To think that you shouldn’t choose to rent an upstairs 2 bed flat if you have 4 noisy kids

[shatteredmama]

Just after your thoughts. We rent a ground floor flat, we expect to hear some of the usual sounds of upstairs neighbours such as footsteps, doors closing, washing machine, Hoover, the odd thud. Am absolutely fine with that.

A new couple moved into the flat upstairs, normal neighbour noises could be heard. No problem with that. Soon after they told me they had lied to our landlord and that it won’t just be the two of them, their 4 boys from the ages of 2 -11 would be coming over from their home country and living in that flat with them. Theirs is a 2 bedroom flat, no outside space, our flats are converted from 1 house. As she told me this she laughed and her exact words were oh you’ll know when they’ve arrived. Things are going to get very noisy!

Since the kids moved in the noise levels are ridiculous. Constant loud bangs, thuds, shouting, squealing, we can hear them running up and down their flat. It isn’t occasional. It’s all day every day as not all of them attend school.

I know kids make noise. On a couple of occasions I’ve knocked on and as nicely and politely as possible explained how it’s impacting us. For example when my child was crying and couldn’t go to sleep at bedtime because all the kids in the room above were jumping off the sofa onto the floor, our lampshade was swinging from the impact. At other times they’ve all been running and screeching so loud it sounds as though they are actually in our flat with us. The neighbours have then shrugged, argued back and said they’d try to keep the noise down but there’s nothing they can do.

I don’t know what we can do other than move out ourselves, but with the housing crisis the way it is, it wouldn’t be easy. I feel angry that they lied to get the tenancy and moved the family in knowing that it would disturb us and make our lives difficult.

Would any of you say I’m justified in feeling this way, any practical advice you’d give?

This is not a situation where a family has had to downsize/struggled to find a big enough property after losing their last home for whatever reason, this a couple who moved over here without being able to adequately house their family.

Their children obviously had another home in their country if they arrived 4 months after their parents. They shouldn’t have brought them over until they could afford to house them. They’re not asylum seekers, sounds like economic migrants.

The OP and her landlord should not be negatively impacted by their choices. As for telling them to go the council, why on earth should the council house them?

Inform your landlord OP in writing stating what you were told about them lying that they had no kids, the noise and that they are not interested in your requests to be quieter. There will definitely be additional wear and tear from 4 kids the landlord didn’t know about so I doubt landlord will be happy.

If they’ve been there over 6 months, landlord can probably give Section 21 notice with no reason needed.

Honestly this makes my blood boil, the stupidity of this putting 4 children in a flat above others is disgusting. My only advise to you is to move asap as this is not a situation that can be fixed. My heart goes out to you.

Wonder if we'll ever get any kind of salient point being made that doesn't involve a huge amount of speculation. 🤔

"Their children obviously had another home in their country if they arrived 4 months after their parents. They shouldn’t have brought them over until they could afford to house them. They’re not asylum seekers, sounds like economic migrants" @WinterWarmth

You seem pretty sure of this based on absolutely nothing. Do you know this family personally?

Why should the OP move? She didn't lie and shouldn't have to spend money moving because there are 4 children squashed into a 2 bed flat up upstairs with parents that can't control them and don't give a shit about the neighbours.

Has anyone come up with, maybe the landlord does know that there are 6 individuals in the flat? He’s not obliged to tell anyone as it’s his flat, even if it isn’t suitable (or legal).
OP could tell the LL and they say, I’ll sort it out but not sort it out.

My family got evicted in 2021 and were emergency housed for 12 weeks before moving into ‘short term’ accommodation which we still occupy 2 and a half years later. We had to go to the council as ‘At risk of homeless’.

Things aren’t always as they seem

Once, while living in another country where people commonly live in flats, I lived below a family with 4 children. It's not uncommon outside the UK., of course. However, they were all teens or pre-teens, and didn't run about. If they did, I would call up and they would quiet down. A little give and take... In this case, they have been arguing back for a year, which does sound very unreasonable.

I'm surprised no one seems to be considering this either. OP did say that the neighbour initially lied to get the flat but she has also said that the kids have been there for a year now. It's seem highly unlikely that the LL would be unaware at this point.

