To think we wouldn't have as many MH problems if we lived differently

[Ginlette]

Panic attacks, anxiety, depression...

How much of this is happening because of the way our society is set up?

If we all lived in fairly small communities and had good relationships with friends and family near by, would we have these issues? If we had stable work that didn't feel like an impossible workload and paid fairly?

I'm even beginning to wonder whether "positives" of modern living are actually subtly undermining our MH as a society.

• The obvious examples being the Internet and phones, but also..
• Mobility: looks good on paper, but maybe the idea of the world being your oyster subconsciously is anxiety inducing?
• Travel: fun but frequent travel again contributes
• Home ownership and improvements, style & beauty inprovements: again this idea of we have choice, but is it contributing to a low level sense of always chasing?
• More freedom of partner and freedom to have children or be childfree: but does it create a "What if?" sensation past generations wouldn't have had fluttering at the edges of their mind?
• Remote working/self employed: I have done this for over a decade but does it maybe contribute to a sense of no base, no community?

And who's going to pay for that .... Daft proposal!

People these days are too acquisitive, want everything right now, gratification is no longer postponed. Bigger and better and always more, more, more.

Feel left out when their lives don't measure up to others and SM propagates dissatisfaction. Thats what's leading to MH issues. Comparison is the thief of joy.
Find contentment within yourself, giving and loving and getting by.

I could have written this post. I'm self employed and work around caring for our two young kids, no support network or community, just all on me, with my husband taking 50-50 when he's home. It's incredibly isolating and lonely! There is no school community either, just drop off / pick up, no eye contact, no WhatsApp group, no chat. It's only when I have another adult to help with the kids that I can finally breathe and realise quite how tightly wound I am most of the time. We're planning on moving and one of my biggest criteria is being able to be a part of a community. It's so important!

I think there is a happy balance.

I certainly think shift workers and long distance drivers suffer from interrupted sleep patterns. And people who work long hours in minimum wage jobs to make ends meet.

A lot of poor mh is found nowadays in our teen and student population and I would argue that some of them are getting too much rest!

You need a certain amount of stress, good routines, and a sense of purpose for good mh imho.

I think part of it is being able to live your life in a way that is comfortable to you. The remote working thing, some are at their happiest when at home. It's the constant pressure of having somewhere to be that causes anxiety.
For others, they need the stimulation of having plans and being out a lot. Which is why lockdowns suited some people more than others and peoples experiences of that time were polar opposites. I think the latter, the people who need to be out and around people, really can't understand the home birds, to the point that they get frustrated with them.
It all comes down to us as individuals needing and liking different things. Society pressures us into thinking that we should all want the Instagram life of travel, nights out and various other experiences/purchases. A simple, uncomplicated life that is spent close to home, with just a few loved ones, is frowned upon and discouraged. You need lots of friends, lots of stuff and lots of photo worthy experiences or you are failing at life. When it's just not possible and/or suited to most people. It's no wonder that so many people are struggling mentally.

It's certainly something that needs to be implemented and evaluated properly to provide evidence for whether this is something that should be considered as a policy.

Even various Silicon Valley tech billionaires are discussing the need for this if/when generative AI reduces skilled jobs and has a wider impact on employment.

Scott Santens has been researching UBI for some time and has a very informative FAQ about most of the objections and questions that people have.

https://www.scottsantens.com/basic-income-faq/

I guess it depends on what you're defining as "rest". A lot of television, film and computer games activate adrenalin, which is not at all restful!

You don't have to choose a lifestyle that means you don't get any rest, though.

A lot of it is choice - people have multiple children who are all signed to multiple after school and weekend activities, sports and classes. I read posts on here from parents who are up at 6am every Saturday to take their child to one of three different activities that day - it just seems crazy to me.

But presumably on some level, they like it, or they wouldn't do it.

