To wonder what has happened to my Son's school

[k2493]

Just posting for thoughts

Both my kids have gone through the same secondary school. When my daughter started, the school was lovely and new with around 750 kids.

Fast forward to 2024 and there is now 1500 kids and it's become like a dictatorship.

Due to the number of kids, the school has put lines either side of the hallway that they have to walk within otherwise they get detention.

Every hallway is a one way system.

The minute they arrive in school, they have to remove their coats or it's detention even with no heating in the middle of winter. The other day my son arrived back to school to find that there were long queues outside while they did two uniform checks at the door. By the time he got in, he was frozen. Immediately he got shouted at for still having his coat on even though he had just stepped in from the cold.

He then went around the corner and got shouted at again even though he tried to explain it's really difficult to be expected to stay warm, keep moving and remove your coat all at the same time. Nope. Threaten with detention again.

AIBU to wonder what has happened to our education system? I'm lucky in that my son is quite strong minded and just brushes it off but what about the kids who's mental health this is impacting? Surely we want our kids to remember school as being enjoyable for their education and friendships rather than for being shouted at every two minutes for not walking between lines or not taking their coats off the minute they arrive in school?

I totally relate to this, and I agree with you. Schools were often just nasty places that you just had to survive, and they still are.

Nonsense.

I was the most well behaved pupil you could wish for. Straight A student, no wish to be any trouble or stand out from the crowd in any way. My home life was full of love and I knew what was and wasn't okay, and I knew why the boundaries were what they were because my parents treated me with enough respect to explain them.

School terrified me. It felt like there was always the possibility that you were doing something wrong without quite realising it. That you fall foul of a rule or a teacher and end up in trouble even though you were doing your very best not to. Mystifying rules and unwritten expectations.

Behaviour is so bad in general in schools these days that this is the approach that is often taken. Such strict policies have to be embedded across and around schools for good behaviour also to be apparent inside the classroom. Not necessarily enjoyable but I've worked in lots of schools to know the alternatives leave children spending their days in chaos.

Agree that's bollocks.

It reminds me of the Daily Mail comments section, "You can't say nuffink these days".

The issue isn't abiding by the rules though, it's harsh punishment for east to make mistakes (forgetting a ruler). This is what stresses good kids, that they try hard to be good but still get in trouble.

It's also not proportionate as same detention for forgotten protractor as not doing homework or disrupting class.

Alot of the schools around here(SW) are being taken over by a really strict academy. You get sent to 'refocus' for the tiniest mistskes. My dc school hasn't been taken over yet but it's certainly going in that direction. Was a lovely school. If they're not behind their chair at the time of the bell they get straight out to sit jn a room.for 4 hrs. My dc said numerous children have been sent straight there for walking in on the bell. They get 5mins to walk to and from lessons. They have whole days where they just read out the rules and keep going over it.

Twistyizzy Read the replies in what people are saying about how this is affecting their kids Mental Health. When my daughter was there with 750 kids (which is still a lot of children), they managed. Now the school has doubled, let's blame the kids. It is always one of two who misbehave over the majority who want to respect their teachers so why must all be punished for one or two's behaviour?

I'm sorry but this is where my Psychologically comes into play and it very much seems like Power over instead of Power to. We aren't teaching our children we can trust them to walk in a orderly manor and behave like young adults.

At my son's school, if you accidentally put a toe out, you get shouted at. Can you imagine those kids who already have anxiety and what this is doing to them?

I'm not dismissing these severe accidents at all because this has happened at my children's school with children falling down the stairs but maybe it's time to seriously look at the infrastructure and how schools are being managed rather than blame all children for bad behaviour.

As many have said I'm also really lost as to how a child wearing a coat in school has any bearing on life? We would never sit and freeze or work. We can't function if we are hungry or need the toilet so why do we expect our kids to.

I knew this would be a 50/50 post. This is how I feel. Each to their own.

Really...I've read upteen threads on here where people want to call ss because they heard a neighbour shouting at their children. One woman wanted to call ss because she heard a woman call her dad a pest in the supermarket...she was actually debating following her to the car park and taking down her reg number.

My teenage ds once swore at me when we were shopping...I turned round and asked him who the hell he thought he was talking to...a man turned round and looked at me like i was an absolute monster.