Not to mention LLs pull crap like this all the time. Sometimes what's convenient/beneficial matters more than what's legal to them.

No way should you have to leave! Report to landlord.

The children were only brought over from their homeland 4 months after the parents moved in? Seems they had some time to look for a larger place/one with no groundfloor neighbours? I suppose at least one of the parents is not working, since a few of the children stays home all day? Then it's irresponsible to not take the children for walks and time in the playground. Yes, go see the owner, and then go to the council.

My opinion is that you are being unreasonable, you have chosen to rent the ground floor flat. It comes with the territory. Be grateful you don't have drumb and bass djs in training above your head. You take your chance with your upstairs neighbours. I always rented top floor for this reason

With the housing crisis the way it is….

you’ve hit the nail on their head. I doubt they’ve chosen this, I imagine they’ve struggled to find anywhere to house them.

i understand your issue and they should be more receptive to your plight. But they have to live somewhere.

Report them to the landlord

I'm all for helping people and giving chances but not at the expense of sacrificing my own childs happiness and security by making them leave their own established home because other people lied.

They are U for having more kids they can properly look after, not parenting them properly so they run amok and lying.

however it doesn’t sound like they will do anything to make the noise situation go away so I suggest you move and not to a flat.

Yes, I’m sure they rented the flat just to wind you up, and Infact, people with noisy children should be banned from renting anything anywhere ever

Why should the OP move when she is the one with the legal tenancy? And why pass the problem onto someone else who will be entering a living hell?

I cannot believe people are going all bleeding heart about a family making someone’s life a misery. Constant noise that you can’t escape can drive people to suicide.

If this family were desperate - and decent - they would be doing their fucking best to be considerate neighbours, and not to risk formal complaints. It’s not possible to keep 4 children silent but it sounds like they are not considering the person living below them at ALL.

As for the immigrant angle - so much bigotry of low expectations. Can’t expect people from other countries/ cultures to be capable of following social norms re respecting other people??

YELL THRM IF THE KIDS ARENT REASONABLY WUIET YOULL TELL THE LANDLORD.
IF YOU THINK THEYLL MSKE IT WORSE JUST TELL THE LANDLORD

@WomensRightsRenegade can you really accuse others of being 'bleeding hearts' when you've immediately jumped to suicide in your first post?

I wonder how many posters feeling sorry for the family upstairs would feel the same if they were living underneath them. Noisy neighbours are a fucking nightmare and they should be doing all they can to keep the kids quiet although that's a pretty impossible task so they shouldn't be living in somewhere so inadequate.

Definitely tell the landlord op.

Yes totally agree with you well said 👍👍

It's not a police matter so if a council is telling you that, they're wrong!

YANBU.

The crowding per se isn't the problem. The problem is the parents don't give a shit about being neighbours from hell. When I was a child I was taught not to run indoors.

I feel sorry for both parties. In my early posts I pointed out the relevant legislation and what to do because IMO the OP needs to take action and deserves to live back in a home with relative peaceful enjoyment restored. This will take time.

However, subsequently there was a lot of add on narratives going in all sorts of directions which are off beam and lean towards prejudiced hate speech which I strongly don't agree with.

Police are not interested in noise nuisance. They will refer you to your local council environmental health department, every time.

Regards a PP suggesting withholding rent, this isn't a good idea. In a cost of living crisis, with people queuing to rent homes and even having bidding wars, anything to tempt your landlord to terminate your lease would be plain crazy.

100%

There is no part of noise nuisance that is a police matter - although it is a civil and criminal issue under the Environmental Protection Act 1990, Noise Nuisance, 'peaceful enjoyment' of one's home.

This is only ever enforced by the Local Authority Environmental Health Noise Team -or- a person can take their file their own action in a court of law supported by a solicitor and with plenty of evidence (guaranteed you will not find a solicitor prepared to take this particular case).

The council can come out and witness noise, they will ask you to keep a noise diary, they will want evidence by way of audio recordings and there's even an app they recommend.

Police can be appealed to get involved if something extreme is happening, if they've got nothing better to do. But usually they'll only attend if there's abnormal levels of noise at antisocial hours and the Noise Team have asked them to.

In this case, the landlord and the council noise team are by far the best bets. Police could say you're utilising them to harass the household because you don't like them.