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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Family and petrol money

105 replies

Monkey987 · 20/12/2023 22:30

Aibu to charge my family petrol money to visit another family member a 420 mile round trip drive away? They don't drive.

The train ticket would be £120 each return and would take over 5 hours whereas driving would take 4 hours and they would be picked up at their doors and dropped off at their doors.

I've worked out petrol would cost about £60 so was going to tell them it was £30 each to cover my costs. They don't drive so don't understand cars and petrol. But also don't understand that mileage costs me repairs and depreciation on my newish car.

Im not someone that ever asked for petrol money when I had an old car but now I have a new car where mileage matters and loses my car value it's made me think more.

What do you think? Should I ask them for £30 each. Is that fair? What would you do?

OP posts:
ilovesooty · 21/12/2023 09:19

user1477391263 · 21/12/2023 04:45

"Unfortunately, petrol prices keep going up and up, so giving people big lifts is getting quite hard. Would it be OK for us to split the cost of the petrol between us, going forward?"

(I've no idea if petrol is going up in the UK or not, but if the person is clueless about cars they won't know this).

I wouldn't even ask if it's OK. I'd say what the cost has to be if the trip is going to happen. These people sound like piss takers.

JustOneMoreBaileys · 21/12/2023 09:40

I wouldn't charge depreciation - though I totally get that this is a 'hidden cost' to car owners.

Personally, I also wouldn't charge for this trip specifically as this seems like a long running pattern. So I'd use this to break the pattern for the future. Once the trip is done and before another is arranged, I would tallk about how the cost of petrol for that trip was mad and that, in future, if they needed lifts for anything over a few miles, they will need to cover the petrol costs.

Mostly it's just personal preference but I always like to warn people about an upcoming change when there isn't the flash point of a current plan.

Feelinadequate23 · 21/12/2023 09:43

I think if you had been going anyway and they asked for a lift then it would be mean to charge. But as they've arranged this whole thing on the expectation you would drive and you wouldn't have to make the trip otherwise then I think it's ok to charge. It's not just the cost of petrol etc, it's your time and energy. A four hour drive is tough if you're not used to it.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:10

Mostly it's just personal preference but I always like to warn people about an upcoming change when there isn't the flash point of a current plan.

The family members don't seem to have done OP the same courtesy of warning her in advance, before deciding that she would drive them 420 miles - as Jim Bowen would have clarified, it sounds like it was telling her, not asking her, that the journey was happening. They're the ones who've created this current flash point!

MrsSkylerWhite · 21/12/2023 11:13

Monkey987 · Yesterday 22:58

Birdcar · Yesterday 22:48

Your mum and your auntie (I'm assuming elderly but perhaps not) want to visit a family member at Christmas and you want to charge for driving them.

Bah humbug. Edited
**
It's not an elderly relative.
Just relatives that don't drive and assume cars run on fairy dust!

🤣
Sounds like Birdcar does too.

banjocat · 21/12/2023 11:16

If you would have been going anyway then no I wouldn't ask for money.

If you are taking time out to do it for them purely as a favour that you wouldn't otherwise be doing, then yes of course they should contribute to your costs if they are able.

banjocat · 21/12/2023 11:19

Just read the updates.

Sounds like they are asking you to do them a favour and also pay for the privilege, which seems a bit much.

I would just tell them 'happy to drive, petrol will cost X amount'. If they say they won't pay then explain you're not in a position pay for their trip, so they will have to get the train.

Daisies12 · 21/12/2023 11:22

Totally reasonable to split costs. They should have offered really

NoraLuka · 21/12/2023 11:24

I wouldn’t charge my Dad or sibling but they wouldn’t volunteer me to drive that distance without asking first. In this case I would definitely ask for petrol money, if only to get the point across that your car isn’t a flying carpet that magically gets them from A to B.

NutellaNut · 21/12/2023 11:24

Unless your mum is very elderly and thinks petrol is still “thruppence ha’penny a gallon” then, yes, it’s only fair she should chip in as it’s for her benefit! She probably doesn’t realise just how much it will cost you in real money for such a long round trip.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:27

banjocat · 21/12/2023 11:16

If you would have been going anyway then no I wouldn't ask for money.

If you are taking time out to do it for them purely as a favour that you wouldn't otherwise be doing, then yes of course they should contribute to your costs if they are able.

The favour is in doing all the driving and letting her car be used. It's not the Price Is Right final Showcase, where every single cost and extra is included.

Supposing your friend needed to get something from a shop, but had been caught up at work, unable to get to the shop before it closes, so you offered to go and fetch it for them, as it was your day off - would you also expect to have to pay for it for them, as an expected part of the favour (not talking about paying upfront and then being repaid by friend)?

If they're 'not able to contribute' to the costs of the journey they've decided to do, they would need to re-evaluate their plans and change them to something that they can afford. This is what most people do in life: consider the costs before deciding if something is feasible for them.

LubaLuca · 21/12/2023 11:32

I wouldn't ask them for petrol money. I'd expect them to bring plenty of car sweets and not piss me off when I'm driving, maybe buy me a meal if we stopped at services.

I've run my mum up and down the country several times when she's been unable to drive herself. I know she'll always force money on me if I have to stop for petrol, so perhaps your relatives will be expecting to do that. I'm sure all of these sorts of expenses even out over the course of a lifetime anyway.

Lancasterel · 21/12/2023 11:32

If they really don’t understand cars, just say that this new one costs a lot more to run than your old one and also petrol is really pricey at the moment so…..

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:36

I also don't get how, in scenarios like this, it's always assumed that the driver has plenty of available spare funds - and is only asking for the others who are benefiting from the trip to pay towards petrol because he/she is a big mean meanie-pants.

