ poor decisions.

I guarantee I would fail that test. But I do vaccinate my DC!

Were you not vaccinated for diphtheria, whooping cough, tetanus? Or do you mean specifically the ones you mentioned?

I said it was feared in the 50s. Should I have added that it was feared in the 60s as well? Read my post again.

Wakefield didn’t say it in the original paper. In fact the paper initially attracted very little attention. He did call a press conference in which he very clearly did say it which is what started the hysteria.

The media and everyone else really should have just ignored him and just left him to be quietly struck off once it emerged that the info in the paper had been falsified.

But genuinely why would you take the risk.

Really? Where is your evidence for this? Most countries have MMR as part of the immunisation programme, not just the UK...

I only had the first measles jab and never the booster as I was allergic to eggs as a child (I’m immune to rubella following the jab at 13). The news recently has made me think that I need to talk to the doctor about having the MMR…

She's asking if her daughter will be protected against measles if she comes into contact with another child with measles at nursery. As it clearly says in her post.

@RedRobyn2021 your daughter could catch it, but she'll be less likely to. And if she does, the illness should be a lot more mild than it would had she not been vaccinated.

No vaccine is 100% side effect free, as with all medications. Even OTC medication like paracetamol, ibuprofen etc there are some people who can’t have them and some people who have a negative reaction.

What I don’t understand is why antivaxxers prefer to believe charlatans with no scientific background rather than people who have spent years studying the science behind vaccinations and diseases. They also seem to lack understanding of statistics – risk vs benefit. The benefits of being vaccinated vs the risks of catching the disease and either dying or suffering from long term side effects or the risk of side effects from the vaccine.

@Notanotherbloodynamechange1 even if your claims that vaccines have killed multiple members of your family are true, surely you must realise that those of us who can have vaccinations safely are creating the herd immunity to protect those who can’t have vaccinations? Your stance should really be that you are anti vaccination FOR YOUR FAMILY rather than no-one should vaccinate.

You must have the critical thinking skills to understand that, don’t you?

I also agree that most parents today simply don’t know how awful these diseases were because they have never come across them. Smallpox has been eradicated worldwide as a result of an intensive vaccination programme; we don’t see children in leg irons (known as callipers back then) as a result of polio (not an uncommon sight when I was a child). I pre-date the measles and MMR vaccines and had measles when I was 6, and remember lying in a darkened room to protect my eyes. I have had hearing and sight problems ever since.

I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you are genuinely misled in stating this falsehood and not deliberately stating a wicked lie.

Certainly throughout the 20th century, measles was feared. The journalist John Humphrys spoke last year about his father being blinded by measles. He had the disease during a snowfall and his mother had strictly forbidden him to go outside as even then in the 1910s it was known that exposure to bright light, such as winter sun reflecting on white snow, could cause terrible damage. He went outside and was blinded.

The opening premise of Tom’s Midnight Garden (1958) is that Tom’s brother has measles and Tom has to be sent away for his own protection. He is quarantined in case he is incubating the virus and already infectious - which is why he can only go out at night.

Your claims are flatly wrong and very dangerous.

We have a significant outbreak round us. The problem is apparently the lack of vaccination in certain cultures.

its time that making kids be vaccinated against these types
of diseases (ones with decades of research behind the vaccines) compulsory for starting school ( or childcare) unless there are certified medical reasons not to for an individual.

We also have older members of our family who are completely deaf following measles as a child. I hadn't realised how common it was! Absolutely life changing and heart breaking for all involved and they were told they were lucky they hadn't died.

I have a 'hippy' type friend who loves crystals/ yoga/ spiritual things who is proud of his anti vac stance for his kid, like he was keeping his kids body pure in some way. I fail to see what's so 'healthy and natural' about letting your kid fight off a deadly illness and probably lose their hearing for life to boot. I've had to distance myself because it makes me feel so frustrated.