Tell ds I love him...

[lewissss]

My ex rarely sees our son. He is abusive, not a nice person. Split up 5 months ago.

My son is 6. Doesn't ask about his dad. Goes weeks at a time without seeing him. He seems generally happy and not phased by lack of contact. If anything, his behaviour is much better now his dad isn't around as much.

I do not speak at all to my ex and I only ever reply to any texts with one word answers.

He contacts mostly every week and it's always the same:

'Is ds ok?'
'Yes'
'Tell him I love him'

I never do tell my son his dad loves him as I feel this could cause him confusion and upset.

I feel it's slightly emotionally abusive of my ex to tell me to do this.

Aibu?

I'm of the opinion love is actions not words. I would not upset a happy child with reminders of a semi absent father but I'd not keep the messages a secret if son ever talks about ex I'd mention it then that he texts to say he loves him. I'd phrase it "daddy said he love you" I wouldn't say "daddy loves you"

Thank you for all responses, they have been useful.

I think I don't need to do anything immediately now. Everything is all still very uncertain and it's just not worth rocking the boat.

There are some good phrases here that I can use.

He does have a history of manipulation. His words are constantly empty and meaningless. They always have been. He's full of false promises.

Anyone who can actually say that they are not going to bother with their child anymore clearly does not love their child.

The door is still open for my ex to have a relationship with his son however he has to prove himself and he won't do this.

I'll see how the next few weeks pan out. I'm not scared of talking to my son about his dad. Someone said this - my son is having well being sessions and school as well as being supported through social services. I do check in with my son and we have various well being visuals at home that he use to show he is feeling.

I really am doing my best here but sometimes it's just never good enough

Could you tell your ex that you feel it's more appropriate for him to tell your son this himself as you don't want him to get confused and wonder why he isn't seeing him if he loves him?

I can understand why you want to avoid cognitive dissonance.

One thing I would say, make sure your son feels confident and secure in asking questions and talking about it/his dad. There are plenty of conversations where it can be casually dropped in , like if he asks why he has freckles and you don't (silly example I know) and you can tell him his dad had them too. Or jobs or interests. Make sure he has pictures to look at. By making this information readily available and not a big deal will help your son navigate this a lot better and it's easier to open up and ask questions if it feels normal and natural and still give him a sense of dad.

OP, I can see that things are desperately hard for you - it is clear from your messages both that you have suffered at the hands of this man, and that you desperately want to do the best by your son. Posting on here about it shows you are not just somebody who does whatever they feel like and tells themself they are right in all matters, but instead someone who thinking carefully and reflects on important decisions and is willing to listen to others' views. I have lots of respect for this - it's quite rare!

None of us, certainly not me, can tell you what to do for the best here, or predict the future. Probably no course of action would be without negative impact, due to the nature of your situation. However you have asked for advice, so I will share my instinctive reaction.

My husband and his mom and brother were abandoned by the husband's dad when husband was 7. No more contact after that as far as my husband knows, until he himself sort out his dad a decade and a half later.

He himself would say he carries a MASSIVE emotional wound due to this, and it's contributed to some pretty dubious behaviour on his part in the past, which has hurt himself and others. (and I am NOT saying it's an excuse for the stupid things he has done - but a contributing factor quite possibly).

The way he tells it, it was the idea of his father simply completely ceasing to care what happened to him and his brother that was the real kicker. If his dad had stayed in touch even loosely, even just letters or occasional phonecalls to his mom, he would (he claims) have found it much less damaging.

So I wonder if a father who at least bother to text your mom occasionally to ask after you and say he loves you, while undeniably totally fucking shit, is a bit less devastating than a dad who seems to have forgotten your existence entirely....

(On a practical note, if this man does stay in his son's life to any extent and you decide to allow that, I'd give your son a mobile phone perhaps earlier than you otherwise might have. Then dad can message and tell him he loves him himself if and when he wants to. My co-parent and I have my daughter a mobile quite young (closely monitored at first obviously) and it made all of us a lot happier! But six is too young sadly).

Why do you presume what I would say, some people love nothing more than to put words in your mouth on here..

