To wonder if this is just what secondary school is like?

[Notmyusual80]

DD is 14, in year 9. She loved primary - always wanted to go in, got excited about the simplest activities/events and got involved with everything.

Now I know secondary is very, very different - more pressure (especially as she goes to a grammar), more independence expected of them etc. But I just feel like her school is slowly grinding her down.

The emphasis is on tests and perfect uniform. If someone misbehaves, they all get shouted at, all the time. In fact it feels like their approach is to assume they’re all badly behaved (even though she’s clearly not) and are hard on them all just in case, iyswim. She hasn’t bonded with any of her teachers and some of them just seem really harsh disciplinarians. She also finds a lot of the lessons uninspiring.

She’s successfully put herself forward for several roles (think school council etc) and then….nothing…there have been no activities associated with the roles she’s supposed to be doing. They’re just titles.

And so far, she’s been on two trips since year 7. That’s it. I know they need to focus on work/study but would a little fun here and there hurt? My secondary years were great fun and I still managed to do well.

She’s just not enjoying school now and doesn’t look forward to going in.

I feel like she started off an eager, proactive, enthusiastic student and they’ve totally knocked this out of her.

Is this just what secondary is like now? And if not, what can I do? There are no opportunities to give this kind of feedback and even if I did, how can I get this across without it sounding like “DD is not enjoying school and finds it boring” which is how it’s going to sound isn’t it?

Remember that many of the expectations come from Ofsted. The data on absolutely everything, the relentless pressure to provide evidence, can suck the joy out of school life.

School trips are a minefield of risk assessments and organisation.

This school sounds particularly joyless though and I’d look elsewhere before GCSE options time.

I think it's quite sad. School seems to cater for the worst behaving kids and I can understand that to an extent . My DC aren't badly behaving and I feel the strictness has crushed their spirit to a certain extent. Primary school in the UK is done well but secondary less so. My ds said to me "I used to love learning at primary school, now I hate it"

I suspect it wouldn’t be better elsewhere. Mine is yr 13 at a grammar. Obviously Covid impacted her but it’s mostly academic not room for extras.
Have you thought about Rangers (older girlguides)
I’m a guide leader with a full unit of 36 girls. We really try and offer a full range of activities and experiences and the girls love it and blossom. We do a mix of fun stuff and skills plus lots of trips and holidays.

When I read your OP I thought that it sounded like an unhappy school - with staff who are not enjoying their jobs and so are irritable and not bothering with any extras like trips.

Then I read your update about high staff turnover.

I’d definitely be looking at leaving. All schools will have their issues but not all will be unhappy places.

What are her plans year 12.
In our area the grammar is only sixth form in town so even if you moved for 2 years you’d be back yr 12 assuming she wants to do A levels.
Will things get better with options for gcse? Teachers my dc spoke more about seemed to be from smaller class subjects eg classics. Worth asking re class sizes yr 10 and 11 maybe and choose strategically do pick Latin with 15 not Spanish with 32 in class.

This was certainly what my secondary school was like. I feel really bad for your DD. I think the options are quite black and white though - you either suck it up or you move schools. My school tried to force/bully out those that were 'underperforming' (ie. only getting 75%!) or didn't fit the mould. It's actually excellent training if you want to work somewhere like the Big Four, but no good if you're in any way a little bit different, an independent thinker or fail to have skin as thick as a rhino.

Where in London do you have grammars?

@StrawberriesSW1 in greater London there are lots I think. We live on the London/Surrey border and there are plenty around here. Tiffin in Surbiton. Nonsuch in Cheam. Wilsons (Worcester Park? Not sure). Wallington in Croydon. Then all the grammars in Sutton.

Lots of schools at secondary level are going in this direction. There are some better ones out there though, so I'd consider moving her.

Latymer is very relaxed for example

Agreed 100%… same with my daughter who has always been eager and enthusiastic learner… they just honestly knock the stuffing out of them… also I find they don’t really reach the individual child to their strengths unless of course you’re musical or apart in which they love you because you “market” the school..,

I meant sporty… typo…

Your DD sounds like me. First two years happy to go and eager to learn. Then they just crush your love of learning. That's the saddest part about high school for me and the reason why people leave education and are happy to not learn anything new for a very long time. Learning should be a joy. It should inspire creative thinking and prepare young people for the evolving world. The current system doesn't do that for most. It's become a system focused on attendance and exam results, which mainly benefit the school itself so that the cycle can continue.

