Rwanda plan

[AdamRyan]

Was just reading Suella Bravermans thoughts on how to make the Rwanda plan work, which involve sending staff there to review claims and pulling out of all human rights and refugee conventions.

The plan has cost £140m to Rwanda so far, plus £££££ in legal fees and so far we've sent no-one and found out its illegal. I'm very baffled as to why the government are pursuing it, I keep hearing that "most people" support it. So I thought I'd ask:

IABU: It's a priority as it will deter immigration and the government should spend whatever money and time it takes to deliver this

IANBU: The government should focus time/money on other priorities instead.

I think many doctors come to this country and work for the NHS. So maybe this young man didn’t wish to apply or wasn’t qualified to work for some reason? We have doctors from all over the world so something went wrong here.

@Zonder I’m just using terms in common usage. It’s another way of describing people who don’t have visas. They are mostly refugees but some won’t be. The worst scandal is that we have 130,000 awaiting for their claims to be assessed. It’s extraordinarily slow and we need to speed this up.

Some more deals could be done, for sure.

But not possible for dangerous countries and then we get back to the point of sending to Rwanda (forever) vulnerable and genuine migrants.

We need to address the underlying causes and that means better crime prevention and helping countries hosting migrants, its quite unbelievable we have cut aid for refuge camps, over 60% for Syrian camps, 80% for Rohingya and hosting countries, UK foreign aid now spent to look after after migrants here in the UK.

Vast majority of people don't want to leave their local area, so why not try and make these places better for them?

Some more deals could be done, for sure.

Can you give an example of what you mean?

My point on the Albania deal is it reduces the likelihood of making a claim so low it’s interrupted traffickers ability to sell. If pp want the same reduction with other countries they need to reduce likelihood in same way.

I’m not sure they want claims to be that unlikely. Although it does show what works pretty clearly. Whether they are arguing for it to be applied elsewhere maybe not.

On improving countries I think realistically we’ll see other methods eg Italy using Albania, US change election another factor

Yes, the fraudulent, inhumane traffickers are totally going to inform their passengers of all the situations where they’re going! Including the minute loopholes of the law! Just out of the kindness of their hearts. I despair.

The Italian Albania deal is for processing, its not to keep them in Albania, different that the UK/Rwanda one, its not addressing the root causes or improving living conditions.

The US border issues are bleak.

UK and others can have returns agreements with other safer countries, why not, hardly rocket science, are we even trying?

Which countries do you mean?

Top countries for arrivals are Afghanistan, Iran, Albania, India and Iraq

You could send back people as for Albania and you’d get the same result. Where would you choose?

@EasternStandard I agree I think the Albania situation is fairly unique.

Just a reminder that 75% of initial decisions in asylum claims made in the year to September 2023 have been grants of protection

Yes so how do you envisage a deal such as the Albania deal working?

From your pp

The UK now has an agreement with Albania, and surprise surprise, the number of Albanians arriving via irregular means has been vastly reduced.

If this is what you are after who are you sending back?

Which out of those top arrivals

Where have I stated my opinion on the deal with Albania?

This is your post isn’t it?

Yes

again where do I state my opinion on the deal?

In that post 😂

If now don’t think it’s possible to do Albania deals for other countries just say. It’s ok to get stuff wrong

That is a fact not an opinion

https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/briefings/people-crossing-the-english-channel-in-small-boats/

There was a sharp rise in Albanian nationals crossing the Channel in 2022, which drove much of the overall increase in arrivals that year (Figure 5). Over 12,000 arrived in small boats that year, compared to only 800 making the trip a year earlier. This sudden increase was the source of political controversy, leading the UK Government to respond with a pledge to fast-track the removal of unauthorised Albanian arrivals and cooperate with the Albanian government on enforcement activity. In the winter of 2022-3 the number of Albanians crossing in small boats dramatically declined (Figure 5), with only 28 making the crossing in the first quarter of 2023, compared to 235 the year before. It is difficult to know how much of the decline results from policy vs. other factors, or whether the number of Albanians will increase again in future.

Yes it works when you return people to their country of origin.

Traffickers cannot sell the same anymore

Are you arguing for more similar deals or not?

So where have I stated my opinion on the deal? And what is my opinion according to you?

If you answer my direction question all will become clear I’m sure

Are you arguing for more similar deals or not?

As I haven't argued for any deal, I will hardly argue for more similar deals

I will continue to argue against the Rwanda plan.

I am still not clear what you think I have said but I will leave it at that.

Yes for the best I’m sure I’m guessing you’ll not go on about deals and this surprise surprise the number of Albanians arriving via irregular means has been vastly reduced again

I ve already said we can't send back to war torn or places like Afghanistan or Iraq but India? really? a country we are trying to negotiate a FTA with, where the PM's wife resides (in terms of citizenship) & where we have v generous student and work visa schemes.

Afghans shouldn't be crossing the channel in the numbers they are, the UKs resettlement scheme isn't working, we are refusing Afghans who fought for the UK, how utterly repugnant.

Rwanda isn't a returns agreement, its not a deterrent or a processing deal, such as Italy/Albania but it is a gimmick.

I googled top arrivals and that was first response, people can get India numbers I haven’t checked

I didn’t expect it on the list, but no strong feelings on doing a deal similar to Albania

Maybe one to discuss

Support workers have apologised after misnaming the person who died on board the Bibby Stockholm barge.

The immigration lawyer Jacqueline McKenzie initially named the man as Mickael Essouma, a doctor from Cameroon.

However, the Cameroon Embassy later confirmed that Essouma was alive and was not the person involved in the alleged suicide.

His identity doesn't really matter.

He tried to get help. He was ignored.

More details here:

Heather Joans, a member of the Portland Global Friendship group which supports people living on the barge, also issued an apology after the group named Essouma as having passed away.

She said: “I want to apologise to everyone.

“The asylum seeker I named in my previous post was not the individual who sadly died.

“I had been informed by many of the asylum seekers that he had been screaming for help, and that they were sure it was him (it’s now emerged he actually moved rooms).

https://www.thenational.scot/news/23986298.doctor-cameroon-named-man-died-bibby-stockholm-barge/