That’s such an interesting point.
I also think that when people praise the type of community where everyone looks out for each other, they sometimes forget that the flip-side of that is people interfering in each other’s lives, whether wanted or not.
I’m not British and originally from a culture where what you describe is a bit more prevalent than in the UK.
I know (from experience 😅) that ‘looking out for each other’ can for example also mean that people mention it straight away when you gain or lose weight, so none of the ‘we shouldn’t comment of other people’s bodies’ business.
See also criticising the state of one’s house, the way one parents one’s children, any character flaws or quirks and so forth.
I often see people on here describe their house as their sanctuary, their safe space.
Both my mother and my aunt had to continuously fight off criticism and unsolicited advice from their respective MILs in their own homes.
I remember my grandmother criticising my mum (amongst other things) for enjoying reading and sitting down on the sofa with a book, because grandma considered it laziness and a waste of time.

MH issues are a spectrum. At one end you have people that can’t really function at all in society and at other end you have people that can albeit a struggle sometimes. MH issues have probably existed since man evolved.
Is modern live making MH issues worse especially in the young. I think so.
I think when I was young very few of my peers worried about the future there was pressure to succeed academically alright because everyone thought we would all go get qualified and find good jobs etc and life would work out. Young people now can see this isn’t true. My teenager worries about the future because they think working hard doesn’t mean that you will be able to house yourself as an adult.

I was actually talking about MH issues on my walk this morning. How many of us get enough natural light or fresh air every day. We spend our lives constantly running around. We obviously need to work to pay our way but we also need time to live.

There's too much focus on what you don't have and far too little on being grateful for what you do have. I think we've all been sold this idea of what we deserve and what we should have in the West and it's nonsense. Everyday life is now filled with things that once would be considered a treat and is now just expected.

'The Divided Brain' on Prime is a documentary that explores the adverse effect that modern living, our ways of working and the way young people are educated nowadays has on our brains.

It's fascinating and worrying.

Is it worse or are more things defined as MH problems now? People of all ages have always worried about things, been pissed off, etc but now these are lumped under the MH banner.

I personally love brief, regular interactions like this. Probably not everyone’s cup of tea, but I find seeing certain friends and acquaintances often, even just briefly, very comforting and reassuring.

I wonder if contentedness was higher in the past ? Obviously times were hard and people had to suppress their grief and trauma but it seems like people were happier with their lot .

Now we are aware of what we lack/ are missing out on. Advertising and some of social media is geared to making us think we will be happy when we have these things .

It seems like there is a lot of low grade poor mental health these days . Maybe it is just people being more vocal about it

Many people live in an absolute state of fear and many of the posts on here prove that. If you took the fear factor out, they're would be very few posts on this forum.
Scared of being judged, scared of doing the wrong thing, scared of making a personal decision, scared of dogs, scared of being a bad parent, scared of growing old, scared of being stuck in loveless marriage, scared of being alone forever, scared of dating, the list goes on.
So is it any wonder really out younger generation are struggling so much with MH.
You get the ignorants on here who have the absolute audacity to point the finger at our younger generation , shaming them, when we are a culture addicted to alcohol, drugs, anti depressants, gambling, anything that will temporarily numb away the uncomfortable feelings.
Nobody wants to put the work in to improving their own mental health because that takes effort. Much easier to make excuses and blame everything else.
I know many people who suffer with low,mood, anxiety, depression etc.
Not one has ever read a self help book, looked for information on a forum, listened to a podcast changed diet, started exercising more. Looked into ways of changing thought, mindset and perspectives. No one wants to work on themselves.
They still manage to get their nails and hair done regularly, but not in the least bit interested in how to improve their MH.

When I was a child I remember overhearing elderly relatives discussing my parent’s generation (baby boomers) always over sharing their problems. That it isn’t good to talk about your private life. So, I really do think that there has always been mental health problems. Older generations (such as my grandparents) didn’t talk about their private problems. It wasn’t the done thing. (Though, I did get the distinct impression that they were ok with discussing other people’s private problems in the form of gossip.)

