To Wonder Why Women put up with this?

[girlfriend44]

Reading a post on a thread about Christmas from the past on tinternet.
Someone had said the men went to the pub Xmas day and the women cooked the dinner. The men came home and ate the dinner and fell asleep.
The post had quite a few likes.
Does anyone else think that's wrong and the woman shouldn't have allowed it?
Why didn't the women go down the pub and the men cook etc?
Better still Why didn't they all make dinner together nd obody went to the pub?

Why do people have to go to the pub Xmas day anyway while dinners cooking?

Should women have made more of a stand and not allowed this?
Does this still happen today?

I think it's really rude to go down the pub Xmas day and leave people at home doing everything?

My dads side of the family do this.. the men - my grandad, dad, uncles and male cousins go the pub whilst my gran cooks dinner, women and kids eat their dinner, wash up, men come home and eat theirs.

I've never understood it, only ever had Xmas dinner with my dad once!

I grew up watching Eastenders on Christmas Day and everyone seemed to go to the pub before lunch (and all the ensuing drama) so I assumed it was the norm😭 It didn’t happen in our house, my dad doesn’t drink. DP doesn’t drink much. He is not from the U.K. and doesn’t quite get pub culture. The concept of going on Xmas would definitely confuse him.

I know older women who are stuck in this mentality. It’s a badge of honour to scivvy away for their ‘hardworking’ menfolk. Don’t feel sorry for them, women who martyr themselves like this love it. They must do.

My dad and uncle never went to the pub normally but oddly on Christmas Day they did walk down for one drink. When I was older I even went with them once. I think my mum actually wanted us all to sod off for an hour so she could set the Christmas table in peace. Our kitchen was too small to have more than two people in it at once and mum was a bit of a 1970s martyr too.

Nope

Christmas eve family visits (dad's side)
Christmas day church lunch and family teatime visit (mums side)
Boxing day family visit dad is down the pub with his brothers day after boxing day dad is back at work

I think the pub is more a Christmas Eve/boxing day tradition for most people rather than Christmas day.

I don’t think that there is enough information in that post to be offended.

For all we know the women told their husbands to bugger off down to the pub so that they can enjoy each other’s company while they cooked. And maybe they actually enjoyed cooking and didn’t want any interference.

Hard to believe, but some people actually love cooking and do not see it as a chore.

My Nanna loved cooking and being creative with food. She would carve a watermelon into a basket shape and with a melon baller cut up the melon into ball shapes. But, she also liked to do it without people trying to help and get in her way. So, she’d make the kitchen off limits.

Honestly, to an outsider looking in we would have all appeared lazy and selfish sitting around socialising while Nanna did all the cooking. But it is what she really wanted and we did try and offer help but she would shoo us out of the kitchen. Sometimes she would give us a task to do at the kitchen table but she still wanted us to stay out of the main kitchen area as she cooked.

I didn’t realise pubs are open on Christmas Day 😳.

In any case, some women thrive on this kind of thing. They’re not all downtrodden folks- well, often the only thing trodding on them is their martyrdom 🤷🏽‍♀️.

The men in my family love cooking, so we’ve often gone to church with the children Christmas morning and left them to it.

if I’m responsible for Christmas dinner, I don’t like too many cooks. I’ll cook the lot, but someone else is cleaning. And the men always clean the pots and make the various juices / punches, so there’s never an idle man around.

I think it’s a cultural and partly thing and it wouldn’t surprise me if it was linked to class and/or area. My family used to do this - working class Northern family. Christmas Day was like a Sunday - men went to the pub for a pre-Christmas day drink or two while the women focused on the meal. Then home for the roast dinner. Both my granddads would have thought the world was ending if anyone suggested they not go.

Interestingly, the arrival of grandchildren plus Covid seems to have knocked it on the head. My DDad was still doing this when DC1 was small but I bet he’s not been since Covid - neither my DB or my DBIL would suggest it and focus now is on getting the kids out from under everyone’s feet for some fresh air while the cooking happens.

Also, I think @telestrations may be onto something in terms of using the pub as an extension of your living room - that’s really interesting and not something I’d thought of before but probably very applicable to one side of my family in particular (who would go to the “social club” more evenings than not for a pint and a game of cards with friends).

That was my memories. The women had a great time, even us kids got snowballs or babycham. Christmas was simpler, neighbours would pop in and out. The turkey had to go on in the morning. The men would be shoo'd out. We wouldn't be having the variety of foods expected today, less presents, less pressure. There wasn't a choice of TV. Many left the kids with the men, or rather playing out and went to the boxing day sales. No martyrdom.

