To think they are ‘𝘳𝘪𝘤𝘩’

[HansBanan]

Okay, I know it's subjective but I'm some what bored of my in-laws down playing this.
My SIL is 28, well educated, 2 children, lives in London. She's married, husband is about 40, a little older maybe, a high earner (250k ish - chief investment officer for a wealth management company).
They are mortgage free, in a large beautiful house (I'm not sure of the logistics of how this is the case but know they are). 1 car, owned outright. They have credit cards but I'm sure they pay them off monthly and mainly use them for the benefits and rewards.
Their children are young so not school age yet, but it's very clearly they sill be privately educated. I'm not sure how much the bonus her husband receives would be but let's assume it's anywhere between 25k - 125k depending on the firm.
They holiday several times a year, almost always business class.

AIBU to think that is ‘𝘳𝘪𝘤𝘩’? My in-laws are all insisting that in London this is just comfortable but I don't buy it! Especially not with their mortgage free home!
I know it's not my business but it irks me

Rich....wealthy.... I'm dint think these are quite the right terms for them. I'd say 'well off'. They are well off. No financial worries but still have to be selective on purchases and can't be wearing proper designer everything everyday. To me rich is net worth of about £5mil plus. Wealthy is £10 mil plus. Super rich or mega wealthy is £75ion plus. Ultra high net worth is £200mil and up

@tennesseewhiskey1 : Ffs - stop looking at how much their house costs or how much the creep could potentially earn - it’s weird.

"the creep"?

What has this man done to deserve that, beyond work hard to get a good job and pay off his mortgage?

Rich people never say they're rich, there's always someone richer

And the problem with them being rich is… ? Also anyone who is frequently traveling for work surely collects enough tier points over the years to get reward flights and companion vouchers that make (selected) business class flights only marginally more expensive than economy. Plus many credit cards have options to double up on Avios etc.

I suppose if 50% of his wages goes on tax then maybe they don’t see themselves as rich
They are well off but probably still have to watch their spending

£5million isn't a great deal of money?

Sheesh, how out of touch are you? A quick google shows that assets of "just" £3.6 million puts someone in the top 1% of wealth in the uk. It gives them an equivalent GDP higher than many countries. If you sold a house worth that and just stuck the money into a bog standard savings account the interest alone gives you roughly 4x the annual uk salary.

On top of that, an annual salary of 500k equally puts a person pretty much at the top of global earnings exclusing the super, super, super wealthy.

But sure, it's just comfortable.

I have no idea what any of my siblings or in laws earn and that's how I like it. No interest in comparisons. Nobody I know discusses these things.

You aren't 'comfortable' if you live in social housing. That just isn't what that word means.

Oh, that is more than perfect! (as long as you tell DH that you plan to tell them that because you are tired of the comparisons).

It's annoying to always have someone comparing your life to theirs or to someone else's. Especially when it sounds like they are doing it to make you feel "lesser" than SIL/BIL.

Whst @Pallisers said on Page 7…you need to get better at shutting this down. It sounds intensely irritating for you!

It's comfortable enough and gives security of tenancy, so much more comfortable than having a mortgage or renting privately.

Money talk always gets weird on mumsnet.

And as usual the rich never think of themselves as rich.
https://ifs.org.uk/tools_and_resources/where_do_you_fit_in#tool-results-section

That should give people an idea of how rich they are.

£250k income is in the top 1%

Interestingly London council tax is lower than other parts of the country too. You have to search elsewhere for that information.

Where is the house OP? As in what suburb. It's unlikely is 5million if he's only on £300k a year. I say only because if he works for an investment bank and is in his 40s he is really not doing that well. I know I know but that really is very mediocre for investment banking.

I’d call them wealthy. I would remind the in laws that their daughter and son in law are extremely lucky to be mortgage free at such a young age, and to think about how that came about.
“Not this again. We don’t want to spend £500.00 on children’s clothing or put them in designer outfits/put them into a private school/ fly business class, we have a mortgage to pay. He is earning three times the average wage for London plus a big bonus and even taking into account London weighting they are extremely wealthy compared to us.
SIL &BIL don’t have a mortgage at such a young age too, unlike us and if BIL and SIL want to spend their money on those things then that’s their choice. Ours is not to, we are prioritising keeping the roof above heads”

How does your DH feel about having his lifestyle compared to his sisters all of the time?

Definitely rich. The highest cost of living in London is housing, if they are mortgage free then they're laughing.

I live in social housing. Not sure why it's more comfortable than having a mortgage? I get the secure tenancy bit but I'll be paying rent until I die, unlike most people who have a mortgage which will be paid off one day. Also I'll have no assets to help me in old age or to pass down to DS.

I think for me ‘rich’ as opposed to very comfortably off, is when you don’t need to budget for the finer things in life. All three kids going to Eton, not a problem, holidays in St Bart’s whenever you want, bought that lovely Manor style house in the Cotswolds because you needed a holiday home there, etc. That to me is rich. Comfortably off is being able to afford private school but not if you’ve got more than two kids, being able to buy that new build five bedroom, three bath detached but it’s mortgaged etc.

To me, Richard Branson or the Beckhams are rich.
I'd say your ILs are very well off. If they had a big mortgage to pay as well as multiple school fees and all of these holidays, 250k household income would cover it comfortably but not excessively iyswim.

Also agree that to the layperson his salary is silly money but for his age and in his industry, he's at the lower end

There is no “lay person”, he’s not a doctor or a priest. He’s a fat cat in an overpaid industry and his ranking in that industry is neither here nor there. By any metric in a national or global context he’s rolling in it. He’s in the top fraction of a percentage in the UK. Trust me, that’s fucking rich.

I don't think your definition of rich is how most people see it.
You're saying that only if you have an endless pot of gold money can you be rich?

They aren't the issue OP.
The issue is between you and the parents.
Their income, house value, lifestyle is not of your concern.
Speak to the parents about your insecurities.

Quite simply don't get yourself into other people's finances. You are delving far too deep and being far too nosey.

It’s sad how far people’s expectations have fallen about what constitutes rich. People in this country now compare themselves against developing countries if they think that OP’s relatives are rich. Nowhere in the redeveloped world would this be considered rich. General population in this country is now poor by finances and poor by mentality. Accepting lower standards in everything. On MN, someone who can turn their heating on is now considered rich. That’s how much low expectations have taken hold. Happy with government handouts to pay energy bills and staying within their own small circle as long as minimum effort is required.

Rich is someone who does not need a job. OP’s relative couldn’t quite their job and maintain taker lifestyle off the back of the value of their house alone. Rich are the ones whose assets produce enough income to keep them accustomed to their lifestyle. And still the value of assets keeps growing.

People need to raise their bar, otherwise the next generation will have an even smaller mentality and keep being shafted.

Errr yes, that’s exactly how being rich works. Having money that grows more money. Being a dependent on a job is rich only for people who don’t understand how many proper rich people are in there.

Money aside, they don't sound very happy or emotionally secure. Why do they need to keep telling the parents how much they're spending on clothes or that they're flying business?
Perhaps they should buy some humility and modesty.