To touch a strangers dog without permission then to be abusive when it barks

[WeHaveChocIcesInTheFreezer]

For context; we have a 4 year old female German Shepherd who is the softest, friendliest dog you can meet IF she knows you. She is not good with strangers, especially men, after some horrible experiences as a very young puppy. Typical of her breed she is loyal, loving and protective over us and our DC (6mo twins)- to note she is NEVER alone with or out of reach when around DC and has only ever been calm and affectionate towards them.

This morning I’m out walking her with a friend and have the twins in their pram, my friend pops into a shop so I’m stood outside with the pram in front of me and her sat calmly by my feet, next to the pram. Out of nowhere a young, quite big in build, man appears next to me and just lunges towards her and sticks his hand into her face. She instinctively sees this as a threat to her and us and immediately snaps at him/barks loudly. He backs off whilst quite angrily saying ‘not a friendly dog then eh?’.. so I said ‘actually she is but not with strangers and you should have asked before touching her!’ To which he raises his voice and starts saying ‘you shouldn’t have an effing dog on the streets if it isn’t effing friendly to strangers!’

At this point my friend comes out of the shop so this man storms off whilst shouting back more abuse about me being a ‘silly cow’ and having a ‘dangerous dog’..

Now I’m aware she’s a protective breed and can be intimidating to some, but I had a halter collar/lead on her and kept her by my feet/out of the way of people passing. She has zero issues around people as long as they don’t try touch her without warning. He PURPOSELY leaned across me to touch her with no warning!

AIBU to be annoyed at him? Or could I/should I have done more to avoid strangers touching her?

As even the most mild mannered dog with zero history of reactiveness could turn?

You need to assess the risk reasonably - you own a breed that is large and could do significant damage, it is a breed bred for its guarding instincts, and you have seen these instincts in action with reactiveness in the dog. Therefore common sense says it is a much higher risk than most dogs.

You are biased/blinkered to this because it is your dog, but really you should be responsible and muzzle him in busy public places.

Why do you think you shouldn't?

I always ask if I can stroke a dog first

Rage all you want but if any person, adult or child, puts their hand near a dog's mouth then they are at risk of being bitten. It's common sense and your job as a parent is to stop a child from doing it.

In fact, if a person shoved their hand in my face I think I'd be tempted to bite them too. Maybe I should wear a muzzle?

I wonder what his reaction would be if a stranger lunged at his face…

We had this when DS was in his pram… I’d popped into shop, DH outside with pram, and 2 yr old German Shepherd lolling on DHs feet as usual… a woman who lived by us but never spoke to us, marched straight up to the pram and stuck both hands in to pick DS up!!! Of course, the dog went nuts and she starts yelling about the Ddog being dangerous!!😡
Absolutely stupid thing to do, whatever the breed of dog, but especially with the ‘guarding’ breeds.
Its about 37 years ago, and I can still remember the awful noise outside when I was in the shop - I guessed what had happened.
Love, love, love German Shepherds, loved with them all my life, and known many others. My current one is gazing out of the window at seagulls at the moment.
I’ve only ever been bitten once by a dog… by a bloody ‘toy’ poodle!

And I'm guessing that you posting it means it's the first time this has happened? A big man suddenly shoving his hand at a dogs face is asking for trouble and he deserved it.

I'm not a dog owner but I have a walking group with folk who mostly are; collies, collie/lab mix etc.

Seeing the crap they put up with, it absolutely astounds me how ignorant people are around dogs. Also, the wildly different thresholds people have for telling you a dog's "out of control".

@Floatlikeafeather2

absolutely agree with you!! Why on earth to people feel they can just approach your dog and touch it without asking? Rude and idiotic!
I’m used to German Shepherds, but wouldn’t dream of just touching a strangers dog! Surely you chat to the owner first and they will tell you what they are like around people.
The idea that all dogs should be muzzled in public so strangers kids can do whatever to them is bizarre - I’ve met a few kids I’d love to muzzle if I’m honest!
I don’t touch your kids, so don’t touch my (on a lead, taking no notice of your kids) dog!

I did once go to stroke a dog without asking and it started barking at me.
It was when I didn't know a lot about dogs.
My then partner, who knew more about dogs, told me you should always ask cos you don't know.
Since then I've always asked and taken that on board.
Although I didn't go off on one and shout abuse or anything!

Completely his fault. I mean German Shepherds look potentially frightening so you don't stick your hand near it unless you are daft.

I've had children shrieking and chasing my small dog and trying to grab him. When I politely suggested to dad who was not paying attention to them at all that he may want to not let them do that as even the friendliest dog can snap I can told in no uncertain terms if anything happened he would blame my dog 100% for being dangerous. My dog is a shitzu cross and thankfully ignored his screaming, chasing, poking children but fuck me if anything had happened because his kids were being very annoying to my dog who was minding his own business he would have been down the police making complaint against my dangerous dog. Complete fuckin arse...clearing bring his kids up to be the same.

