Things you've done whilst dating to work out if they're decent or not

[LadyJelly]

I've recently been on a date with someone, so nothing serious yet. Nice. Attractive. Funny. He's a big football fan. His team lost today. I've just taken the mick (very lighthearted text about his team losing) to see what his response is. A shirty response will = no second date as getting angry or petty about football would ge a red flag for me (let's see!). Lighthearted response will be a very small green flag. As you can tell, I'm rather paranoid about domestic abuse. 1 in 4 women. And have missed the small signs beforehand. Maybe I'm being over cautious or ott.

Anyone else think it's madness that we go to these lengths to test the waters? Or that we have to? Or am I being daft?

This is another good 'test'
I'd never been really unwell until pregnancy
Which was too late to find out that my ex was uncaring and selfish and cruel!

I think rather than making tests up you should just pay attention to the natural tests that life gives, as pp has said, how does he respond when you're ill, when you say no to him etc

He sounds like a psychopath

I was at a friend’s house watching a football game. Her husband’s side list. He actually smashed the room up.

I agree with you.

@Howtofryanegg a video call in the morning, that’s asking for trouble 😂

that’s a good strategy though.

What's wrong with Joe Rogan? I have never actually listened but have heard him mention the podcast before 🤦🏻‍♀️ save me the trouble of going down a Google rabbit hole please 🤣

My husband lived football. A dig at his team losing might have been a red flag for him!
I didn't do anything as far as I'm aware, but did observe how he treated service staff, talked about his parents, and his ex, and how he treated his kids. He never bad mouthed his ex ever - even after they had an argument (they were at final stages of divorce when I met him). He tried to keep it all separate from our relationship. The was a big positive for me.

Yes mine was more like this than OPs ex's cruelty (I'm so sorry- the train incident was horrible).
Mine just found it very inconvenient. I was there entirely for him, and I had malfunctioned.

Sorry SoOutingWhoCares the train incident was yours, not OPs. Awful.

I used to throw them a curved ball
eg one occasion I was meant to meet someone and I missed the bus then the train so was late meeting him.
his reaction was very telling…

their reaction when you say no to something can be ‘interesting’

I’m not keen on the idea of ‘testing’ someone this way. Ultimately, an actual abuser won’t show their true colours until you’ve been seeing each other for a while anyway - and even then they usually start off subtle and work their way up to see what they can get away with.
I would be much more focussed on compatibility in the very early days and I wouldn’t describe anything I didn’t like as a ‘red flag’ either.
Someone up thread mentioned men who are confident in their opinions as a red flag… that’s nonsense! If YOU don’t find that attractive then that’s fine…. But some women would.
Stop trying to label men as arseholes when they are merely just not your type.

That's right. My hometown.

Unfortunately they are pretty terrible the majority of the time. 😂

Yabu. If I was in the early days of a relationship and my new partner started sending me negative messages joking about things they know I care about, I would see that as a red flag. I would have you down as someone who lacks sympathy and kindness. If you then told me you were just testing me (!!!) I would run a mile.

But this is actually what OP HAS done.

She hasn't engineered anything really, just taken a naturally occurring event - his team losing a game - and gauged his reaction to her not pussyfooting around him because of it. As she knows she doesn't want a relationship where she has to do that.

Seems completely reasonable to me.

I have never deliberately tested anyone in this way, I find it quite odd to be honest. As to the first example, if I teased my husband over his team losing, he really wouldn’t appreciate it and no he is not remotely abusive.

The concept of red flags wasn't really around in my dating days; I think it's useful but it's alarming to see people reduce someone's behaviour entirely down to red/green flags. Depending on where you're coming from and what context you're missing, I'm sure most people could be described as walking red flags OR walking green flags. DP and I once spent a (very fun) evening describing ourselves in terms of the reddest flags possible.

Also compatibility is more important - one person's red flag might be another's green, etc.

Anyway I don't believe in game-playing when dating, but I'd certainly deliberately bring up things that were important to me early on. Good politics were a must, particularly about racism (as a mixed-race woman). I'd also suggest things that inverted traditional gender roles, as I didn't want a partner who had any time for that bollocks. I'd bring up male friends, and the fact that I socialised with them, because I didn't want a partner who got in his feelings about that. Being polite to waiting staff in restaurants is a cliche but it really does work as a litmus test. I was also open about some of my own quirks - if he was going to be put off by them, better sooner rather than later.