Why would you think that ‘not lying’ means you’d tell a 6 year old that their dad doesn’t want to see them? That’s not the same as ‘not lying’ that’s actively offering information that (whilst true), is unnecessary and nothing but hurtful to the child.

not lying to the child isn’t the same as not telling him everything that’s going on, a 6 year old can’t understand the complex workings of an adult relationship and won’t understand their dad is a horrible person, you don’t have to lie and make excuses for him, but you don’t have to offer the full truth either, there is a balance between the two.

But I personally don’t think you should pretend he doesn’t exist either, or not ever talk about him, telling a child that mum and dad both love him very much, but like a lot of families they don’t live together and can’t always see each other whenever they want to anymore isn’t harmful or giving false hope, but only OP knows her son and what level she can discuss things with him.

I sometimes think it would be better if the deadbeats just left their children’s lives altogether, but they rarely do, they just dip in and out when the feel like it, leave hurt and confusion in their wake, and the other parent is left with the thankless task of trying to keep their young child from thinking THEY are the reason their dad doesn’t want to see them.

I think where am I finding it so tricky is that ex has another son which I mentioned that he no longer sees.

That child was in my life for 9 years - I miss him terribly. This is ds brother obviously. Ds has also lost his brother in this too. It is not possible for me to contact him before anyone asks. The damage my ex has done to that child means him and his mother wants no contact from any of his extended family. I have tried. That child is older and more aware of his feelings and I have to respect his wishes despite us having an extremely close relationship. One day I hope he will get in touch but for now I respect that he needs to heal.

So whilst we have loose arrangements for ds and his dad here, I know full well that he can and most likely will give my son the same treatment and it really is very unsettling.

Equally it's not like I can have any conversations with ex but he would only use it as an excuse to abuse me and I've been advised not to do this by literally everyone. Social services, the police, my solicitor etc.

So I really am stuck in limbo.

However I can understand that it should be an open conversation and it is - just ds never seems to want to talk about it. He just seems so much happier though I realise that may not be the case inside his head. Equally we have all noticed he seems much less anxious than usual too.

It's so tricky. I'll think about the memory book as someone suggested.

They are confused and misguided because they are only told part of the story.

The more honest and open you can be (in an age appropriate way), the more you can clear away any misunderstandings.

And yes, children always take their anger out on the present parent(s), even in the happiest of families. That’s one of the challenges of living them and being there for them through thick and thin that we’ve all been talking about.

She just has to say “Daddy asked me to tell you that he loves you”.

She would not be endorsing the message.

In my personal experience it's best not to rock the boat with the child at that age they simply don't have the understanding to process "daddy text you but doesn't want to see you" and let's face it, it's fucking painful when you work that out

I'm with you op. Talk is cheap. It's absolutely irrelevant and meaningless for a small child to be told that someone they don't see loves them.

@Minglingpringle wrong. They are confused and misguided because they are presented a narrative that isn't true. That their parent loves them when actually they don't give a shit. Because that's the missing part of the story.

I’m not saying she should tell them he loves him. I agree, that would be very confusing for him.

I’m saying she should pass on the message - “Daddy asked me to tell you he loves you”.

She would not be endorsing the message and if a conversation emerged she could add more nuance.

And her child couldn’t accuse her of lying to him in the future. But nor would he think she doesn’t understand what a deadbeat dad is.

The thing is I'm not even stopping FaceTimes. He could do it himself. I've told him that we can set up a schedule where he can call ds himself. But it hasn't happened. And this is all because it's me taking charge. It's me saying 'you can speak to ds at this time on this day'

He won't do that. Which is why he is trying to take control back by telling me to do something.

The message isn't 'can you tell ds I love him please?'

It's an order - 'tell ds I love him'

It's all about control over me. The text message in itself is completely empty and meaningless. That's all he's got left now.

@Minglingpringle as time goes on and it becomes clear what the future looks like, then I will know better how to handle it.

I am not saying I am never going to pass any messages on. I'm not saying ex will never be mentioned. Ds will still say every now and then 'do you remember when me, you and daddy did this?' And my response will always be 'yeah that was a fun day!' It's never avoided.

