Scouts is (or always was!) an incredibly middle class activity

[Greatballzoffire]

Just that. Our local one is full of very wealthy families, waiting list are years long & the children that could probably do with & afford scouts can't get in the door.
I always associated scouts as an inexpensive activity that all children can access. Ours seem to be predominantly full of middle class families who travel from other areas to our scout unit.

I live in a (what is described as deprived) inner city area and Beavers is definitely NOT like that. For me it’s the only activity I can really afford. £30 for a term as opposed to £13 a class for one activity I was quoted! There was a wait list just because it’s volunteer led and they have to restrict numbers. I don’t have a car so I have to go to the nearest one but maybe if I could afford a car, I would travel to one a bit further away where his friend goes, who knows. Luckily it’s just a 5 min walk.

You can’t base the whole of scouts on your one experience, surely you know that. It’s quite a well known movement so I can imagine it would attract people from all walks of life. If you live in an area where people have to drive/ travel further to get to a scout group it might change the dynamic slightly.

Ds goes to a very diverse group, but we are fortunate in that there is no waiting list even for Beavers as there are so many groups across my area. So all the children who are interested are able to join. He is now a Scout and I would guess the kids come from more affluent families, but I think this is due to an appreciation of the value of the group and parents continuing to encourage after school activities. Other friends have not been interested once they move to secondary school. DD is at Guides and I would say it’s a similar sort of demographic.
If the groups have long waiting lists, parents may offer to become leaders which gets their kids up the list, maybe those are more likely to be middle class? I don’t know. I’m just glad of any parent who comes forward to volunteer no matter who they are.

Our group is a mixed bag (leaders and young people) - perhaps 2/3 middle class as it's in a posh bit of London adjacent to a much less posh bit.

We have an enormous waiting list but prioritise looked after children and we offer subsidised subs and events for families who struggle. We also prioritise children with parents who are willing to volunteer.

Have you considered helping? The more volunteers, the more groups can operate and the more young people benefit. I've been a leader ever since my eldest turned 4 and joined Squirrels.

I was a Scout leader ( became a volunteer then leader so my kids could go) and both my kids went right through to 18. Defo not middle class, poor as church mice.

Not the case here either, and I'm in the height of gammon toryville location-wise. I'm on the exec for ours, and volunteer, we have such a mix and definitely some families we've been supporting with subs for the past few terms. We have a reasonable waiting list, but it just runs in age order so it doesn't matter how early people put their names down.

Ours is accessible to everyone who doesn’t need to work fulltime, has two cars in the family and has no special needs. Absolutely not accessible for parents working fulltime (kind of understandable, but excludes a lot of children), without access to a car at short notice, or children with any sort of special needs.
Very middle -middle class.
Waiting list is 2-3 years.

In my area it's for all children and is therefore priced so low.

Definitely not. In a middle class area you'll get middle class scouts and so on but it is available for all and it cheap in comparison with other activities. Run by volunteers too.

Not where I live, but I guess invite the only group in the area it is bound to he oversubscribed. The answer is for people to volunteer to run a different troupe, but people don't seem to want to do that. We have loads of packs where we live. It is, as you say, a brilliant activity for kids, done cheaply. My DS has been doing it since Beavers, and is now a Young Leader and helps out the Cubs. Should he not have done it because he comes from a ' middle class family?

Not in my region. Yes there are some middle class groups but the majority are in working class areas including areas of significant deprivation.

Our group has a real mixture of kids from diverse backgrounds and we work really hard to make it as inclusive as possible and to ensure that money is not a barrier to activities.

I am not middle class, absolutely far far FAR from it and I did Brownies/Scouts etc so YABU.

I didn't think such a simple, affordable activity would be as attractive to the middle classes

@Greatballzoffire are you serious?

I grew up on the estate in my hometown where you moved when you became new money - so you can show everyone else who never moved away that you 'made it'. Middle class doesn't exist there.

None of them went to Brownies with me. Those girls did Freestyle Disco dancing.

The girls most active in my Brownies group weren't from poverty, but they were FAR from middle class. The actual middle class girls I began to meet later in life had hobbies and extra curriculars I could only dream of.

Absolutely not here. I guess you just live in a very MC area.

There are a number of things which can work to exclude and include people - even unintentionally and Scouting/Guiding is no different.

• on the basis of price, most people could afford the subs. It is one of the cheapest weekly activities available and costs less than £3 per week. For some that will be a stretch, but the majority if families could afford that. Most activities within it are also subsidised and as run by volunteers will be cheaper than doing similar activities through school or another provider. Fund raising often happens to cover the majority if cost if things like jamborees for older ones. However, even limited costs will be a barrier for some or the oerceotion that there might be more costs will be a barrier. I think they work hard to try to ensure costs dint exclude people and will waive fees where there is hardship.
• People/parents tend to send their kids to activities where they perceive similar families will be. In some areas, Scouting has mostly middle class families. This can be because waiting lists are long and middle class families are more geared up to planning extra curricular activities years ahead and it becomes self-perpetuating. In some areas where waiting lists are very long, parents who volunteer to help get their kids prioritised. (I don’t have a problem with this - these groups are often closing down due to a lack of volunteers. If this approach draws in volunteers and keeps groups going, it benefits many young people and not just the volunteers’ kids. Without this, many groups would close). When volunteers have kids in the group, groups can feel a bit different to when groups are not run by parents. Perhaps families if a similar type join and it self perpetuates. Often middle class families have more time and possibly inclination and confidence to volunteer.
• This said, lots of groups are solidly working class although often at least some of the leaders are not. Lots of groups are connected to Churches or other community groups and run with a specific purpose to help provide activities in working class areas. A real focus on making everything accessible and feel welcoming to all people can be the emphasis. Again it’s self perpetuating and if the group is popular with families in these areas, it will often continue to be as families send their younger siblings and locals hear about the groups or have find memories of them.

