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Original poster

Are you happy for the government to automatically have the ability to have a look at your bank account?

350 replies

LeRougeEtLeNoir · 04/12/2023 19:37

So the government wants (and very likely will get) the ability to look at the bank account of anyone receiving

  • UC
  • a pension
  • child benefit
  • PIP etc…
How comfortable are you to see them been able to do that? Even though a pension or child benefit isn’t income related so there is no fraud to tackle. And they won’t tell you about it either. I mean that’s about every single one of us there.

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/new-legislation-gives-government-permission-to-snoop-on-your-bank-account-364408/?fbclid=IwAR3XA89weQHzsIEN7A2TSigPcWM183fGKTkH7ByaainNVTcgeR8e0RXAr24

New legislation gives government permission to snoop on your bank account

A clause in the Data Protection and Digital Information Bill hands the DWP power to inspect the bank accounts.

https://www.thelondoneconomic.com/politics/new-legislation-gives-government-permission-to-snoop-on-your-bank-account-364408/?fbclid=IwAR3XA89weQHzsIEN7A2TSigPcWM183fGKTkH7ByaainNVTcgeR8e0RXAr24

OP posts:
Ascubudr · 05/12/2023 04:33

ANightingale · 04/12/2023 20:04

I don't receive anything from the state. However, I have nothing to hide - the government can look at my boring list of direct debits for bills and supermarket shops if it wants to.

This plus the once weekly costa ( which I try to get as part of meal deal). I earn 6 figures too.

User136921 · 05/12/2023 06:21

Maybe it will stop people claiming child benefit or State pension if they don't like it, there is always that choice, I never claimed JSA when I was made redundant a couple of times as it was too much hassle and would have took up more time than it was worth. No need for them to check your bank account then.

TrashedSofa · 05/12/2023 07:40

User136921 · 05/12/2023 06:21

Maybe it will stop people claiming child benefit or State pension if they don't like it, there is always that choice, I never claimed JSA when I was made redundant a couple of times as it was too much hassle and would have took up more time than it was worth. No need for them to check your bank account then.

Always that choice? You can't possibly think every pensioner could opt to manage without the state pension, for example?

ismu · 05/12/2023 08:46

Interestingly, I'm sure that many EXTREMELY wealthy people and also MPs are advised by their accountants to claim Child Benefit and State Pension, for tax purposes or to make contributions to NI at no or low cost( sure someone on here will be able to confirm this)
This opens them to bank account checks. I wonder if it's been thought through!

Wellhellooooodear · 05/12/2023 08:47

I couldn't care less, they'll be most unimpressed if the look at mine

Tanktanktank · 05/12/2023 08:50

I’m following with interest.

is this something new?

whilst I totally agree with being able to sniff out fraudsters and deal with them I really do feel this is a step to far.

I’m approaching my pension age, I will have worked near on fifty years by the time I get it. In that time I have worked hard, received only child benefits and paid into my own pension (not a log but I wanted a better retirement than my grandparents). I’ve already lost out on the pension age being moved and am working still.

I’ve scrimped a lot, gone without, and had a period of going hungry. During the same time I watched my toe rag cousin receiving benefits and working cash in hand and going on lots of foreign holidays.

I object to pension being called a benefit, I have pretty much all my wage slips from when I was 15, my NI contributions were my ‘saving’ for my retirement. I paid them (I am fully aware that money paid the pensions of the pensioners of the day). I doubt I’ll ever see anything back, I’m sure government pensions will be means tested by the time I retire and all my scrimping and going without will have just funded all those that didn’t give a hoot.

this country has gone to pot, I’m glad I’m the age I am.

Zebedee55 · 05/12/2023 09:01

They are not looking at it for PIP/DLA/AA, as they are not means tested, they are health based, and it’s irrelevant how much money you have.

If someone is only receiving a State pension, and private pensions, they won’t be checking. They will only check those in receipt of Pension Credit.

The checks are only for those on means tested benefits or top ups.

User136921 · 05/12/2023 09:29

NeverDropYourMooncup · 04/12/2023 20:10

Nope, all of them.

They'll have to be absolutely sure that there isn't any money squirrelled away for Christmas/bills if you find yourself needing care following a fall or stroke. After all, you might have given a grandchild a gift a couple of years ago which could be interpreted as intentional deprivation of capital.

Show quote history

Isn't that a council investigation and they do that now, and have done for years, fortunately I haven't any grandchildren to gift to.

