I have quite strong views on prostitution

[Tonight1]

Not at all about the women, just that I would not want to date a habitual user! Or punter as they're called. And yes this came up recently.

This is discussion about how you would feel about it?

AIBU - wouldn't mind
YANBU - would mind

I escorted in my early twenties. I was happy to have sex for money and saw it as a transaction. My body was being used for sex but I never felt used. Did the deed, took the money and left.

@TrishIsMySpiritAnimal "Women generally have unlimited access to sex if they wish to have it,"
So would men if they didn't want to only have it with beautiful women under 25....

Exactly!

In the same breath this ‘women have unlimited access to sex’ shows that the only valid women are the young gorgeous ones. Pretty sure my overweight 70yo neighbour isn’t at it like rabbits with any man.

There is a website called UKPunting.com, where men rate the prostitutes.

Most of them just see the women as a variety of orifices and a paid for service that they can expect good service like rating a restaurant, or a product.

The men are not shy about their kinks and misogyny. The language and comments are utterly crude and vile. I’m female and older and I was shocked at how degenerate it was.

I got to it when I got into a rabbit hole when I was reading about a niche porn site that coerced young college girls (in the US) into porn. It ended up as a criminal case and the main perpetrators went on the run from US justice.

I would never date a man who had used sex workers. I understand why the women do it (money) but I don’t get why (WHY?) anyone would pay for sex.

You JUST PAID her. She DOESNT WANT to fuck you! What could be less sexy than having to pay someone so that they consent to sex?? It’s so fucked up!

You did slightly contradict yourself there...so you knew you were being used for sex. But at the same time didn't feel used after having said you were being used. So you did feel used but didn't care.

Glad you didn't come to any harm however.

@Tonight1 not contradicting myself at all. I was being paid for sex so in that sense I was being used but the men didn't make me feel like that.

It wasn't a bad experience to be honest. I did it purely for the money.

I'm fully aware it's very different for the majority of women.

@TrishIsMySpiritAnimal @Tonight1

You both raised the same point, so I'm combining answers.

I think people in here are assuming no woman in prostitution is ever consenting to sex.

Why is that secretary sleeping with her boss for a promotion, or that actress hoping to get her first big break by sleeping with the producer (uncoerced!), or the sugar daddy idea, any different than consensual prostitution? It is sex for money, or gifts, a job, or a favour. With prostitution, rather than going to your boss, say, you're letting your clients come to you.

People in here always seem to take the extreme. Every prostitute has a pimp and is coerced. Every porn star is smuggled in from (say) Eastern Europe and drugged/forced into it. OnlyFans girls women are naive and talked into it by pervy men... While that me (often?) be true, there are/will be a large number of women who are models who realise men will pay money to see them... or OnlyFans women who realise men will pay lots of money to see them with fewer clothes... or prostitutes (low and high-end), who realise men will pay thousands for sex.

I'm not arguing for prostitution, I actually think it's really wrong... but definitely don't think every woman has gone into it naively. For many, it is a consensual, conscious choice

I'd say it's more fertile aged women who have the unlimited access to sex.

Women just aren't important in your world view.

Why is that secretary sleeping with her boss for a promotion, or that actress hoping to get her first big break by sleeping with the producer (uncoerced!), or the sugar daddy idea, any different than consensual prostitution? It is sex for money, or gifts, a job, or a favour. With prostitution, rather than going to your boss, say, you're letting your clients come to you.

In all of those cases, the MEN are in the wrong. Powerless women sleeping with powerful men, having sex they don't want, involves a man fucking an unwilling woman. A woman he knows doesn't actually want to have sex with him.

I always wonder if one of the reasons women don't create a market for male sex workers who have sex with women (this is an almost non-existent market) is because women think about having sex with a man who finds them unattractive, doesn't want to be there, is doing it under sufferance, and is about as turned off as they have ever been. The thought of having sex that is unwanted by the other person is vile. But prostitution, and a vast section of porn, is based on unwilling and unhappy women. It's actually a turn on for many men.

Why don't men see the woman having a good time and enjoying it, wanting them, as an essential part of sex? How can they look at themselves in a mirror when they've just fucked an unwilling woman.

And everyone lying to themselves about most women being OK and most men caring, it's a lie. I've been friends with, worked with, known loads of sex workers. Seen one go out, face all puffy form crying, immediately managed to find a punter. She's dead now, overdose. I saw her sister just afterwards. I'm sure the happy hooker arseholes would be find with that pain as well. Much more typical of sex work than joyful PHD students who just love sex for money with unattractive men, because it's their kink. My eyes can't physically roll back far enough.

It’s honest do unbelievable simple - they aren’t consenting to sex. They’re consenting to sex in exchange for money. Otherwise they’d just have sex with the man. That’s coercion.

Young and attractive you mean.

So when someone had the power toots of sex their peers dont deserve the basic treatment of being treated like a human and not raped?

Is paying a 90 year old woman for sex rape then?

EXACTLY @MrsTerryPratchett - powerful scumbags coercing powerless women. And people like @C1N1C spmehow making out they’re equals

So on that note here’s an alternative viewpoint @C1N1C if you’re saying these powerless women are in fact consenting and have power. What about the 18yo adult living with her stepdad putting up with daily sexual harassment because she knows if she doesnt he will deceive her mum and kick you out onto the streets? That’s a woman using her sexuality a weapon to get her way isn’t it?