Does nobody consider that the driver might not physically have that money spare to be able to pay the whole fuel cost for everybody's journey?

Whether a non-driver understands the specifics of petrol costs per litre/car consumption and other associated costs or not, I'm astonished that it would cross their mind to ask to be driven 420 miles and not even think to offer (preferably insist on) money towards the costs.

Any adult (unless they have serious learning difficulties or cognitive impairments) who tries to 'justify' their journey supposedly not costing anything on the grounds that 'the car already had a full tank of petrol' is an absolute user and advantage-taker.

MargotBamborough · 21/12/2023 11:41

YANBU.

I would say something like, "With the cost of living crisis money is a bit tight at the moment, is it OK with you if we split the cost of the petrol? It's still much cheaper for everyone than it would have been to take the train."

They'd have to be a real CF to say no.

If I were one of the passengers I'd probably suggest splitting the petrol two ways with the other passenger, in recognition of the fact that driving that far is tiring.

Fairyliz · 21/12/2023 11:43

I think we need a bit more information. From what you have said it seems perfectly reasonable to ask for £20 each.

However does your mum provide childcare free of charge for you three days a week, thus saving you thousands of pounds a year? Do you go around her house and have dinner three times a week?

If anything like that applies then no I wouldn’t charge.

banjocat · 21/12/2023 11:43

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:27

The favour is in doing all the driving and letting her car be used. It's not the Price Is Right final Showcase, where every single cost and extra is included.

Supposing your friend needed to get something from a shop, but had been caught up at work, unable to get to the shop before it closes, so you offered to go and fetch it for them, as it was your day off - would you also expect to have to pay for it for them, as an expected part of the favour (not talking about paying upfront and then being repaid by friend)?

If they're 'not able to contribute' to the costs of the journey they've decided to do, they would need to re-evaluate their plans and change them to something that they can afford. This is what most people do in life: consider the costs before deciding if something is feasible for them.

Show quote history

I think you've misunderstood my post because that is basically what I am saying.

If it's a favour that OP wouldn't otherwise be doing then of course they should contribute to the cost.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:44

I've run my mum up and down the country several times when she's been unable to drive herself. I know she'll always force money on me if I have to stop for petrol, so perhaps your relatives will be expecting to do that. I'm sure all of these sorts of expenses even out over the course of a lifetime anyway.

Maybe that's a necessary action then, if driving non-drivers who are (or act) oblivious to the costs: rather than saving time by sensibly filling up the evening before a long journey, deliberately avoid doing so and factor in extra time to need to buy fuel soon after the journey has begun.

As for the second point, I know both kinds of non-drivers: those who ask for a lift from time to time but who will also give generously of their own time and strengths/abilities/resources, which evens it all in the end; and also those who regularly ask for lifts but never dream of repaying the favour to you with something that they can easily do.

Goingsunny · 21/12/2023 11:47

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 21/12/2023 06:16

It's not your fault, you shouldn't have to ask. It's time to draw some boundaries around lifts. Including that they ask not assume and saying no when it doesn't work for you. Yout time is valuable to you too and it's not ok for them to assume you'll take 2 days out of your life and drive hundreds of miles just to chauffeur them. Them paying petrol is the least they should be doing in return.

Edited
Show quote history

I agree with this . Do you actually even want to go OP? You sound a bit passive in all this . They should never be making any assumptions about such a long journey, it's fine to ask for petrol money but I think you need to address the way they are volunteering your time as if you have no life or free will of your own.

MereDintofPandiculation · 21/12/2023 11:48

If you want a yardstick. the HMRC approved rate is 45p a mile (which would work out at £189). This is what I get paid for traveling to my volunteer work. It's supposed to cover fuel and wear and tear, but not, I think, depreciation.

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:50

banjocat · 21/12/2023 11:43

I think you've misunderstood my post because that is basically what I am saying.

If it's a favour that OP wouldn't otherwise be doing then of course they should contribute to the cost.

Show quote history

Fair enough, but it was what you said about "they should contribute to your costs if they are able" that I was picking up on.

I'd also slightly quibble the wording of 'your costs' (meaning the OP's): they are their own costs, which they are incurring from the outset (regardless of who physically handles the transactions) by deciding to make the journey.

snowlady4 · 21/12/2023 11:53

Are you going anyway, regardless of whether they go?
If you're only going to drive them, then I'd ask for money. .if you were going anyway and they are just coming in your car, definitely wouldn't ask for money as it's just a lift and having them there won't cost you anything.

Darker · 21/12/2023 11:54

Will you have stop-offs to eat, grab a coffee? Would they pick up the tab for that?

FatherJackHackettsUnderpantsHamper · 21/12/2023 11:54

MereDintofPandiculation · 21/12/2023 11:48

If you want a yardstick. the HMRC approved rate is 45p a mile (which would work out at £189). This is what I get paid for traveling to my volunteer work. It's supposed to cover fuel and wear and tear, but not, I think, depreciation.

I think it IS supposed to cover depreciation (which is partly why you don't get that rate if you are using a company-supplied vehicle); but it's set much too low to actually cover that anymore.

Accountants are very big on (at least theoretically) allowing for depreciation in their calculations.

HalliwellManor · 21/12/2023 12:06

Yes,absolutely ask them to cover the cost!,recently my mom had a knee replacement in a hospital 70 miles away and for every appointment she covered my fuel because I'm on a low income and can't afford to lose the money I'd use to put petrol in to do a 140mile round trip.
Any other local appointments I take her to I refuse fuel money but for long journeys she always covers it.
If the shoe were on the other foot I'd always cover the drivers fuel costs,especially with how expensive it is nowadays.
I think your mom and sibling have got a bloody nerve expecting you to drive AND pay for the petrol on such a long and expensive journey.