People often don’t realise how unwitting things can act as barriers. Lots of middle class families with children who go to the more affluent area school at the door waiting to do pick-up and loudly talking about their holiday plans, future school plans, other extra curriculars might make it daunting to families who feeel they don’t fit. Some groups might run more activities which reflect some kind of class norms and put people off or help people feel more comfortable. I’d say most groups try really hard to be inclusive in terms if activities offered and consideration of orice and creation of an inclusive culture, but it’s less easy to influence who gets the places and if parents (and kids themselves) are welcoming and inclusive or not.

For many middle class families, Scouting is one in a string of extra-curriculars. It might be that working class families are generally doing fewer things or different things, and if there is very much the sense at the sCouts that everyone else does lots of other stuff on other evenings, that could be a barrier.

I actually think Scouting and Guiding are aware if this and do a lot to make it accessible to all, but there are limits to what they as an organisation can do.

It would be interesting to know how you are defining the social class of the children. What makes you think you son is the only WC child there? I normally read on mumsnet what the MC think the WC are like. Your son can't be that much different.

I took my daughter to swimming lessons in a very wealthy area. It was the only place I could get her in. She seemed like every other child there (at 5 anyway). Parents careers and flexibility along with the other activities their children did made me aware we was different though.

@Thelaundryfairyhasbeenassassinated more from the parents careers, most families have two parents working (one may be part time), schools maybe 6 go to private school possibly 7, 4x4s, the other children do lots of activities

Not all the middle class are wealthy. I am very very working class but live in an affluent area where the majority would be classed as middle class. Many of them from taking to them, getting to know them through my job are struggling.
The desire to keep up with the Jones, wage stagnation and desire to actually live here has meant that a lot are struggling. 20 years ago it would be shown by the cars people drive. With the rise of leasing they can hide the fact more.

Interesting. Couldn’t get my DD into rainbows and I wanted her to do it because it’s a nice way of making friends and trying activities. I could afford a more expensive hobby and don’t want to take away from those who can’t but is there anything similar?!

Honestly it depends on the troop not Scouts as such.

Across our district there is a really broad mix of working class and middle class.

In terms of getting a place, we have a waiting list - but you can skip the waiting list if you are prepared to get stuck in and be a leader.

I've been involved in Scouting/ Guiding in the past and got a lot out of it. My sister is still involved. It's for everyone and I know leaders from a mix of backgrounds (my sisters team includes someone working on the supermarket checkout, a fireman and a barrister).

Getting volunteers is, however, a real issue these days. You just have to read the threads on here from parents complaining that the Brownie unit they drop and run at doesn't have the most amazing exciting programme.

And when people suggest that if the poster wants it to change a million different excuses are given about why they have no time to help (but they do to moan on an national forum).

I live in a deprived area so no, there are not loads of wealthy families waiting to get on the lists round here

The one my son goes to was very mixed when it was Beavers but since he's moved I into Cubs it's very middle class. I have no idea what class we are but my husband says he doesn't have much in common with the other dads who go. He's always volunteering to help out though and we are active and involved parents.

Someone mentioned wc parents being put off or made to feel left out by the conversations other parents are having. Our cubs group is always running over the time so the parents have quite a while to talk in the waiting area.

My husband said the talk is often about where they're going skiing this year, wild swimming, that sort of thing. So he makes a judgement that they aren't like us. He doesn't care about fitting in though. Our son loves it and that's what's important.

I guess it depends where you live, and what group you choose.
We live in a village more or less equidistant between 2 scout troops, one in a very naice middle class area that does indeed have a long waiting list and queues of parents picking up in their Range Rovers and another in town that is an area of significant social deprivation that always has spaces. My boys went to the latter and it was great. The leaders and the families involved were from very mixed backgrounds and I think it was good for everyone that they got to know each other. Our troop didn't have such expensive trips away but other than that I couldn't see any real difference in what my boys did at their troop and what one of my colleagues' children did at the posh one. It made me sad that there were parents in our area who preferred to let their children sit on a waiting list for ages rather than join the group in the less desirable postcode.
I guess we'd be considered middle class now, and my DH has always been so, but I am from a definitely working class background and my grandad and dad were both Scout leaders, my sister was a Cub Scout leader until recently and I was a Brownie, Guide and Young Leader growing up. There was nothing middle class about the groups any of my family were involved in.