Another one about a family member gifting money

[bananasaredelicious]

(namechanged for this)

Sorry to have another thread about this and 'fairness'.

I handle all the financial affairs for my Dad since my lovely Mum passed away a few years ago.

He has, today, asked me to transfer £5,000 to each of my nephew's junior ISA accounts (his grandsons). He hasn't said anything about my daughters (his other 2 grandchildren), who are both over 18. (Nephews are both under 10).

I know that over the years, he has spent more money on my girls as they are older and so have had more birthdays etc etc, but it is quite hurtful that he is asking me to do this transfer. It isn't a question of affording it, as he could afford it.

I know I shouldn't let money come between us, but I am quite upset about this especially as I am very close to him and help him with general day to day life on a daily basis.

How do I just let this go and try to ignore it? I know it is his money to spend as he wishes, but he always makes a big deal about how he is always fair and does for one what he does for the other.

I have always felt that my sibling is the favourite, and this makes me feel even more passed over :(

The assumption is that the father is counting this money as playing balance to that money. I am suggesting that by approaching the conversation with I think I know what your thoughts were but can you confirm this is a less confrontation way into the conversation and if it is confirmed that this is why there is money going to nephews and not the daughters it can be flagged that that money was balanced with money to the brother

There was nothing nasty in that post.

Is it possible he has done something similar for your own children in some other account but that you just don't know? Maybe he didn't want them to have automatic access to it at 18?

Oh just seen this. Which I think changes things a little? Your girls were gifted... as was your brother. So it seems fair the grandsons are gifted too. It's you who has been left out of the equation in that sense...

He has treated his grandchildren equally (or possibly given your kids more going by what you've just said). You cannot claim that the money given to your brother is money given to your nephews. You have zero control over what happens to that money - your brother could lose his job, get ill, blow the lot on a horse, leave it all to charity. That is not your nephews money unless their dad gives it to them.

I'm annoyed with my parents for the amount of money they have thrown at one of my brothers (£200k+). However it never occurred to me to see that as then benefiting my nieces over my kids and my other brother's kids. I am pissed off because it's unfair to me!

I agree with pps that in his head he remembers giving your DDs generous amounts in the past and so his is trying to even it up a bit for his grandsons (who didn't exist at the time of the earlier gifts). The trouble is that he has forgotten that he also gave your brother a large money gift at the same time!

You don't say how much your DDs received back then, but I am guessing a larger amount than this £5k he now wants to give to each of your DNs (as you mention that due to that money you don't have to worry about helping your DDs with house deposits). Is that correct?

So he probably thinks your family has benefitted more, I bet anything that he's forgotten about the large amount given to your brother back then. So I don't think he's being malicious or trying to play favourites? (hopefully).

It's a tricky one though, as it is not fair and also you're more in need than your DB. If DB had anything about him, he'd tell your dad to even things up. You could just set down for him calmly the facts of what happened back then, but it's a delicate situation. Maybe pull back a little with the help you give if you are feeling underappreciated?

I get what you mean, OP. I manage my mum’s financial affairs and she regularly gifts money to my feckless siblings and their spouses. As well as cash gifts for grandchildren birthdays and milestones which is of course fine.

To be fair she has sometimes offered me the same but I’ve always turned her down. I think there’s something grubby about grown adults taking handouts from a parent, from money that comes from her pension.

I feel you should ask him and have a brief but clear discussion about this. I really don’t see why raising it makes you ‘grabby’. Why not clarify the issue?
However I’m a bit surprised you are getting so resentful about £5000 x2 being given to the nephews, if your daughters have had enough money to fund house deposits?

