People ending their lives?

[girlfriend44]

Are more and more people giving up on life? Heard another suicide today and its going to be debated in Parliament tomorrow?

Is it because mental health services are poor, have they always been poor?
Is life just getting harder for people?
Or has it always been hard?

I can remember when suicide was rare now you hear it so much sadly.

I think it depends on the motivation behind the attempt, somewhat. There can be an element of "fuck you" or a strange sort of showmanship (for want of a better word) occasionally - look at the case in the news recently where someone was charged for trying to poison themselves in the middle of the jobcentre, or when people have set themselves on fire in public places to cause distress or make a point.

Those cases would definitely have affected all involved in a very negative way, and risked severely injuring other members of the public, and I don't think it's wrong to condemn that when there were other options available. There's a difference between opportunistic suicide and one with a lengthy planning process, IMO.

I'm so sorry. The day my mother died, she was supposed to have an appt with her mental health case worker person, who called her and said she had overrun on her appointments but she would call in on my mum at home after work. She never came, or called to say she wasn't coming. It was picked up in the serious case review. I try so hard not to hold anger and to accept my mother's decision to end her life; but there were moments I felt such incredulous fury that a professional would let her down so badly when she was so vulnerable. She also messaged a friend of hers on FB while she was doing it and told him so. He saw the message, but he didn't reply to her, or alert me or police or anyone. As I say I try not to hold anger. But I will die hating him for that. It was all I could do not to spit in his face at her funeral.

Second this. I had amazing support from my friends but talking to someone who really understood what I was feeling, just talking to them and having them hear and KNOW what I meant, instead of just guessing, was hugely important to me. I will always remember that conversation with a man whose name I don't even remember, who had lost his son. Such compassion and empathy.

Why would they need to put a warning when it’s obvious what the subject is? If you find discussions about people ending their lives too upsetting to read why would you click on a thread with the title ‘people ending their lives’?

Agree with this too. My mother had chronic depression all her life from a child. But in her final crisis, all they wanted to focus on was her drinking. She did drink too much, no question. But she was drinking because she was hideously unhappy and couldn't sleep and it took some of that pain away, for a while. The focus should never have been on fingerwagging at her for her units, but on supporting her to get mentally well so she didn't have to drink so much. It just made her angry and dismissive.

I'm so sorry for your loss. I don't know if it will help with any kind of acceptance/closure about these snubs for your mum, but I find people with their own issues sometimes need to cut people off who are needing help themselves, like her Facebook friend. I had a male colleague who bombarded me with messages of suicidal thoughts, but it never seemed to come to anything, so I stopped responding for my own sanity as it was making me ill. Every time I tried to get help, it didn't seem to make them any better and sometimes made things worse.

While MH workers can come across as uncaring, I think you must need a thick skin and a very hardened attitude to do that kind of job long-term. I know very caring people who went into MH and social care but couldn't cut it due to the overwork, the stress, their concern and worry for the people they were working with. People still need to be able to turn off at the end of their working day - I couldn't do that job.

It wasn't spoken about. Even 18 years ago after the suicide of my friend's mother it was all a bit hush hush.

You also hear of it more now because of media - both social and other types.

Given your situation I think it would be fine to insist on night shifts.

You can dial into the odd meeting or read the notes.

Can you really explore that idea or a possible new job that can offer you what you need? Your needs have to come first, and foremost. I am sure if they knew your reasons they would have a change of heart.

I remember reading 'The Hours' and feeling the deep comfort of the words 'it is possible to die', and that knowledge giving the character the strength to go on another day. Perhaps if there was a legitimate route people would be less desperate.

Suicide is a tragedy, but it also used to be a taboo topic. It’s more openly spoken about now.

This is my plan too.

It's a good time to look for remote jobs for US companies I guess, they would be working overnight our time. I've just taken medical redundancy but looking to get back to work as soon as I'm recovered from one of my other conditions. The employment market sucks at the moment though in my industry.

One of the biggest things that would make a difference for me would be some political stability in the UK, and the financial markets becoming less volatile, but that's not going to happen in an election year. Nothing has felt reliable, safe, or stable for many years now and it's exhausting trying to think about the future & plan for our basic needs to be covered long-term. Not sure if everyone else is feeling the same way?

I felt the same reading that novel. I return to it once in a while.