But things shifted. In the 60’s there was a focus on self discovery, self actualisation, pop psychology, exploration and experimentation of drugs (LSD was used therapeutically). Society shifted into being more open about sharing your personal experiences. Over time it has become more socially acceptable to say: ‘I suffer from … mental health issue.’

I agree that we can fall prey to life should be an eternal summer philosophy. If we arent living our best life, we have failed. Not helped by SM. I also think some of us are scared to experience the full range of human emotions as certain emotions, like anger, are vilified, when in fact they are really important for our wellbeing. Unhappiness I think is largely caused by inauthentic living and that can apply to any aspect of our lives and so happiness for me would be doing what I love, with the people who love me unconditionally more than some of the things you mention.

I also think that when people praise the type of community where everyone looks out for each other, they sometimes forget that the flip-side of that is people interfering in each other’s lives, whether wanted or not.

My dad’s family was the community types with a revolving door of people, interfering in each other’s lives, etc.. and my mum’s side, they had visitors but they were often there for a purpose, (grandfather was a mechanic) and the chatting was mainly outside in the front garden unless you were strictly family. DH’s family is the community type.

On both sides, some family went on to have the same community type in their homes and others went on to have the “my home is my sanctuary” type and people chose what they felt comfortable with or needed.

I recall my aunt was a community type and praised it until she did something perceived wrong and was ostracised which she never expected after being involved for several years. She found another community but it still hurt how quickly she was cast aside.

I have to admit that I miss these lovely casual interactions. A friend/relative/neighbour popping by, knocking on the door to see if you were home. Inviting them in for a cup of tea or coffee. Nowadays most people pre arrange catching up. But then maybe I am just being a typical getting older person reminiscing about the way things used to be done back in the olden days when I was young. Just like generations before me. 😄

I don't think humans do well being crammed into relatively small spaces with large numbers of strangers. You're on some level on alert continuously. I also think people become more aggressive and competitive the less space they have.
There's also a ridiculous amount of complexity now - most people can manage it until they age, but again it probably adds a background level of stress.

We evolved to live in small family or tribal groups, with food and shelter as the most pressing concerns and occasional raised stressed levels due to threats - large predators, other tribes etc. We have the exact same brains as then, but think how different our environment is.

I also think that when people praise the type of community where everyone looks out for each other, they sometimes forget that the flip-side of that is people interfering in each other’s lives, whether wanted or not.

During my childhood I lived in a place where some of the community popped in and out of each other's houses all the time, mostly in an unauthorised fashion. We couldn't leave a house empty as it would be broken into—so we never went out together as a family. Not that that was a guarantee, it wasn't unusual for someone to be burgled to the extent where a woman's purse was stolen from under her pillow while she was sleeping.

Living in a community where there are apex predators can mean a fair number of other inhabitants have their lifestyle is substantially affected and they can even develop lifelong hypervigilance.

Exactly.
There can also be quite a bit of shaming culture going on in societies like this, and lots of pressure to fit in.
I grew up in a country like this.
I remember a schoolmate (who was 8 or 9 at the time) being reprimanded in front of the whole class because we were supposed to bring old paper and cardboard with us on that day (recycling initiative) and she’d forgotten.

I am over 50 too and i would completely agree with this , there are a lot more things in life now that cause a lot of complications that weren't there before.

I honestly think that different ways of life work for different people, and so we all have to try to work out what works for us in our daily lives. I have never been that materialistic and have hobbies which allow me to be active, get out into nature, to be creative and to unwind, and I do feel that helps. I am also quite introverted, and so while I love having a good conversation, I am also happy in my own little bubble. Clearly there is more to mental health than environment, of course, and we cannot completely guard against problems in our brain biochemistry, despite years of research into various mental health conditions. We also cannot always guard against traumatic events in our life, e.g. premature and sudden death of a loved one, developing a chronic illness and so on, which have a great impact on MH. I also feel there is (wrongly) still some shame associated with MH conditions, and that coupled with woefully inadequate support in many situations, results in thousands of people trying (and often failing) to cope alone.

That sounds horrendous 😔