Can't speak fof the whole of London but in my area kids go to Latymer, QE Boys, Henrietta Barnet or the semi selectives like DAO.

Exactly the school I was thinking of.

Hi OP, sorry, didn't mean to stress you out!

Go and look at the other school. Tell DD it's not committing to anything to go and look (it isn't).

Re uninterested staff and high turn over. No-one who hasn't worked in a school in England can understand the pressure teachers and staff are under. From poor behaviour and exam results and ofsted. Plus poor pay for a profession. I'm out 14 years and so glad!!! I do think education shouldn't be like this but I mostly blame the government. I hope you find the right school environment for your child.

This is our experience too. My son started year 7 full of enthusiasm and the boring sedentary day and strict teachers have just crushed the life out of him.

Our Education system is ruining childhood in so many ways

Op I feel your pain, my ds was top of his class in primary, hardworking, had a few really nice friends, took part in school. Secondary went well in 1st year, he just worked on made friends etc, this year he’s doing the ‘I can’t believe it’s Monday tomorrow’ thing, quiet going in on a Monday, quiet during the week, a lot of sighing, in working in office until late then comes out saying’guess I’m going to bed now,’ and he’s now said once or twice he can’t believe he has 3 or 4 years of this. We’ve had chats and told him to take his foot off the pedal, tried to get him to play board games or even to go gaming instead of doing every bit of homework but it’s like he’s a bit broken. He said his friends don’t do the same amount of work. Worst thing is the teachers are saying well done etc

DC is in year 8 at a state comprehensive and it's not like this at all. They have been on many school trips. There is a big one at the end of Year 7 and they went to Windsor Legoland. I remember there was a field trip for Geography. They went to the panto in a large local theatre last year. There were discos, concerts, musicals. There is a lot of work but DC likes most of her teachers.

My only problem is that there are a lot of substitute teachers. There is a staffing issue but I believe it's a nationwide problem. (Blaming the government, not the school).

For what it’s work our local high school is like this. My daughter is ur 9 also and always enjoyed school and done well. Now it’s onstant tests and assessments, some teachers are great and super involved (my daughter chose her subjects based on a combination of teaching style and subject matter) bit for the most part they don’t want to be there and are teaching to pass the next assessment. She’s always been a very hardworking kid and one day she lost her book (it had slid down the back of her desk drawer) and she had a full blown panic attack because she knew she’d be torn off a strip in front of the class for it. On another occasion she was yelled at by a teacher for not doing her home work (which she had set on a day my daughter was absent and had been given a weeks notice to give her the work in advance). I emailed about that incident as it was not my daughters fault but got no apology. I understand teaching is a hard profession right now and the government want constant tangible results which is why they are tested to kingdom come but there’s no joy in going to school for her anymore. No trips at ours either unless you’re one of the fortunate lot who get one of the 40 spots on the annnual ski trip which costs an arm and a leg. It’s so sad for them.

This sounds very familiar. I think behaviour and parental support have become so poor over the past decade or so that schools simply have to go in so hard and in a very joyless manner to get behaviour and standards under control. Effectively it's catering for the worst which leaves nice kids who don't need to be scared to death in a horrible position. My eldest was just broken when he went. He is improved now a few years later, but there is so much wrong with the system. Massive schools, no money and poor resources have really spoilt so much education. I'm a teacher so have seen it from.both sides. I just don't know what we are doing to our children.

Especially as she goes to a grammar? ?

Wonder where the pressure is coming from?

My ds loved primary school. He started year 7 full of enthusiasm and excited. Teachers were incredibly strict from the very start. I know why they do it...they have hundreds of kids and some will behave appallingly but I believe it turned my enthusiastic, eager child into a miserable one. He is 15 now and hates school. He behaves himself because he just wants to get through the day. He had a little meltdown at the end of the school holidays recently, said he hated just having to sit still and keep quiet for hours. It's probably a really unnatural way for teens to be.

Sounds like all the school is interested in is ticking boxes and getting exam results that make them look like a good school