Saying I find elements of some suicides 'almost unforgivable' is something you find disgusting?
I'm talking about a person who, after months of planning, jumped from a motorway bridge into rush hour traffic. On to the cars of innocent people. Children. And you talk about how they aren't considered because 'they didn't give a shit about the victim'
I'm allowed to find that part of their death almost unforgivable. It actually takes a lot of effort to try and forgive.
For the people left behind, we are allowed to use any words we want to, to describe how it feels. We can say it was selfish, reckless and unforgivable if we want. The people who ended their lives, causing devastation, don't care what language we use about their final act and dont get a say in it. They are gone.
It's mentally unhealthy for the people left behind to be forced to bury those feelings. The taboo of suicide is their burden to live with already. They don't get to grieve in the same way. They have already been mentally damaged forever because of how their loved one died. They are still living and dealing with the devastation. The living are the priority now.
And I would say to anybody considering suicide that endangering innocent people is selfish. Whatever they are going through, know that potentially killing or harming others is a reckless and selfish act. And do they want their final act on this earth to be killing an innocent adult or child? That should never be a taboo thing to say.

I’ve never heard of that book, but will definitely look it up.

A couple of years ago, I obtained ‘the means’ I needed to end my life in a painless manner. It was so comforting to know I didn’t have to worry or stress about my method anymore. I’d go as far as saying, just having the option of a peaceful escape at a time of my choosing, has reduced my suicidal ideation far more than the years of therapy and medication I’ve tried.

So yes, knowing it’s possible to die helps.

The author is Michael Cunningham, as I recall.

How old are you YouJustDoYou? I'm 75 and have no reason to want to end life for a long time!

Brilliant post Fionaville.
I agree with everything you said.

Oh, @herewegoroundthebastardbush, that's heartbreaking. I'm sorry both of you had to go through such pain. 💜

Like @TM1979 I've grown up with a very selfish brother. It was never his fault as a toddler, always some reason why or how he ended up with the 'best' as a child.
As a teen he went for freedom, alcohol and drugs.
He's nearly 50, still an alcoholic. I never hear from him unless he's suicidal. He's had money, supportive partners, everything but still ends up obsessed with himself to the exclusion of all others.
After his recent events my mum is on eggshells, it's really not fair on her, his friends or his ex partner.
I currently feel quite numb, flat, almost disinterested about it all.

Im so sorry.

I think some people think that if you say you're going to do it, that you're 'attention seeking' and that people who do it, don't tell people beforehand.

It's completely untrue and a dangerous myth.

In 1980, my lovely Nan swallowed most of a bottle of Paracetamol and, aged 14, I found her. My mother was more concerned that Nan had broken the law regarding taking your own life (she hadn't). She was bereft after my Grandad had died the year before. The woman had lived through WWII, been chased by V2 rockets, worked in ammunitions factories, had a stillborn son and seen horrific things, but she was not prepared for widowhood. Thankfully, they were able to save her, and she lived another 19 years. We got her a dog and a budgie, took care of her and she started living again. A different life. They stopped selling bottles of 100 paracetamol quite soon after.

We need more words, more nouns to cover the many different suicides that occur in our communities.
It's wrong to use the same term for@peakygold 's grieving nan as for a troubled teenager or a woman whose menopausal hormones have caused intrusive thoughts.

Some people really do choose to 'commit' suicide. Some groups of people do 'cry for help' (that would be my brother) others sadly do talk but don't get heard or just can't hear the response.

The whole thing - language, support, research is a mess and the only thing we can agree on is that we are all sadder if it is part of our lives.

When my children were very small, I.planned to take our lives. I had it all worked out and in my disturbed mind, it made perfect sense. I thought I was caring for them by taking them with me.

On the day in question, I had to take my little girl to an appointment and I can't quite remember how it came about but they called the crisis service and from that moment, the wheels of help started turning.

The children were officially made state wards but entrusted into the care of friends. I was taken to respite house where I was looked after 27-7 by a nurse, with a psychiatrist and various other people (mental.health nurse? Social worker?) visiting each day.

I remember feeling completely detached, as if I could see the world but sort of just floating in a bubble and not part of it.

Recovery seemed slow but in hindsight was relatively smooth. When I returned home and the children were returned, I had nurses on rotation.

It's a world away from where I'm at now. The children are now teenagers and I work ft, do normal things etc.

At no point did I imagine I was doing anything more than making a carefully considered decision with utmost love for my children. So please, before you judge anyone who takes their own life, please try to grasp that they probably thought it was a good plan and had no intention or comprehension of how it could be otherwise construed. The outside world had stopped existing for me.

People who attempt suicide are still sometimes treated as criminals:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/manchester-suicide-women-prosecution-police-traffic-jam-a8926981.html

https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1915989.suicide-attempt-woman-not-helped-by-health-services/