You made a choice to pass over the money to your girls, which is great, but has slightly backfired. You must of been in a reasonably comfortable position to do this?
Sounds like your dad feels a bit sorry for his grandsons. Your girls have a substantial amount of money to help with buying a property or whatever. Now your dad wants to give a little towards the boys to help with the future- I’m guessing it’s no where near the amount your girls have?
It’s all a bit of a mess, and he probably feels a bit torn on what to do- he owes your daughters nothing. But he possibly owes you something, especially if you are helping out as well.
I think money should always be split equally between children- unless there’s exceptional circumstances.
At least try to look at the positives, your girls have a nice inheritance to help them start out, while still enjoying their family. Your brothers kids won’t see that kind of money until their parents die.

Your clearly nor that close if you didnt just respond with 'seriously, is this for all the grandchildren or just xxxx's kids' or 'it might look unfair if the girls find out'

@Muchof

Really? An unknown on the internet deciding that the op is jealous and petty isn't nasty?

Ok then .....

Perhaps that's instead of inheritance, or they're not getting left as much as your daughters..

My (then) DH was upset that the money was going to our children, not to us, yet to my DB, (he didn't have children). My Dad offered to change it, and give it to us not our girls, but we decided to leave as is.

Your poor pops. His generosity really has bitten him in the arse over the years and continues to do so on the basis of this thread.

Too true. Poor bloke with everyone deciding who he should give his money to. At least OP can be happy her ex didn't get half the money so that's a blessing.

yes but even the fact that her ex had a problem with it and she actually went and expressed this to her father and then the poor guy even agreed to change his plan for them. had anyone told me to say this to my father, i would have told them to fuck off and no way was i going to stress him out like this.

I really feel for these aging people that struggle to manage their finances due to the modern age and therefore reliant on others.

You can give away much more than £3k per year providing that it is from income and not capital. OP, check this out with an IFA.

A useful correction from Malbecfan to the misinformation regarding the £3k a year.
As well as the evidence that it is out of income and does not prejudice your normal outgoings and lifestyle, it has to be regular. A letter to the recipient when you start giving the money should satisfy the taxman. But, yes, get your arrangement checked out with an IFA.

It sounds like all of his grandchildren have received generous financial gifts, albeit at different times. So that’s fair.

however only one of his children has received a financial gift so that’s less fair (on you). But as your brother received his gift many years ago I think it might be petty of you to bring it up now.

This sounds perfect. You are not being rude or demanding but simply clarifying his wishes, which is a good thing where money is concerned as you don’t want mistakes to happen.
Then let him explain, I would be upset in your position. Might make him think.

You can give away as much as you like.

if it’s “out of income” then it isn’t liable for IHT, unless it’s significantly impacted standard of living.

you can give away as much capital as you want, but it will be liable for IHT if you don’t survive 7 years.

my house is worth 800k. I plan to downsize/relocate when the children are grown, to somewhere that will take me below the iht level. I will give a lump sum to each child. As long as I survive 7 years from the gift it will not be included in by estate for iht purposes.

as I will be not quite 60 I will not be needing, or planning to need care. So it won’t be deprivation of assets as I am not giving away my money to afford care fees.

The £3k per year applies to inheritance tax but not deprivation of assets. DOA would only be an issues if he needs care and doesn't have enough assets left to pay for it.

Can you say to him that anything financial you want clearly in writing so there is no ambiguity should you ever be questioned by anyone regarding his finances.
Putting requests in writing may make it clearer to him regarding who he is giving what. Also protects you if DB queries anything later on as he is obviously not involved on a daily basis.
Sorry DB seems to be the golden child. It's hard being the scapegoat.

The people who are saying you’re obviously envious and bitter and the wrong person to handle your dad’s affairs are giving off massive “favourite/golden child” energy.

Honestly, I’d be so disappointed and would be asking my dad why. It’s not your daughters’ faults they were born first. You’re well within your right to be angry and please ignore anyone who says you are being unreasonable

Surely he will have to respond to you if you ask him “ before I do these transactions, can you just confirm…”. otherwise you will just be left hanging and no money will be transferred.

I would be annoyed 5000 isn’t pocket money and tbh at 18 they can just set up an ISA I would have to say something

I think you should say something to him. And let your brother do more , it sounds as if you are being taken for granted.