This happened in our house when I was a child, ddad was always the first one up, he veg prepped, present opening, quick clear up then off to the pub, dm cooked.
This was the usual routine on a Sunday too, dm wasn't a sahm, she worked full time.
As an adult this "tradition" carried on in my home and as the DC got older they went to the pub too.
I actually liked it, gave me a chance to cook, set the table and have a glass of fizz in peace, ring my sisters.
Then they'd all come back and help with serving, pouring drinks, washing up before dessert then the big clear up at the end.

Actually.? THATS the knowledge you have gained -EVER.?to critiscise and condemn?
how much research you do into the way things were -then.
Drunkish men,do dishes-ANYBODY can fling a dinner together.-would be the easiest road out.
DOES ANYONE else think twas wrong /woman shouldnt have allowed it?
where ya going with that. ? You doing females no favours in suggesting libertys was taken.or joint forces were likely to create a voice.It wasnt enforced.
Also not flattering is presumption this is outrageous.OR that men are\were incapable of independant thoughts and decisions.

I think a lot of people, especially men, take advantage of women's often endless capacity to nurture and care for others.

I do like to see my husband eat a meal I've cooked from scratch, but I do expect him to care for me as well. That can include cooking for me but also coming out in the cold night to change my tyre, dropping me off to work early etc.

Sorry I may have made sound like I lived through that time, I didn't. But I've seen the photos, heard the stories and the remnants of tradition in the 80/90s were still there like the snugs. I think they're all gone now though.

In fact I grew up in an ex-pub and so would often be told about what it was like, it had been a rough one and some of the stories were very unpleasant. Plenty of kids been sent in to fetch their Dads before they drank the housekeeping away. So there were certainly a less wholesome side to pub culture as well

It is possible that a group of women enjoyed this time together cooking and chatting. Whether they would do the same nowadays is a different question.

It's just the way it was. I remember my dad doing this with his dad whilst mum and grandma cooked. They didn't expect any different.

It used to happen in my house in the 80s. The men would go the pub for an hour.
Then by the 90s, when we were all teenagers, we'd all go the pub for an hour, mum included.
Then it stopped altogether in the 00's when the grandkids came along and dad was in the kitchen with mum!
Now we host Christmas day and my DH does the cooking.
If that's not the perfect example of the progress of women, I don't know what is 🤣

Interesting. Your first thought was that it was the women who were at fault?

“The past is a foreign country: they do things differently there”

For all we know the women told their husbands to bugger off down to the pub so that they can enjoy each other’s company while they cooked. And maybe they actually enjoyed cooking and didn’t want any interference

There certainly could be an element of this. DPs family had this tradition when his grandparents were alive. Family gathered at grandparents house, the men and older boys went to the pub. DC played with their presents, watched TV and ate as much chocolate as they could get away with. Women cooked at a leisurely pace, had a laugh and a few drinks and if the men were lucky, the dinner would actually be ready and not burnt when they came back. Afterwards, the men washed up.

Have you heard of the patriarchy

Exactly. It's like a post from an alien. or a journalist. And blaming women for men being lazy, drunk plonkers is a stretch.

It didn't happen when I was growing up, my parents didn't go to the pub and both did dinner. My husband does all the cooking and we all go to our local for a couple of hours.

No-one went to the pub when I was little, but they were all on the sherry/ginger wine and whisky from early doors, including those helping in the kitchen. This was my grandma, grandad, great aunt & uncle, my mum and dad, most of whom pretty much only had a drink at Christmas! Everyone helped peeling veg and washing up. They really were very Merry Christmases!

I do it this way, everyone mucking in, though I only have a drink when nearly everything is done or it may go awry! My DM (who still hardly drinks) is 84 and is still wanting whisky & ginger wine at 9.30am 😂

It didn't happen in our household but I know plenty of others where it did. Some were sent off by the women as they would keep asking when lunch would be ready, come in to the kitchen to graze and those women wanted the kitchen to themselves. I think we are also forgetting that way back women weren't allowed in pubs so I can imagine they were expected to stay and cook and look after the children.
My dad was born in 1931 and he was certainly very good with cooking, sharing chores, childcare with me etc.
I am always still amazed at the number of people who don't offer to wash up after someone has cooked for them (friends or family amd not juat christmas) . I am cooking this year and I know that after dinner a couple will be washing up the non dishwasher bits before anyone does anything else.