It's all very uncertain and also pretty new and raw for ds .

Ds is only 6. I have plenty of time to tell him his dad loves him. He's not going to remember those few times where his dad asked me to tell him he loved him but I didn't at the age of 6.

I'm talking about the here about now. Right now ds is settled and doing well and that is most important. No doubt the boat will be rocked in the future. It's clear it will be.

Well exactly. Anyone can type the words I love you or tell ds I love him. Actions speak louder than words.

If he loved his son then he would be financially contributing and seeing/calling his son more often.

Your son knows exactly what his dad’s like & has made up his mind that he’s better off without him in his life. Terribly sad, but unless your son asks I’m not sure it’s worth mentioning his dad to him as you don’t want to give him any false hope for the future.

CMS are on to him but he's not responding.

His new girlfriend has 3 kids. My suspicion is he's going to move in with her (probably has done already) and say he financially supports them so he will pay me less.

Hes known them for about 6 weeks I'd say. This is the exact type of thing he would do.

Again, this is all to make me suffer.

I think that’s sensible. You don’t have to follow any specific timings for passing on messages. He will just need to know over time that these messages were sent. Although I guess it shouldn’t be left too long - it should be part of his understanding as he grows.

@Minglingpringle I understand.

This weekend will probably tell me a lot though I'm not holding much hope. Going from previous meetings, ex would usually have ds for a day this weekend. Obviously nothing is set in stone as I haven't been able to get to that point with ex but it would be this weekend.

I'm not going to ask for contact, I'll see is he gets in touch though it is Thursday so looking unlikely.

Once we are back at school (Monday) and back in routine and ds has resumed his well being sessions and appointments through social services, I'll mention it. I'll also speak to school and our social worker and ask their thoughts on it too.

I asked because I didn't want to make a harsh decision without thinking it through properly. I certainly didn't want to blurt it out to ds without thinking of any consequences.

Messages don't have to be passed on straight away just because my ex has told me to do something.

Honestly if I did just go and tell ds then that's not good for me either. I need to break the control he has over me.

My actual first instinct is to always tell ds straight away because I was so used to doing as I was told. That needs to end also.

I know ds comes first here and I hope that my post does show that I prioritise my son. However I need to learn how to do this whilst also protecting myself too. I still have a hell of a lot of trauma to get over .

It's really sad that he'd rather financially support and spend time with a new girlfriend's children than his own children. And he's planning on moving in after only knowing those children for 6 weeks?? I don't think you should talk to your ex until he's agreed on CMS. He doesn't deserve updates on his son. I wouldn't put any updates or pics of your son on social media either.

@CoffeeBean5 as I say this is only my suspicion. When he left me, he moved straight to his mums but myself and the new girlfriend crossed over. We live in a small town where everyone knows each other. I've heard that he stays with her every night and he is full on spreading this new relationship all over social media. But the majority of people think he's pathetic - he's had that many girlfriends now it's ridiculous. Hes had at least 4 names tattooed on his arms. He's 42. He says she's the love of this life apparently but all his mates remember how many times he's said this before. A few of his mates check in on me and how I am and tell me how much better off we are without him. I feel like a huge idiot....but love bombing is a real thing!

When we met, he moved in pretty much straight away - clever how he did it. He did loads of jobs on my house that needed doing, would come straight afrrr work etc etc...before I knew it he was staying every night. But naively I thought this was amazing as he seemed so helpful.

No one falls in love quicker than a narcissist with no where to live. I realise that now.

I have him blocked on all social media and everything else.

He also has an older daughter who I am still very close too. I see her every week and she still a huge part of our lives. I think it's important for ds to still see her and she's an amazing big sister to him (she's 19). But we don't talk about her dad at all now. He just doesn't get mentioned. She's had major issues with him in the past also. She loves him but she knows what he's like.

Wow - sounds like a keeper 😕

@March2024baby it's just my suspicion like I say. I will never understand why he wants to punish me (and his previous ex's) so much. He literally destroys people then hates them when they walk away.