Coats- we can check their uniforms as they walk in. It stops them from putting soaking wet coats/jackets on desks. Many coats/hoodies are a way for some students to assert their identity/gang mentality; Stone Island, puffy Moncler coats with hoods up, CP jackets. It completely goes against the point of having a standardised uniform id students are allowed to walk around the building in these. If you don’t work with young people you might think “it’s just a coat”……..it isn’t for a lot of them, it’s a way of challenging the school or creating a persona.

This is why lots of schools expect students to take their coats off at the door.

I think the one way system/lines on floor in corridors is fine. I went to a high school with 2,000 pupils in the late 90s and we had this system then which worked fine. It's needed in a large school.

The coat thing is obviously ridiculous. Have you spoken to the school about how this is impacting the children and tried to get a more reasonable approach? We were only allowed to wear black coats with no obvious branding.

Sounds awful. Maybe needs a checklist & a help to check stuff once a night for morning. I hate these stupidly strict schools. There are a few near us. I chose a more balanced school thankfully

Government happened.

De regulate and cheap alternatives will appear like in Africa and India.

I agree

Young people, as a wider group, are just not behaving as they would have done ten + years ago. It's not down to schools, but they're dealing with it.

It's not a dictatorship to insist on consistent rules, and it's much better for children to know expectations and be certain of consequences for them to learn how to behave appropriately.

If the small things aren't established and in place, problems are stored up and schools have to be conducive to learning.

It's easy to say that teachers should be good enough to get good behaviour out of children without being firm, but a lot of children haven't been brought up well enough to be respectful to adults who are responsible for them.

SLT newbie on Facebook. Awful but very close to what is happening in many academy chains.

Pe teachers rising fast as they don't have planning and marking load of science, English etc. many are promoted beyond their capabilities

I don’t believe it is always good thing for children to always ‘do what they are fucking told
I don’t agree with school uniform
I tell my DC to follow the rules so they don’t get detentions but discuss with them how pointless some of the rules are
What comes first ,poor behaviour leading to draconian rules ,or vice versa
Some critical thinking on the point of teachers might not be a bad idea

@k2493 the coat thing is because it enables kids to hide things ie knives/vapes etc and therefore bring these things into class.
Seriously this all comes down to how schools attempt to deal with poor behaviour in a small minority of pupils. MATs in particular tend to go down the more draconian route but you all know the rules before your DC start at the schools.
I would suggest you speak to teachers if you want to know the real story of what goes on in many secondary schools, then you may understand why these rules end up being brought in.

What twistyizzy said

OMG yes!!!

Telling your child off doesn't equal shouting at them. Putting boundaries in place doesn't require you to shout at your child.

Students are herded through school like cattle and might as well all be stamped with the same bar code.
The world has changed so much, and the schools have failed to keep up.
" This is the way we have always done it" isn't working anymore.
We have an world wide pandemic of school refusal that is just the very tip of the iceberg and was already at an all time high before Covid. Nobody seems to have the answer. Drs, Cahms , and other professionals all way out of their depth on how to treat it.
How much worse does it have to get before anyone has the guts to admit it's just not working?

@deeprealisation this is a new behaviour policy at the school. When we chose it they were talking up pastoral care and mental health now it's all about detentions.

We may need to jump to private as all the options round here are the same multi academy trust so no real choice.

All schools near us are coats off a door. Reasons mentioned are valid. Stuff hidden in coats. Hoods up so can't see who it is on cctv / by staff.
Trip hazards in classrooms which aren't huge. If they have coats on they play on phones under them etc
At least our school has lockers.

I don’t have a problem with any of this. Some of the rules seem mad but ultimately I tell my kids just to do what theyr’e meant to do and if they don’t they deal with the consequences. I have much more of a problem being emailed by my eldest child’s private school emailing me about year 13’s having plain black trainers instead of leather shoes and how this sets a bad example to younger girls than I do about year 7-11 having to take their coats off when they come into school

It is always one of two who misbehave over the majority who want to respect their teachers so why must all be punished for one or two's behaviour?

It'll be a lot more than one or two, otherwise they'd be able to deal with it easily and wouldn't need to bring these rules in