I ask for personal reasons. I always thought it was fairly despicable a stepdad would do that and never occurred to me to think the 18yo was in fact playing a part somehow.
What’s the difference? Go on, tell me. I beg you

@C1N1C I honestly do not care about the poor menz who can’t scratch their itch, as you put it.

Women are worth more than men’s itches.

I’m honestly quite taken aback that you are asking women to provide solutions (in bold text, no less) to a male problem which causes untold suffering to women and girls.

I mean, wtf? They need to sort themselves out.

No, it's work. Work means that you agree to do some form of labour you otherwise probably wouldn't do in exchange for an agreed amount of money; I don't do my job out of altruism, and I suspect very few people do regardless of what that job is.

There will be people here who do jobs I wouldn't choose, but I don't claim that they're not able to decide to do them. I don't expect anybody would want to pay me for a shag, but if they did and I decided to take their money I am not going to be told by some random who's appointed themselves the sex police I'm not allowed to choose who I fuck and why.

Rape, kidnap, pimping and exploitation are illegal. Prostitution is not, because who adults fuck and why is nobody else's fucking business.

Saying ‘it’s just work’ like any other job is so fucking diminishing to women’s bodies.

A job shouldn’t involve the danger of rape and sexual assault. If it was then unions would be all over it.

A job shouldn’t involve having to give up your physical agency to someone who can overpower you.

You can fuck whoever you like - but let’s not pretend that ‘sex work’ isn’t coercion into sex through the medium of money.

The ‘adults choosing to fuck’ are often trafficked or in that position because they have no option for various reasons. How totally finishing of the many victims, and of women’s bodies to treat them like they’re transactional.

This woke agenda is so unbelievably anti-women I’m genuinely embarrassed for whoever buys into it

Exactly

This thread shows people for who they really are - women’s bodies are no different to money or a chocolate bar you can buy in a shop.

Fucking grim

woMeN CAn fUCk WhOEvEr tHEy LiKe

Yeah - except they aren’t are they Einstein - they’re fucking people they wouldn’t normally fuck because they’re being paid.

@C1N1C and other hate women. Men’s ‘itches’ matter more than women’s bodies. To @XenoBitch men’s wallets matter more.

Its terrifying

Prostitution is wrong and inexcusable. Fertile aged women, at least, have limitless access to sex in most cases. Both can be true.

"who adults fuck and why is nobody else's fucking business."

Up to a point, Lord Copper.

I also think the ‘sex work positive’ people who bleat on about ‘women can say no to anyone they like and choose their clients’ are deluded if they think this makes their ‘job’ less dangerous.

A man who lays woman for sex is always and forever, treating a woman as an object rather than the human she is. That poses a potential risk for EVERY ‘client’. She may well think she’s ‘chosen’ a safe man who won’t harm her - but unless a bodyguard watches over their sex how do you know until it’s too late that he won’t pull the condom off, rape her, go too far etc? You do t

There is something so dehumanising about this phrasing 'fertile aged women have limitless access to sex'. It gives me the shudders. It's the way incels and misogynists talk about women.

It's also such an irrelevant point. If women don't want to have sex with some men, it's not up to women to make that right for those men. It's not a resource that women are hoarding and refusing to share out fairly. I know a lot of men view it that way, but it's a grotesque viewpoint. And that doesn't become less true if some of the men who can't find a woman to consensually sleep with them are disabled. They still aren't entitled to use women's bodies.

I also hate the 'I do my job for money, what's the difference' argument - I have done some shitty jobs, but none that put me at hugely increased risk of rape and assault. No one wants their own mother, sister, wife, daughter or any woman they care about to become a prostitute. It's always for 'other women'.

It's not a resource that women are hoarding and refusing to share out fairly.

THIS!!

Someone upthread even used the term ‘unfair’. But as another PP pointed out - if a man can’t get sex or even a date he’s doing something VERY wrong and it’s probably to do with coming across to women like a POS who should be avoided at all costs. On the school run, in the supermarket and in public in general about 85% of men with their female OH have a face like a dropped pie. Lots of married men have the personality of a wet mop. Ugly men clearly are getting laid left right and centre - if you’re ugly/attractive/boring AND not getting sex it’s because you have something wrong with YOU and it’s certainly not up to sexually active women to solve that problem for you.

I wonder if these poor menz not getting laid have actually, I dunno, tried having a conversation, or tried to be nice or charming, or just make an effort not to be creepy weirdos? Doubt it.

Also on the 'limitless access to sex' point - good sex? Or hair-pulling, spitting, choking, anal, rough sex emulating revolting and abusive pornography? Women might find it easy to find a man willing to have sex with them, not so easy to find one who's offering something enjoyable. Read the threads of women doing OLD and the endless dick pics they endure, the relentless unwelcome sex talk. Read a newspaper today and see that a third of women experience sexual harassment commuting home from work - just getting on the tube at 6pm and getting upskirted or touched inappropriately.

Maybe if men didn't create such a hostile sexual environment for women then they'd find more enthusiastic partners. But that would involve changing men's behaviour, and apparently we should just carry on exploiting and degrading women to 'scratch their itch' instead, right @C1N1C ?