God forbid dog owners complain about horrible children though.

Billy Joel springs to mind... 'will it be a consolation when she's gone?'

I would not put the dog in a position where strangers can or might reach out to touch her - because it upsets her and because of her size/bree: if she is pushed too far and bites (or makes someone fear she might bite), she'll find herself on the wrong side of the law. That's not fair (on her) or right, but knowing the other guy was a dickhead will be no consolation.

In this scenario, it means not waiting by a shop door without a clear enough zone around you that you will spot anyone potentially getting close enough to touch long before they do.

(I have a similarly large and nervous dog myself so I do understand your frustration)

Didn't take long for this to descend into "kids are horrible and I'd like to muzzle them instead"

Honestly, I take back the muzzling thing - I don't think anyone should be allowed to have a pet capable of seriously injuring or killing a person, full stop.

Agree that people should ask. I have taught my kids that. I would say that if you can’t be sure that your dog won’t bite a stranger in public then it should be muzzled. A child or someone with learning difficulties for example might stroke the dog or go too close. No one should be at risk from being bitten.

I also have a German shepherd who reacts in exactly the same way when touched by strangers. He is a very striking looking dog and attracts a.lot of attention and I absolutely hate it when people get in his face without asking first. Unfortunately if he was to make contact, even if the reason was that he was letting them know he was uncomfortable, I would be at fault as the owner. For this reason he is muzzled when we go to very busy places

Batshit response from the father. As if the most pressing issue about the bitten child is who is to blame. Surely the primary concern would be for the child not to get hurt?

I’ve got young kids and they 100% always ask to touch w dog. They never ever touch a dog without asking, we go to lots of horse events where people being their dogs and they tell us that usually we’re the first to ask before touching. I think why? Why do people feel they can just go up and touch something? You wouldn’t go up to a random stranger and start touching them would you?

my mum did have a dog that was slightly reactive so then knew from a young age to do it. My mum would tell people to not touch her dog and when they were told they would go ‘oh it’s ok. Dogs love me!’ And then get concerned when he reacted 😂😂

But nobody can be sure if a dog won't bite. My 7 year old dog never shower aggressive behavious in her whole life, yet a few months ago she went for our new neighbours' dog. There was literally no warning sign and no precedent in the past for us to even think this would be a possibility. I haven't let he off the leash since.
Realistically, nobody can be absolutely certain that the dog won't bite, unless all dogs are muzzled.

Go what a twat! agree with past poster - inadequate man screaming crap at a woman in public - hit the nail on the head there!

You are correct, he was being a twunt.

I can still remember my aunt’s German Shepherd 40 years ago giving out a low growling sound as an old lady tried to pet my baby cousin in the pram while I was holding it waiting outside a shop. She backed off straight away, but admitted to my aunt when she came out that she shouldn’t have done it and the dog was doing a great job guarding the baby.

Your dog did nothing wrong. It was the idiot man's fault. My, extremely large boy, who I sadly lost recently, would not have hurt a soul and wanted to be friends with everyone. However, a stupid woman did insist on approaching him whilst he was sat calmly at my side outside a shop, even though I warned her he would jump up in excitement if she touched him. I then got a right mouthful of abuse off her when he jumped up in excitement, thinking cos she'd put her hands all over his head, she must want to play and he put his muddy paws all over her coat.

It was all him. Never touch a dog you don’t know- suspect he would not have done that if you had been a man. GSD are known to be protective & I suspect he was experimenting here to see what reaction he would get.

He was 100% in the wrong.

But the anti dog brigade will be along any minute to start bleating about muzzling all dogs I'm sure.

Usually the ones who let their children run feral & expect everyone else around them to put up & shut up.

@CosyKnits

if your reply was in reference to my comment about muzzling kids… it was a tongue- in -cheek remark, however, I can honestly say I’m positive my life is more disrupted by other peoples kids, than my Ddogs ever disprupt my neighbours or anyone else’s life.

The man was a knob, but-
If a stranger comes up to your dog on the street and your dog attacks them, causing injuries, you will be the one prosecuted, not the person who was attacked.
If you know your dog will snap at strangers, either get some proper training for them or muzzle them in public - preferably both.

Get her a neon jacket/lead with a please don't touch message. It won't work all the time but it does help and if someone does go in for a stroke and gets barked at you will have warned them in advance.
I've had dogs all my life and worked with them and I probably wouldn't take a dog that isn't keen on strangers to a shop/cafe area even under close supervision as you never can predict what the general public will do. It's just not worth the fallout if, god forbid, your dog does take real offence one day and nip/bite someone. Don't worry about this guy, he pushed his luck and got told off. Forget about it. I hope your day out wasn't ruined!