AntonFeckoff · 05/12/2023 09:41

User136921 · 05/12/2023 06:21

Maybe it will stop people claiming child benefit or State pension if they don't like it, there is always that choice, I never claimed JSA when I was made redundant a couple of times as it was too much hassle and would have took up more time than it was worth. No need for them to check your bank account then.

Well done you, being in a position to afford not to claim a benefit. How very impressive and clever you are. If only others could be oh so wise.

stepintochristmas1 · 05/12/2023 10:38

It seems this government are so focused on taking our privacy and freedoms away . Already we need approved id for voting ,new laws about our right to protest ( Sarah Everard protest) and now want to have the right to rummage through our bank acc . Just where are they going to stop ?

MrsDanversGlidesAgain · 05/12/2023 10:50

StarDolphins · 04/12/2023 20:33

Do you know how this information will be used in the future?

Show quote history

No, and that's the problem. You have no idea how this could be used in five, ten, fifteen years time.

And to all the people saying 'I've nothing to hide' - do you get to define 'nothing'? do you know who gets to define 'nothing'? no, you don't. 'Nothing' in five, ten, fifteen years time could be voting the wrong way. Reading the wrong books. Following the wrong politician on FB. Have a look at the Chinese social credit system if you really think 'nothing to hide' will protect you.

justaboutdonenow · 05/12/2023 10:55

User136921 · 05/12/2023 06:21

Maybe it will stop people claiming child benefit or State pension if they don't like it, there is always that choice, I never claimed JSA when I was made redundant a couple of times as it was too much hassle and would have took up more time than it was worth. No need for them to check your bank account then.

Good for you, when my OH first became too sick to work neither did we, because we were lucky enough to have savings to fall back on.

A lot of other people aren't so lucky, because when you live paycheck to paycheck it's nigh on impossible to save, so when you lose your job, you have nothing to fall back on.

EmmaEmerald · 05/12/2023 12:06

@Sisterpita "Banks and financial institutions already report savings interest to HMRC."

I thought they stopped doing that and you had to put it on tax return, if self employed? Don't know what happens to salaried staff?

I'm against it, for all the reasons given. But I think benefit claimants will be heavily scrutinised, that's my biggest issue.

EmmaEmerald · 05/12/2023 12:08

Tanktanktank · 05/12/2023 08:50

I’m following with interest.

is this something new?

whilst I totally agree with being able to sniff out fraudsters and deal with them I really do feel this is a step to far.

I’m approaching my pension age, I will have worked near on fifty years by the time I get it. In that time I have worked hard, received only child benefits and paid into my own pension (not a log but I wanted a better retirement than my grandparents). I’ve already lost out on the pension age being moved and am working still.

I’ve scrimped a lot, gone without, and had a period of going hungry. During the same time I watched my toe rag cousin receiving benefits and working cash in hand and going on lots of foreign holidays.

I object to pension being called a benefit, I have pretty much all my wage slips from when I was 15, my NI contributions were my ‘saving’ for my retirement. I paid them (I am fully aware that money paid the pensions of the pensioners of the day). I doubt I’ll ever see anything back, I’m sure government pensions will be means tested by the time I retire and all my scrimping and going without will have just funded all those that didn’t give a hoot.

this country has gone to pot, I’m glad I’m the age I am.

Agree! I assume there will be no state pension by the time I get there and have thought this for ages.

randomuser2020 · 05/12/2023 12:14

This reply has been withdrawn

Removed at poster's request due to privacy concerns.

Neitheronethingnortheother · 05/12/2023 12:36

Given the massive impact of the horizon software issues on the post office staff and the fact the post office could bypass the cps and no one has really been held accountable I'm not happy about departments using technology that can fuck up peoples lives without being held accountable for their own errors

ffsrainagain · 05/12/2023 12:53

Alternative to the government being able to look at and track what we are all spending.... we all go back to cash! Obviously mortgages etc will have to be direct debit but anything else pay in cash. I already do this as much as possible and intend to do more. As in cut down my use of online shopping, even for supermarkets etc and Amazon and go to town and buy my goods in cash! No tracking what you have spent where then. And don't use things like a club card which also tracks what you buy, where, and how much for. Stick to budget supermarkets or pay full price for goods in tesco. Enough people take that stance they will have to give up

EmmaEmerald · 05/12/2023 13:00

ffsrainagain · 05/12/2023 12:53

Alternative to the government being able to look at and track what we are all spending.... we all go back to cash! Obviously mortgages etc will have to be direct debit but anything else pay in cash. I already do this as much as possible and intend to do more. As in cut down my use of online shopping, even for supermarkets etc and Amazon and go to town and buy my goods in cash! No tracking what you have spent where then. And don't use things like a club card which also tracks what you buy, where, and how much for. Stick to budget supermarkets or pay full price for goods in tesco. Enough people take that stance they will have to give up

I said this in 2020 and everyone thought I was nuts.