If I discovered I'm being secretly tested, then I'm probably gone. I need someone open, honest and fairly direct. By direct I don't mean rude or obnoxious, just simple to understand. I also don't need someone who expects me to be a mind reader, and always understand how they like to be treated without it ever being communicated. I don't treat everyone the same, I try to understand people and how they like to be treated.

Not every overreaction is a red flag, if someone claims never having done so then I'm suspicious.

A high percentage of abusers like football (if it's true) doesn't mean a high percentage football fans are abusers or any other negatives trait 🤷‍♂️

The best "test" is probably just being yourself, being honest & seeing if someone still likes you. My dating profile has stuff on it, normal stuff, that I know turn a fairly large proportion of women off .. because honesty, saves them and me wasting time. They're things I'm changing for no-one

She did engineer it though. She said she laughed at his team losing so that she could see how he reacts and then she had predetermined what her next step would be. She also said something about the lengths “we” go to to test the waters, rather presumptuously assuming “we” all do that.

I'd be wary of big football fans anyway. From what I've seen of them, they can be obsessed, and if you have children you'll be doing a lot of childcare.

So how long was he waiting?

I've never deliberately 'tested' someone - I've been 'tested' by a couple of boyfriends in the past myself, though. To be honest, I found it very manipulative and sly and it was unpleasant to be on the receiving end of it. Ironically, both those boyfriends were themselves abusive, one emotionally/psychologically and the other physically.

Obviously I'm absolutely NOT saying that the OP is being abusive here! Just that for me, just personally and because of my own experience, 'testing' would be a red flag.

I do think there are situations that just naturally occur in the early days of relationships that give you an indicator of whether things will work, but it's more of an organic thing for me, not a situation where I would be 'testing' the other person. For example, if I went out for a meal for someone for the first time, and they were an arsehole to the waiter, that would be a red flag - but I would never think 'Hmm, I'll suggest we go for dinner and then I can watch him to see how he behaves to the restaurant staff'.

That's in no way necessarily an indicator of domestic abuse but I personally can't be with someone who gives the silent treatment if I rib them about the football

See, for me, if a partner 'ribbed' me about something that I didn't find funny, and then got annoyed/upset when I didn't give them some kind of reaction, THAT would be a massive red flag! I can't stand people who like to bait others for attention (especially about something that's important to them) and then get annoyed when their target doesn't rise to it. My boyfriend's team have been relegated more than once during the course of our relationship and I wouldn't have ribbed him about it because while he wouldn't have reacted angrily he also wouldn't have found it funny - and exactly the same would have applied to me when my own team lost a massive final a few years ago.

Again, I'm absolutely not saying you are being abusive or horrible - and I think 'silent treatment' and 'no reaction' are probably two different things anyway - but basically what I take from this thread is that there is very much not a one-size-fits-all solution to relationships!

For example, if I went out for a meal for someone for the first time, and they were an arsehole to the waiter, that would be a red flag - but I would never think 'Hmm, I'll suggest we go for dinner and then I can watch him to see how he behaves to the restaurant staff'.

It's a bit of both isn't it? If I'd only been on a few dates with someone and we went out to eat, I'd absolutely pay specific attention to how he treated the waiter. So it would be a test, but not one I'd manipulated him into. Similarly a lot of my tests just involved me being myself - political, left-wing, active social life with other men - and seeing how he reacted to it.

See, for me, if a partner 'ribbed' me about something that I didn't find funny, and then got annoyed/upset when I didn't give them some kind of reaction, THAT would be a massive red flag! I can't stand people who like to bait others for attention (especially about something that's important to them) and then get annoyed when their target doesn't rise to it.

I think a huge test of a partner (again not a test to manipulate them into... I mean more of a litmus test) is that they know what they can rib you about and what they can't. And if they mess up and rib you about something you felt more deeply than they thought, they row back instead of doubling down with the "it was a joke" defensiveness. Obv vice versa too. I've never dated a football fan but if a bad result is a raw nerve for someone I'd respect that. (DP knows never, ever to joke about the result of the 2019 election to me.)

I was writing from the perspective of the hypothetical man you mentioned.

I had a bf who twice damaged my house through carelessness and didn't even apologise, never mind offer to repair the damage.

Reader, I jilted him.

Behaviour like that is now on my red flag list.

Waiting two weeks for a first date to give him a chance to put his foot in it is an example of engineering a situation. HTH.