Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

She used to fox hunt?!

274 replies

Boxingdayhunts · 26/12/2023 22:29

name change urgh

long story short - over Xmas got talking about newspiece about Boxing Day ‘trail hunts’. Got shock of my life when family member (married in not blood) revealed she had on occasion when younger joined hunts. actual fox hunts.

this is something I feel strongly about. I would never have thought this about her.

aibu to feel shocked, disappointed, and look a little differently at her now?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 19:34

I cannot imagine a terrified fox being dug out by terriermen thinks its a quick way to go and the best option.

FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 19:36

Whenever I have had a fox kill my chickens ( and this has happened more than once over 2/3 decades of chicken keeping) the chickens have always been taken away as food.

liveforsummer · 27/12/2023 19:40

FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 19:36

Whenever I have had a fox kill my chickens ( and this has happened more than once over 2/3 decades of chicken keeping) the chickens have always been taken away as food.

We used to keep a few ducks and geese. The foxes got them all eventually- in the middle of the day as they were safely locked up at night. Even the fierce gander. The fox didn't take any of them

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 19:49

TheSnowyOwl · 27/12/2023 19:24

They probably get it from people who have chickens and have to shut them away at night or come out in the morning to find them all killed but none of them taken away to be eaten. The chickens aren’t a threat to a fox.

Exactly my neighbour lost 20+ chickens in a single night 3 times to foxes.
Its just what foxes do.
As I said above all farmers tolerate some loss of their stock it’s inevitable but with such tight margins when the losses become to high most farmers will take action to stop it. You can shoot them and hope to get a clean shot gas them set snares (illegal) hunt them with hounds there is no perfect or completely reliable painless method of reducing the numbers.
Farmers are not sentimental about animals they kill rabbits rats mice foxes moles and some birds. Farming is difficult enough without loosing stock/crops unnecessarily to foxes etc.
I doubt many on here get so excited about the necessary poisoning/trapping of rats and any suffering they may experience which are are highly intelligent animals.

FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 19:52

Absolutely against poisoning rats because of secondary poisoning of predators such as owls.

Lzzyisgod · 27/12/2023 19:52

Just an opening post from the OP?

The phrase "fox amongst the chickens" springs to mind!!!!

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 19:56

@DewHopper “No foxes do not kill for fun - that is reserved for human beings.”
You’ve obviously never seen a cat torment a mouse/baby rabbit before it finally dies on fear.
My neighbours who lost 20 + chickens to the fox found all the corpses in the shed I don’t think foxes do it for fun in the sense that humans would describe it it’s a natural instinct just like the cat tormenting the mouse or rabbit. Nature is not kind or sentimental.

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 20:01

FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 19:52

Absolutely against poisoning rats because of secondary poisoning of predators such as owls.

But no concern for the rat? Don’t you think rats suffer? Do you think it’s fine to break their backs in a trap. Or because they are associated with disease and are seen as vermin and are not cute and fluffy or romanticised they don’t matter.

Newchapterbeckons · 27/12/2023 20:08

I would judge her if she still hunts or has done so as a free thinking adult, absolutely.

It’s absolutely repulsive.

bakewellbride · 27/12/2023 20:10

God this thread has descended. All the vegans being horrible almost make me feel ashamed to be vegan myself, I just don't understand the rudeness.

Livelovebehappy · 27/12/2023 20:19

It would absolutely make me look at her differently, and step back from her. If someone lacks respect for animals, it’s not something that can be switched on and off. I’d still be civil with her, but wouldn’t want to develop any other relationship or friendship beyond that.

Livelovebehappy · 27/12/2023 20:24

And hate it when people use as an excuse ‘well foxes kill livestock, and do it for fun’. Because of course fox hunters hunt down foxes for this very reason, to help the poor farmers protect their chickens….🙄

FindingMeno · 27/12/2023 20:25

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 20:01

But no concern for the rat? Don’t you think rats suffer? Do you think it’s fine to break their backs in a trap. Or because they are associated with disease and are seen as vermin and are not cute and fluffy or romanticised they don’t matter.

Show quote history

I do have concern for the rat but trying to appeal to those that don't.
I would never use poison or kill traps. It's beyond cruel.

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 20:28

You may be interested to know that independent research by Oxford University found that average time between being found by the hounds and the fox being killed is 17 minutes. In contrast my husband had a deer at work that had been hit by a car and critically injured. Pre BSE and the ban on hunting foxes the huntsman would come out and dispatch these animals and take dead fallen stock away and feed it to the hounds but despite calling the local vets the RSPCA and other animal charities no one was remotely interested. All advised him to find someone to come out and shoot it, the local shoot couldn’t send someone for 4 hours. Eventually someone was found but the poor animal was suffering for quite a few hours.