Ironically, I'm getting to the point I might get a store card (moved and no longer have walking distance Aldi).

Plus, no one seems to care that we are walking into a social credit system so I feel outnumbered. Fewer people think I'm crazy now though - but I have to resist the urge to yell "don't say I didn't warn yaaaaaa" (while picturing the guy in the TS video spitting out his poisoned apple)

MistressoftheDarkSide · 05/12/2023 13:00

@Neitheronethingnortheother

I nearly brought that up last night but thought I'd gone far enough with my ramblings, so thank you for pointing it out.

The Post Office scandal beggars belief.

How on earth would anyone fight a system that might royally screw up in the UK now?

All it would take would for your bank activity to be altered digitally and there would be no recourse. This is what people don't see.

One can quote the "don't attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence" (sic) but after the way our government behaved throughout the pandemic, assisting in facilitating the biggest wealth transfer globally pretty much ever seen to those in charge, I have lost all confidence in the presumed benevolence of state interference.

There is a worldwide agenda at play. It's a long con but technology is helping speed it up. Our "freedom" may always have been something of an illusion, but before long we will be completely at the mercy of the state in lockstep with tech billionaires. And it won't be neutral, it will be designed to fit the ideologies of people completely out of touch with reality.

Like a PP I'm glad I've probably only got a decade or two if we go by the biblical metric before I shuffle off the mortal coil. It's the kids I feel for.

cannaecookrisotto · 05/12/2023 13:09

Realistically, they're not going to be monitoring what people are spending their money on, I think it's to see if benefits are being diverted out of the country (sent to other countries etc).

And being alerted to hidden incomes that would make people not eligible for benefits.

I'm not in receipt of any benefits (not even child benefit), but if I was I'd probably object. It would feel intrusive to me even though I'd have nothing to hide.

EmmaEmerald · 05/12/2023 13:09

@MistressoftheDarkSide Indeed.

I think in Elementary, Sherlock also said "never assume incompetence instead of outright malice" which is a fair point.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 05/12/2023 13:16

cannaecookrisotto · 05/12/2023 13:09

Realistically, they're not going to be monitoring what people are spending their money on, I think it's to see if benefits are being diverted out of the country (sent to other countries etc).

And being alerted to hidden incomes that would make people not eligible for benefits.

I'm not in receipt of any benefits (not even child benefit), but if I was I'd probably object. It would feel intrusive to me even though I'd have nothing to hide.

Oh, I don't know - the ability to drill right down into exactly what people of x age, location, precise income level, distance from y, etc, to the second would be pretty valuable in a commercial context, for retail purposes and for political ones.

I work with data all the time. The scope for profit to be made from this knowledge of people's behaviour, choices, habits, movements is beyond imagination. As has been said for many years, Knowledge is Power.

It's also been said that with Great Power Comes Responsibility, but nobody's going to give that much heed when there's power and money to be made.

MistressoftheDarkSide · 05/12/2023 13:25

@EmmaEmerald

Yup also indeed. Nice to see you 🙂 I'm very intermittent here these days but a thread like this is complete catnip to me lol.

These days it's really difficult to find people willing to talk about stuff like this without the conspiracy theiry bingo card being played very quickly unfortunately. Good to see a fair few on here with an eye on the bigger picture.

As @NeverDropYourMooncup correctly asserts, the behemoth of capitalism will prioritise profit and power over all else.

It's genius really in so many ways. Create dependency on technology, then allow it to be insecure. Make more money by getting people to pay for VPNs etc, apps for everything etc etc. Hand control to AI and claim plausible deniability.It will never end.

AlwaysGinPlease · 05/12/2023 14:40

@LeRougeEtLeNoir are you broken?

My parents paid very high taxes FOR YEARS! Some people on benefits never pay a penny into the system . Oh and my father is dead but thanks for asking.

ScremeEggs · 05/12/2023 15:05

@ffsrainagain

Alternative to the government being able to look at and track what we are all spending.... we all go back to cash!

Yes, I'm definitely trying to use cash more.
I've noticed a lot of local shops have said they prefer it too, it's hopefully making a "comeback"