Newchapterbeckons · 27/12/2023 20:33

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 20:28

You may be interested to know that independent research by Oxford University found that average time between being found by the hounds and the fox being killed is 17 minutes. In contrast my husband had a deer at work that had been hit by a car and critically injured. Pre BSE and the ban on hunting foxes the huntsman would come out and dispatch these animals and take dead fallen stock away and feed it to the hounds but despite calling the local vets the RSPCA and other animal charities no one was remotely interested. All advised him to find someone to come out and shoot it, the local shoot couldn’t send someone for 4 hours. Eventually someone was found but the poor animal was suffering for quite a few hours.

An animal being injured or killed accidentally is hardly comparable to a planned blood sport where animals are mauled and killed for ‘fun’ and ‘giggles’

NosnowontheScottishhills · 27/12/2023 20:40

@FindingMeno “I do have concern for the rat but trying to appeal to those that don't.
I would never use poison or kill traps. It's beyond cruel.”
However careful farmers are rats not only eat valuable crops like barley and of course vegetables etc they also contaminate it with their faeces urine and hair and they multiple at a phenomenal rate. Even the big arable boys are struggling with increasing costs and our incessant desire to buy cheap food. If we want more humane farming it will come at a significant cost to our bank balances which I suspect most people will not tolerate.

Lilibert456 · 27/12/2023 20:41

For me it was the hard ride across country, not the kill, which did not always happen.

Newchapterbeckons · 27/12/2023 20:43

Lilibert456 · 27/12/2023 20:41

For me it was the hard ride across country, not the kill, which did not always happen.

Why couldn’t you have enjoyed doing that without using a poor defenceless animal as bait? A ‘hard ride’ is possible at anytime.

YouTookMyUsername · 27/12/2023 20:43

Harkthehypocritesdosing · 27/12/2023 18:48

Just sitting here sniggering at all the 'meat is humane' responses.

I'm vegan. Objectively both eating meat and hunting are cruel.

However, I've a lot more time for the farming community, who understand what farm animals go through and just extend their animal cruelty to protect their livelihood, than those who insist eating meat is lovely and humane and hunting cruel. Hunting is really just an outward expression of humans feelings that animals are there to do whatever they want with, and at least it's more honest than hiding behind 'humane' and 'i only eat organic' (1% of UK meat is organic but no one ever admits to eating anything but. The numbers don't add up)

All I can say op and others, now you know how it feels to be a vegan at Christmas lunch and the next time you accuse one of being preachy I want you to take a long hard look at yourself. I know you won't because bacon is more important to you than an intelligent beings life being taken, but then that's where it is no different than the hunt.

Absolute hypocrites.

This is why nobody listens to vegans. Do oh even care about animals at this point, or just being right?

You realise that there are ways to ethically eat meat but no ethical way for bloodthirsty idiots to to kill animals for fun, right?

Harkthehypocritesdosing · 27/12/2023 20:49

There is no ethical way to kill a sentient being that doesn't want to die.
It's the truth.
That you don't want to hear it ain't my problem.

YouTookMyUsername · 27/12/2023 20:56

It's not my problem, you're the one who takes issue with it, not me.

Harkthehypocritesdosing · 27/12/2023 20:57

Ok carnist.

Confrontayshunme · 27/12/2023 21:00

I was brought up hunting with dogs. Now I am an anti-gun vegan, so I wouldn't judge people based entirely on a throwaway comment in conversation.

Twoshoesnewshoes · 27/12/2023 22:13

I eat dairy sometimes, and eggs too.
I accept that there is no ethical way to raise or kill animals for meat. I was brought up in the farming community and have seen a journey to a plate.
and because of this I would not judge or criticize someone who hunts foxes. They are hurting and killing animals for their own pleasure- sport. We are hurting and killing animals for our own pleasure- food. Neither are necessary and both are unethical.

Grammarnut · 27/12/2023 22:14

SoundTheSirens · 27/12/2023 16:05

Foxes don't kill "for fun". They do kill more than just what is needed to satiate their (and their cubs', where appropriate) immediate hunger because they have a different prey drive to most predators. Their 'stalk-chase-kill' impulse doesn't shut off after the first 'kill', so they are driven to repeat the cycle until there is no prey left nearby. That's what makes them so dangerous in a hen run or a field of lambs; they don't have the 'off' switch that essentially says "that's enough to fill you up" that most other predators have. That's why many farmers want them controlled, because of the amount of damage a single fox can do to small livestock. But the fox is driven by instinct, not a sense of "fun" or similar.

So what do you suggest farmers do? Presumably humane killing. But fox hunting is the most humane, because the alternatives, shooting and gassing either result in a slow and horrible death (shooting) or killing everything in the den/warren/set because rabbits, badgers and foxes share the same tunnels. Ideas, please.